silver kiseru with very high quality kozuka panels

[Tonkotsu]

Here is a silver kiseru with a very high quality kozuka panel on each side. The panels are shakudo, silver, copper and gold. All work is in relief on a very fine nanakoji surface. The Kozuka panels are Edo made into a kiseru during the Meiji period possibly for the tourist trade.

Dick

[Babu]

They are nice. If you sell I collect kiseru so let me know.😊

I have a couple of kozuka that have panel rather than being one piece so to speak.

One is a sort of Soten so I think your bottom image is Soten but the top is another school Mito. Perhaps.

I like the first the best.

The panels are glued using resin glue and are quite easy to remove but not in a non destructive way to the kiseru.

[Surfson]

I would be interested in it too Dick.  I don't collect kiseru but do plan to start smoking pot again when I retire and begin to act like an adolescent again!  

[b.hennick]

Brian Tschernaga could turn those into fine kozuka. 

[Kurikata]

Amateurish comments : Why remove those panels from the silver Kiseru. It's a piece of Japanese history and it shows  how tosogushi adapted their business to a "new" economy...

[Babu]

4 hours ago, Kurikata said:

Amateurish comments : Why remove those panels from the silver Kiseru. It's a piece of Japanese history and it shows  how tosogushi adapted their business to a "new" economy...

I don't think I was suggesting that he did I was merely telling him how they are constructed.

However Barry is correct they would make nice kozuka.

If you cannot say something constructive sir perhaps say nothing?

[DirkO]

Being on a kiseru doesn't stop them from getting papers. I've seen kiseru with NBTHK papers. However, if they aren't original to the piece, it's maybe better to try and remove them with as little as damage possible.

[Tanto54]

3 hours ago, Babu said:

If you cannot say something constructive sir perhaps say nothing?

 

Are you really that self-unaware?

[Brian]

Leave it as is. Silly to do anything at all to it.
And Adam..once again you should post less and stop commenting on things non-Nihonto. That personal addition was not necessary and Bruno's comment was correct.
Just STFU for a little bit. No reply...no comment. Just post the essentials as far as your deals go, and that's it.

[Babu]

Are you then suggesting he could not have phrased it better Brian? 

 

19 minutes ago, Tanto54 said:

 

Are you really that self-unaware?

I've had about fourty PMs from members asking if I had killed your dog George. Isn't that interesting.

[Brian]

Please ask those 40 guys to message me in your favour, because so far my pm's are overwhelmingly in favour of me ending your account.
it is inevitable Adam. Not personal..I know you think it is. You just are too much for a forum that favours quiet and restful. Promise you...it isn't personal. I would sit down and buy you a beer and chat anyday. But you just aren't a forum guy.

[Babu]

On that Brian I totally agree and have said it many times I'm not suited to the herd attitude of forums with established guru members who know it all.

Soon people...I'll be gone soon. I'm just tidying up loose ends.

You can then spend your days agreeing with each other and patting yourselves in the back.

However the PM comment was true George has built his own reputation on here and his attitude has worked against him as much as mine has against me.

It's only a friggin Goose vs bat conversation FFS.

[Shugyosha]

C’mon Adam, you describe yourself as logical and free thinking and going against the herd when all you do is invent some bullsh!t and dogmatically defend it to the death.

 

At least the so called “gurus” on here attempt to back up their arguments from verified sources with a view to resolving a question that has been posed. You’ve bleated about people’s unwillingness to study, well it’s actually because they have studied that enables them to construct a logical argument or hypothesis. You can’t because you haven’t, but you expect your view to be given equal credence to theirs. Then you start throwing your physical size into the argument as though the threat of physical violence would make your view correct. 
 

As George says your lack of self awareness is truly staggering. Spend some time reflecting on what you say and do - ideally before you say or do it. It will make you a better person. 

[Babu]

12 minutes ago, Shugyosha said:

C’mon Adam, you describe yourself as logical and free thinking and going against the herd when all you do is invent some bullsh!t and dogmatically defend it to the death.

What prey have I invented in this thread that could even remotly justify such an off the topic responce? 

People are weird. 

[Brian]

Guys....I've said this before and let me repeat it. This is all just pixels on a pc screen. In the grand scheme of things, there are worse things.
Let's just back down a bit...agree to disagree and admit that in real life we may just all get along better. Just wish the other person well, and let everyone go their own way. No hard done.

[Babu]

I'm sorry but on this occasion I'm unsure exactly what I've done to piss off so many people.

It helps to know where I err.

 

You know I'm pretty certain that if we all sat around a table with a beer and a packet of pork scratchings we would get along famously .

I think the typed word removes context and inflection from a statement and causes more misunderstanding than you would believe.

I cannot change how a person might read into a statement to interpret it in the way they choose. It still may not have been the way it was intended though . It's that subjective view we all have. 

[Surfson]

Hi Adam.  I have enjoyed your posts and you post pictures of a lot of your things, which are really quite nice.  I hope that you stick around.  I have tried to avoid the "fray" which often emerges in these threads, other than offering a jibe or two in a humorous way if possible.  In your recent post, you seem to be asking for some feedback as to what you might change to improve the situation.  The majority of NMB people never or rarely get into these conflicts.  There is a small number that gets into more than their fair share of arguments that get personal, sometimes rather quickly.  

 

I have not done a proper study of the posts that lead up to these fracases, either yours or generally; I will leave that to a retired psychiatrist.  However, I have observed that there are a few traits found in posts that can reliably induce conflict.  You might ask yourself if any of these apply to you.  

 

1.  Making definitive statements about either a topic that is uncertain or an area that the poster does not know well.

2.  Being argumentative and arguing small points that are either not important or are completely inconsequential.

3.  Being overly critical about items that NMB members have decided to share (not only can this one hurt the victim, but it can also be expensive).

4.  Getting defensive when others disagree or criticize. 

5.  Assuming a superior attitude or prescriptive judgement on what is good and what is not.

 

These are just some of the common posts that might trigger a conflagration.  Items 1 and 2 are mostly irritating, but items 3-5 can often be taken personally.  Many of us do one or another of these on the odd occasion but there have been only a few people, including the dearly departed Ray, who do these things with regularity.  Once that happens, the patience of the others wears thin and the responses to even a single transgression can be swift.  I hope you find this useful, as it is intended to be constructive.  

Cheers, Bob

[Babu]

Bob, your sage council is very much welcome and is the voice of reason in an unreasonable world. 

I have already said I feel all of us would get on well in real life and even if we disagreed it would be good naturely disagreements. 

The written word though is another matter. 

Thank you 

 

 

 

[Barrie B]

Dick,

 

Wow..! That  Kiseru is gorgeous... High quality and definitely a keeper. Well done.

 

Barrie.

 

 

[Curran]

That is really a great pipe.

 

The only thing I have collected longer than tosogu has been Dunhill and Peterson silver banded pipes.

Richard's pipe is a great intersect of my main interests.

 

 

[Bernard]

I made some new photos of my two silver kiseru for this thread. My favourite is the one carved with waves. It is signed Omori saku.

Bernard D

[Rodenbacher]

Bruno/ Kurikata has mentioned a very interesting point: it is of high interest how Tosogu Artists adopted to other articles like pipes, walking sticks, cigarette boxes, and so on in the Meiji-era. 

 

We all stick very much to Tosogu but the artists worked in a complex of different arts, adopted a lot from painters, lacquer artists, Netsuke makers - it would be very interesting to know more about these relations. 

 

Can anybody recommend a good book about this topic? 

[Babu]

I understand things went full circle and the early lacquer artists who went into tosogu went back to lacquring and also pipes and tobacco pouches.etc

 

Artists I've known to have done this are Masachika of the Bushu school and ever Tsuchiya yasuchika.

I've seen glorious lacquering by both.

 

[Kurikata]

6 hours ago, Rodenbacher said:

Bruno/ Kurikata has mentioned a very interesting point: it is of high interest how Tosogu Artists adopted to other articles like pipes, walking sticks, cigarette boxes, and so on in the Meiji-era. 

 

We all stick very much to Tosogu but the artists worked in a complex of different arts, adopted a lot from painters, lacquer artists, Netsuke makers - it would be very interesting to know more about these relations. 

 

Can anybody recommend a good book about this topic? 

Peter , several books (unfortunately in french) on my shelves are dealing with that topic. More or less it is about Japonism. Japanese artists, end of 19th century tempted to reinvent a market in adapting their skills to new buyers / markets. As an exemple Kobayashi Shunko has skills in metals , ceramics, cloisonné, enamels and mixed techniques to make  Okimono for tourists.  Seke Eisuke was mixing wood (bamboo) and metals to make flower vase. Those are some exemples of a multitude of artists trying to survive from old times to new ones. 

 

[Tonkotsu]

Bernard,

Those are beautiful pipes. I also like the piece with the waves best. Here is an example of a tobacco pouch. This is Edo.

[Tonkotsu]

The pouch is 6 1/2" wide (165mm)

[Rodenbacher]

Thank you, Bruno. The "Japonisme" - book is also available in English. I will buy that! 

 

The tobacco pouch is really amazing, Tonkotsu! 

[Ian B3HR2UH]

These are fantastic Dick . I particularly like that first kozuka panel, it is outstanding . Do you have other treasures like this to show us ? 

Ian Brooks

[Curran]

51 minutes ago, Rodenbacher said:

Thank you, Bruno. The "Japonisme" - book is also available in English. I will buy that!

 

It is a good book. I have a copy.

 

[Tanto54]

Dick, that tobacco pouch is nice!  Raijin & Fujin (Thunder and Wind Gods) fixing their equipment - Awesome and very unusual motif.