A not commercially desirable sword

[george trotter]

May I, as a deplorable, make a comment on this attitudinal problem that has arisen here?

Can I say I do remember another member some years ago who was inclined to disparage members who were "not up to (his) standard". If the member was capable of responding in a reasoned, logical and factually accurate way, then watch out...it was never long before the lesser person received "demands" that he/she justify his/her statements by quoting the source/research/text book etc.

When this was done, he would receive a sneeringly nasty response that "you only have that book because you like the gilt writing on the spine" or some such retort. The point was that deep down, the "enlightened' had a personal defect, and that is that "only his view will be tolerated".

Well, that (quite affluent globe trotting Tokyo visiting buyer of high-end masterpieces) also received a respectful request to "desist". It has been much quieter since then, but it does appear from time to time.

 

The point is that this is a FORUM...ideas are shared, not imposed.

I started out collecting all types of nihonto, koto, shinto, shinshinto and gendaito...I dare say I had some that the elitist could not afford, but so what! I did not buy to impress others, I bought to please my own interests - to enjoy them. In the end I focussed down on gendaito...the reason? Well IMHO since 1600 swords have been made as ornaments and 'bling' for a priveleged class of Japanese. I decided that the only class of sword that was made EXPRESSLY for fighting on the battlefield since 1600 was the gendaito...so, for me, unless it was made 1876-1945 it is "un-inspiring"...in other words, to me, if it was made 1600-1876 it is "bling".

Having said this may I say three more things...

1. I don't care if anyone agrees/disagrees.

2. I respect both responses I may get, approval/disapproval.

3. I.m not going to change.

So, collect what you like, buy what you like, discuss what you like.

FWIW I am university educated in history and the arts, I speak Japanese and curated an arms collection which included Japanese swords for 26 years (just so you know).

Keep up the good work Brian and Mods and members.

Regards,

[Kanenaga]

This thread, while distressing in some ways, is of interest to some of us lurkers out here in internetland. I would like to add a small comment, if that is not out of line.

 

My wise and sadly-departed friend, Ralph Bell, was often heard to say: “It’s a hobby! It’s supposed to be fun.”

 

That’s what I see as missing from this discussion, namely, the word enjoyment. Is that not why we collect these things – because they give us pleasure? I would not disparage study, but I think many collectors collect because they find these things fascinating, or beautiful. So for study, substitute appreciate, or enjoy;  and then add on the study part for another, secondary, dimension – but in many instances is not really why we acquired that piece. How is it possible to argue with I bought it because I like it? To me, that’s what it’s all about.

 

I think there is much pleasure to be found in the beauty of the sword or fitting, and also I suppose in the somewhat competitive aspect of collecting, which is different. It seems that Snowflake is focused only on this secondary aspect of collecting as a pursuit, some kind of competition, and disregarding the enjoyment to be had from the beauty of item(s) themselves. I see this as a loss of direction, a perversion of the original reason to be involved in this (or any other) hobby.

 

And none of this excuses rudeness or boorishness.

 

Rant over. One of my teachers once advised buy the sword, not the signature.  I’d say there’s room for debate. Nevertheless, the OP bought a sword he found beautiful. No excuse necessary. We thank him for sharing it.

[Ganko]

Well put, George and les.

There are many of us who could care less about snob appeal. We acquire what we like for whatever reason we are attracted to it, whether it is an unsigned Shinshinto piece or a signed Juyo. Fortunately ,we do not all have similar likes and dislikes and in Japanese swords there is something for everyone. If I collect NCO swords am I to be looked down upon by the Juyo Ko-Bizen collector, I would hope not. Buy what you like for your own enjoyment for whatever reason and you will not regret it. There is nothing to be gained by putting other people down.

[paulb]

Dear All,

I think this has probably been discussed to death. The intention of the original post has long since been lost and I do not believe there is any benefit in the continued analysis of motivations character or whatever.

While much of what you say regarding personal choice is beyond argument there is a complication. As most here will be aware I have had the honor of being Chairman of The Token Society of GB for 4.5 years. So whether I choose it it not if I write something about collecting it ceases to be a personal point of view and may be seen by some as  advice or policy from an officer of a society I think, (don't know) that caused the reaction it did from Ray. Taken at face value it might have appeared to fly in the face of all the advice we and he give to new members when attempting to prevent them buying poor quality which is  oversold or misrepresented (not something I have seen here BTW).

The comments were unpleasant and I believe unjustified but the motives were not.

Can we now draw a close to this and move on.

Thank you

Paul