Goto Teijo Kozuka motif

[Japan2112]

Hi guys,

I have this kozuka attributed to Goto Teijo with two monkeys carrying a branch of fruit. I have seen this motif before but so far am unable to distill its meaning. Any ideas? I know Teijo's father, Kenjo, also used monkeys in motif. Perhaps something particular to the Ribei line? 

 

Thanks.

Mark

[Surfson]

If you saw it in a book, it would probably say, in Japanese, exactly what you wrote:  two monkeys carrying a branch of fruit.  Not sure it has to be deeper, but it may well.

[Guido]

Monkeys and loquats, a very common theme in China and Japan.

[Japan2112]

Guido.

That was helpful. Thanks.

[Pete Klein]

Mark - I remember seeing that being offered.  It's a very nice piece.  

 

Glad you have it!

 

BTW - did you mean, 'kogai'?

[Japan2112]

Oh, yes, Pete - it is a kogai. I'm glad you caught that.

[Tanto54]

I’ve been trying to decipher this theme since Mark kindly showed me this beauty at the Atlanta Show earlier this year.

 

I really like Guido’s suggestion of loquats and found many good pictures of that theme (monkey/saru and loquat/biwa).  However, the fruit on Mark’s Kogai doesn’t look like the loquat/biwa in any of the pictures, paintings or tosogu that I saw.  I know I’m taking a huge risk questioning Guido’s vast knowledge (who can forget when he taught us the difference between Shikami and Oni years ago ).  Also (for those of you who have been around here for a while), I know I risk getting the famous Guido reply of a rabbit with a pancake on its head (  fear of that response is one of my greatest phobias and it makes me be very careful in every posting on the NMB…) 

 

However, in the interests of [my] learning….  The fruit on Mark’s Kogai is either a bunch of individual fruits growing together in a globe shape or a single, globe shaped fruit with a bunch of nodules.  Loquats/biwa are clustered randomly and do not grow together in a globe shape.  In addition, they have a distinctive calyx (the “navel” looking thing at the bottom of many fruits) that is almost alway depicted in art, but are absent on Mark’s Kogai.  Similarly, the various “bulbs” on the fruit on Mark’s Kogai are pockmarked with lots of dimples (except for the central, larger one) and loquats are smooth.  Therefore, I don’t think that this Kogai has loquats. 

 

 So what suggestion can I offer???  I don’t really have anything more convincing.  I thought it might be a dogwood fruit (Kousa or Yamaboshi - which Japanese monkeys love to eat).  That fruit looks a lot more like the fruit on Mark’s Kogai, but that doesn’t explain the central, smooth and larger nodule in the center.  So I think that we still haven’t identified the theme of Mark's Kogai yet. 

 

Guido-sama - what say you?

 

MARK'S KOGAI:

 

 

LOQUAT PICTURES:

 

DOGWOOD FRUIT:

[Ganko]

The artist certainly had the ability to portray the fruit accurately and no doubt did so. The fruit shown is definitely not a loquat.

[Bazza]

Definitely not a loquat - I eat 'em from my daughter's tree!  Might I suggest a botryoidal fruit such as a mulberry??

 

BaZZa.

[Guido]

Monkeys are most often portrayed in Japanese art with peaches, persimmons, loquats, or chestnuts. Since the fruit cluster in this case doesn’t resemble any of them close enough to be 100% sure, I went with the leaves as the determining factor, giving the fruits some artistic license. As Sherlock Holmes said: “When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.”

 

And since I mentioned Mr. Holmes: our resident Dr. Watson  sent me a link to the original sales listing, where the hozon papers are shown that say it’s chestnuts. I don’t want to hand anyone a can opener to let slip the worms of NBTHK-bashing, but I’ve seen quite a few tōsōgu papers where they got the motif wrong, as they certainly did with this kōgai. They probably just took one of the above four fallback fruits since they, too, couldn’t come up with something more convincing.

 

So, am I sure those are loquats? No. Do I still keep the bunny/pancake picture on my hard drive? Hell yes!

[Brian]

This is the type of conversation/analysis that I LOVE. Well done Guido, George and others for showing us how it should be done.
You guys go together like monkeys and some weird unidentified fruit.

[Pete Klein]

"and some weird unidentified fruit"...

 

Thanks Bri...  love yah - mean it...

 

BTW:  George - the kogai you posted above is here with me...

[Tanto54]

Dear Pete,

 

I didn't know it was yours (but I should have suspected it - you have the nicest things...) 

[Pete Klein]

Thanks much George - as you do also!

 

Here is a scan of the applicable portion of the paper to the Sojo kogai you posted above.  It states, 'Biwa design' which is loquat in Japanese:  枇杷.  It's the top portion, Biwa no Zu.

[Japan2112]

Well, that just goes to show that my head scratching about the fruit was due. I like the bunch of loquats idea, while still open to chestnuts. Thanks eveyone... and Pete, very nice Sojo kogai!

[masakatsu]

Rambutan grow in clusters like this, and have large leaves, but I don't think they are common to Japan...  Any thoughts?

 

[Spartancrest]

Matching Menuki? 

https://gramho.com/explore-hashtag/kandatoukodo

[Tanto54]

Dale, I was hoping that you'd get involved in trying to determine what fruit this is.  The monkeys and style of the menuki you posted have a lot in common with Mark's kogai (but the original poster says chestnut - back to Guido's observation that chestnut is one of the defaults).

 

I still have not found a fruit that I'm completely satisfied with, but the following Buddha's Head Fruit/Cherimoya/Custard Apple (hybrid) looks the most like the fruit in Mark's kogai that I've been able to find.  The only problem is that this fruit probably didn't come to Japan or Asia until about a hundred years ago (so probably too young for Mark's kogai...)  Also, still can't explain the larger, smooth, central nodule on the fruit in Mark's kogai.  Perhaps Matt's suggestion of something like the Rambutan (or Lychee, etc.) might explain that smooth nodule (see bottom photo of an open Rambutan among closed ones.

 

 

 

 

 

Open Rambutan:

 

[Spartancrest]

There are several Asian fruits that may be the candidate - first thing though, how do we know if the fruit is to the same scale as the monkeys? 

 Cornus Kousa,  Korean Dogwood is an edible fruit found in Korea and Japan.

But perhaps more telling is the 'Monkey fruit' found throughout South East Asia. The custard apple leaves certainly look right but there are so many varieties that finding the specific species will be difficult. particularly if we don't know the size. 

[Japan2112]

I like the Rambutan leaves