Yamato - Hosho Tanto

[jt nesbitt]

Hey Y'all-

 I have gotten some private guidance by the totally excellent Ray Singer. He directed me to buy "The Connoisseurs Book of Japanese Swords" by Nagayama. It is exactly the book that I needed at my stage in the learning curve. A challenging read, but WAY better that all of the "Nihonto for Dummies" books that I have on the shelf.

 I know that I have probably worn out my welcome here, what with all of the dumb stuff that I have written and terrible photography, so it's time for me to up my game (no more photography that hurts to look at from now on, I promise).

 Please critique this post like you mean it! I feel the need to learn this material, and holding back on your criticisms of this post does not help me to grow....Blast away!

 

 I used my new book to come up with my assessment of yet another junk Ebay sourced blade. I bought this one about 2 years ago, straight from Japan with Daimyo registration card, paid $450 for this cute little tanto cause I liked the jihada and for no other reason.

 

So here goes, my first educated guess at some undocumented mystery Nihonto:

 

A Hirazukuri Tanto

Nagasa 8.25" (21mm)

Thickness at the machi .245" (.62mm)

Masame Hada

Suguha hamon with hakikake

o-maru boshi

 

I think that this is Yamato tradition Hoshu school. Because of the short length of this tanto, it should be categorized as mid Kamakura, but because the masame strands do not follow the curve of the boshi, and continue straight into the fukura -  like later Muromachi Hoshu work -  I think that it is a transitional form -  placing it in the Nambokucho Period.

 The condition of the nakago, mekugi ana shape, and accumulation of gunk, are consistent with other documented works of this age and school.

 The excellent shirasaya and fit and finish of the habaki, and good condition of the polish, further the opinion that this blade has been carefully handled and preserved due to it's provenance and beauty.

 

Here are the photos that I made -

 

Please tell me where I have failed. Thank you for your patience, kind attention, and help, as I learn this new language! --- JT

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[lonely panet]

Shikakke or tegai?? Sue koto era ??

 

Ps, driving a excavator while guessing

[Vermithrax16]

The polish is very poor, and the pictures don't help. Hard to add any comment.

[Ken-Hawaii]

JT, take a look at NMB member Markus Sesko's  writeup at https://markussesko.com/2015/04/13/kantei-1-sugata-7/

[SAS]

There are some hike, but i actually think the activities are easy to see....I would call the polish a bit stark but not poor. Lots to look at! Worth shinsa imo.

[paulb]

Hi JT,

Firstly congratulations on your photographs which show some good detail. I think the polish is old but not terrible. I can see why one would think of Hosho when looking at this, the shape and shape of the nakago and the obvious masame hada lead in that direction. Against it being Hosho in my opinion is that with a Hosho blade the masame typically runs parallel to the ha as it curves in to the kissaki. Yours doesn't appear to do this. The shape of the nakago is consistent with Hosho but unfortunately the condition is very poor and I cant see any Yasurimei. Typically these would be higaki and well cut. They are a very distinctive feature.

Considering some of the nightmares that come out of Japan with or without registration cards (which should have been surrendered when exported) I think for the price you did ok.

I don't think it is Hosho but as suggested above a new polish might reveal more detail such as ji-nie that might change that view.

Keep going and stop worrying about dumb questions. There is no such thing as a stupid question just some stupid answers on occasion.

[Jacques D.]

Boshi and yasurime are not those usually seen in Hosho ha

 

And i've a bad feeling with this kind of hada (sounds false), but i may be wrong. 

[jt nesbitt]

Big thanks to everybody that has given me feedback! I have been using the limited resourced available to try my best to learn this stuff, but it is the dialectic that I find here on the NMB that has real value.

 Based on your opinions I decided to run an experiment - I entered the word "masame" into the search bar on Ebay- This is what came up:

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/TANTO-Japanese-sword-Suifu-ju-Noriyuki-Mito-Ju-NTHK-Paper/233619356453?hash=item3664cc7b25:g:jLgAAOSwjsxe5oBV

 

From the listing:

 

Suifu Ju Noriyuki, also known as Mito Ju Noriyuki of the Bunkyu Era (1861-1864) from Hitachi. Was a peer of Suifu Ju Norikatsu. They were known to have made faithful utsushi (study/copy) of Yamato Hosho school blades from Kamakura period. Blade is hoso suguha in Ko nie. Has fine kinsuji and hotsure. The jigane is pure masame nagare (flowing straight) hada. The blade is unsigned but made to look like a kamakura Hosho blade.

 

I want to retract my earlier opinion. This is a COPY of a Hosho blade That was made in the 1860's, that somebody along the line artificially aged the nagako to make it appear more kamakura-like!  Thanks for challenging me! --- JT

[Mark S.]

I know that sometimes it is difficult to represent the real color and condition of the nakago in pictures (it can appear lighter or washed out) but something about the condition of your nakago makes me go hmmmmm???? Cleaned and an attempt at re-patina? Some other kind of damage? I’m not sure, but something doesn’t appear right especially in area just above mekugi ana?

[jt nesbitt]

Mark-

 I think that you are absolutely right! This nakago is a forgery. Artificially aged to appear much older than it is, coupled with the Hosho appearing masame hada, in order to dupe chumps like me into paying big money for a Kamakura age Hosho Tanto.

 I think that this little blade has fantastic craftsmanship, but it is even more valuable as a teaching tool, probably just as Noriyuki intended.

 Mito Ju Noriyuki has started a conversation 160 years after he made this, and on the other side of the world. I feel like Noriyuki just reached out through time and space to personally give me a lesson. What a marvelous gift. I am in awe. --- JT

[paulb]

JT

For what its worth at $450 you didn't pay large chunks of money for it and I think it is probably well worth that and more. As an aid to learning it has even more value. 

One lesson to learn though especially when looking at blades being sold on eBay from Japan "if it looks too good to be true it probably is". There are numerous people with a great deal more money and some with far greater experience looking for the odd diamond to appear and if its there they will usually spend far more than most of us would be willing to risk.

In my experience few Japanese sellers really enjoy selling overseas, its too much trouble. Therefore if it appears on eBay from Japan it is generally because the seller has failed to sell it in Japan and there is usually a reason for that.

Its one reason so many blades with old papers appear.

[jt nesbitt]

Paul-

 I come from a Fine Arts background. A large part of my education was spent making copies, or homages, to the Old Masters. If one's goal is an education-  studying bad work, then comparing it to masterwork -  is the only way to gain a full understanding of the subject. A big chunk of that process is failing publicly, in front of your fellow students.

 The greatest art historians are the ones who specialize in forgeries. They know their material better than anyone else. I never intended to make money with my collection, and have no interest in being a sword dealer (that is a hard way to make a living and requires true dedication and work). I am paying for an education, always a good investment, and having a GREAT time learning. Thanks for your encouragement. -- JT

[Marius]

JT, sorry to say, but your tanto seems to be very very low quality (at least in your photographs, but it might also be the polish). It if were a Hosho utsushi by a reputable sword smith it would have looked way superior. Masame as such is not an indication of quality, it is just a way of arranging layers during the forging of iron (steel). I suggest you don't focus on the least important factor in the quality of the sword... No matter what hada, a sword can be bad or excellent. `Please dive into this excellent resource by Kojima Hiroshi, a Japanese sword smith:

 

http://www.ksky.ne.jp/~sumie99/information.html

[Vermithrax16]

Paul-

 I come from a Fine Arts background. A large part of my education was spent making copies, or homages, to the Old Masters. If one's goal is an education-  studying bad work, then comparing it to masterwork -  is the only way to gain a full understanding of the subject. A big chunk of that process is failing publicly, in front of your fellow students.

 The greatest art historians are the ones who specialize in forgeries. They know their material better than anyone else. I never intended to make money with my collection, and have no interest in being a sword dealer (that is a hard way to make a living and requires true dedication and work). I am paying for an education, always a good investment, and having a GREAT time learning. Thanks for your encouragement. -- JT

 

I love your out look and background. Study and time will reward in nihonto. Stick with it.

 

This is the masame hada of Suifu Ju Katsumura Norikatsu, who you mentioned maybe taught the pupil mentioned:

[Tom Darling]

The nakago certainly looks like it came from New Orleans. 

 

Thanks for showing it.

 

Tom D.

[jt nesbitt]

So...Three and a half years later... I finally found something similar online. I sure would appreciate a full translation of this certificate 'cause I haven't had a good nights sleep since I bought this damn thing!

 Thanks in advance for your opinions and expert analysis! -- JT

[Rivkin]

Attributed to sue hosho and it does look Muromachi but the quality is Impressive.