A New collector needs advice

[Crow23]

Hello, this is my first posting on this forum, my background has been in collecting edged weapons, German, British and US (fighting knives, daggers and swords). I have always wanted to move my collecting into WW2 Japanese but until recently have felt too nervous to purchase, most people I know have advised against it on account of the amount of good fakes out there. I have now stumbled on this forum so would be incredibly grateful if any one could help me authenticate my first purchase. I have located what I believe to be a model 35 Officers sword and I trust the chap who is selling it because I have never had any trouble in the past when purchasing German daggers from him.

Please see the photos attached, hope these are of good enough quality, if not I am sure the chap will be happy to send the sword prior to me purchasing so I can do better photography.

 

ありがとうございました

 

 

[16k]

The photos are okay but leave a lot of mysteries. I believe the blade is real but is there a stamp or not? Would make the difference between a traditionally made blade or not. I’ll leave others give you the name of the swordsmiths.

 

what bothers me are some of the fittings. They look like an assortment of several types. By the way, your sword is a type 98 and I wonder whether it is not rather a civilian sword refitted for army service. Actually it’s more than likely.

 

By the way, welcome!

[Fuuten]

I agree with the above, except for the second paragraph (as I know absolutely nothing about this era's produce. I did want to say good job on not buying a fake, perhaps with your background that's a given but it's nice to see a different first-buy story. And welcome to the forum!

 

Also if you have the sword in your possession already we would ask for a photo of the whole sword without other things in the photo to show the sugars or form of the sword. One on the kissaki or tip and perhaps some close ups on the blade.

[Geraint]

Dear Stephen.

 

Welcome to NMB.  This is a real Japanese sword but that's about all we can tell from these photographs.  The tang, nakago, would suggest that it is a Showato, sword made for WWII.  It may or may not have a small stamp on it somewhere.  The fittings are far from standard and the blade is out of polish.  To summarise this is not a good example of the type and it shouldn't be much money.  If you buy it you will not be able to learn a lot from it and will have trouble selling it on.  Just for comparison here is one in standard mounts.  

 

 

If you are prepared to give us an indication of what is being asked for the sword then we might be able to be a bit clearer but if you are looking at WWII military swords this is not a great example to start with.

 

Don't give up!  Keep an eye on the For Sale section here and I am sure one or two of our UK members will tip you the wink if they come across anything good.

 

All the best.

 

 

 

 

[Crow23]

Thanks so much for the advice, the chap was wanting 795 for it, I reckon the best thing for me to do is keep looking. Over the years I had to learn patience when buying edged weapons. The learning curve for Japanese swords is going to be steep but am looking forward to starting in this area properly. Thanks once again for the help.

[Ken-Hawaii]

Please add your first name to your Profile, so we know how to address you.

 

Please stop looking for blades, & start looking in a few good reference books.

[Crow23]

Thanks for your advice, I have been trawling through amazon looking for books on the subject. Can I possibly ask your advice on some essential books I should have. I am primarily interested in WW2. On another note my first name is Steve but I always go by Crow.

[hxv]

The first book that comes to mind: The Connoisseur's Book of Japanese Swords by Nagayama.

 

Hoanh

[16k]

  On 5/27/2020 at 8:53 AM, hxv said:

The first book that comes to mind: The Connoisseur's Book of Japanese Swords by Nagayama.

 

Hoanh

While I do agree about nihontō in general, if our friend is looking for a WW2 sword, this wouldn’t be my first choice. I’d go for Japanese Military Swords and Daggers by Fuller and Gregory or Swords of Imperial Japan by Dawson. Those are the WW2 collectors bible books.

[Crow23]

Thanks so much. Am going to try to locate those books today.

[Bruce Pennington]

Crow,

I use both of those books extensively, worth the price!

 

Another fabulous resource for learning, and FREE, is Ohmura's website: http://ohmura-study.net/900.html

 

As to this gunto, If that 795 is USD, it's an Ok price. Don't know the UK market. I don't see anything wrong with the mounts. The tsuba is thinner than I've ever seen. The all-brown tassel likely indicates this gunto was carried by a Gunzuko officer (the civilians working for the Army. They had uniforms and rank). But at that price you could get a gunto in better condition, though some guys like the worn, used, battle-proven look like this one.

[Crow23]

Alas the sword is £795. I may look into doing a part trade with the chap which may take the sting out. Am looking forward to reading those books but will have to sneak them into the house, i ran out of shelf space a long time ago and my wife comments regularly. The good news is that she is very tolerant of my collecting, our place looks like a quartermasters

[16k]

Steve, I would pass on that one and keep a close look in the sale section. This sword isn’t really a great example.  You can find much better at a similar price, even in Europe.

 

This site is in Europe and often offers consignment gunto. The prices vary a lot but at least, no custom fees for Euro guys.

 

https://www.japanszwaard.nl/uk/intro.html

 

also, what is your budget? Bruce is selling an awesome Mantetsu at the moment.

[Crow23]

My budget is around the £800 mark but I could easily keep saving for a while, it will be a nice experience to get my collection off to a good start, many years ago when I began collecting German daggers I made a few errors, but luckily became wiser from the experience

[16k]

So that’s almost $900. Save until you have about  £1000/1200 and you can get a very nice shin gunto in almost pristine condition. That’s what I would do. The only thing is, for that price, you’re unlikely to find many in Europe, so you need to figure in the price for the custom fees (about 20/25%) and shipping (something around $90). Besides, the international post being the way it is at the moment, it’s worth waiting a few months until things get back to normal.

[Crow23]

That sounds like Good advice, I will be patient and save up, in the meantime I will read up on the subject. It is a hard discipline to be patient, but am sure it will pay off.

[16k]

The books you need are those. They are expensive but the best resource material available.

 

the first one has more written information but some are a bit dated and it is in black and white:

https://www.japaneseswordbooksandtsuba.com/store/books/b259-Japanese-military-and-civil-swords-and-dirks

 

the second one has less information about blades but is better for mountings as it’s all in color:

https://www.japaneseswordbooksandtsuba.com/store/books/b510-swords-imperial-Japan-1868-–-1945-cyclopedia-edition

 

I couldn’t tell you which is best as both complete each other. If you had to begin with just one, get the second one. It is more graphic and less expensive, but really, it’s a tie for quality. Gray is one of us and his prices are often the best around.

[Crow23]

Thanks, have ordered the second book to get started.

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