Generals Tassels

[16k]

  On 3/28/2020 at 8:57 AM, PNSSHOGUN said:

Different tassels were used for Kyu Gunto:

 

Company:

600x496-8-1.jpg

 

Field Grade:

56457870_319282375449370_6605107445763145728_n.jpg

 

General:

post-620-0-29315000-1440073500.jpg

 

For all ranks in the field:

HandleA.gif

 

John,

 

another very useful reference. Would you consider doing something like Stegel did where we can save this as one chart for future reference? I just have access to my IPad during the confinement or would do it myself otherwise. I think this is a truly great reference too. I’ll keep it as a screen capture though.

[Michaelr]

Siegel that looks GREAT. I will print it and save it. Thank you so much for your time in putting this together and for sharing it.

        
       MikeR

[kissakai]

Do we have the same for the navy?

[Ontario_Archaeology]

Although black and white, here is a general tassel attached to a gunto found in what looks like a magazine?

 

if the image comes out too small, here is the link to that auction i found it in. https://buyee.jp/item/yahoo/auction/d430147833/detail

[Stegel]

  On 4/1/2020 at 5:47 PM, Ontario_Archaeology said:

Although black and white, here is a general tassel attached to a gunto found in what looks like a magazine?

 

Great find O_A,  but that is not a General's tassel, it's actually the Emperor's tassel !

 

When i saw it, i knew i needed to update, so i spoke to Nick Komiya over at Warrelics forum and he helped out with a colour photo of it !

He's updated his thread on the Emperor's clothes with this uniform change from 1934 and it also includes details of the Emperor's Type 94 as released in the Government Gazette of the time.

 

 

I've updated the picture reference with the Emperor tassel and the Civilian tassel introduced in 1940 (also provided by Nick).

The civilian one is mistakenly assumed by most collectors to be the 'Late War' replacement for Army officers, being all brown.

I know... as once upon a time i too believed the same, but this is now another Myth, similar to the Type 3/NLF/44 pattern Gunto, that has been exposed and buried by him via the archives.

It is similar to the Navy issue, only a lighter brown as per the Army brown.

 

I considered doing a Kyu-preWW2 one, but changed my mind as i know little about them.

It would need some of the Kyu collectors to do one of their own, or help out.

 

BTW- if anyone notices any errors, please PM me so i can fix them.

 

[Stegel]

 Oh, also added the NCR (Nth China Railway) tassel.

[BANGBANGSAN]

Thanks,Stegel!

[PNSSHOGUN]

So that is why it is so different, thanks for the update. I believe that image is the replica on Yahoo.jp auctions that I can't find the listing of.

[Bruce Pennington]

Dang, that's a fabulous resource, Stegel. Can't thank or praise you enough for creating it.

[ChrisW]

Is this a general's grade Kyu-Gunto tassel?

[PNSSHOGUN]

No, I believe that is some sort of European knot.

 

EDIT: I'm mistaken, it's the same one I linked in my photo. There were a few different styles of this knot with different straps, here is the more commonly encountered version. https://buyee.jp/item/yahoo/auction/l591013747?conversionType=search_yac_browsing_hisotry_list

[Brian]

Awesome! Thanks Stegel.
I suggest redoing it with some form of watermark, so you don't find it used on eBay etc. You can always email one without watermark to those you know and trust.
Let me know if you need help replacing the one you posted. Great work.

[Ontario_Archaeology]

Honestly, despite all the information here and in other threads about spotting fake tassels. I am still struggling. Even when I try and compare tassels side by side I struggle to spot the differences. I am pretty sure a lot of the tassels I currently have on my swords are repos. I guess it all comes with experience.

 

On another note.... real?

 

Thank-you all

 

Matt

[PNSSHOGUN]

100% real.

[PNSSHOGUN]

A Kyu Gunto General tassel, this is the 1912 pattern, it is a small miracle to be found in this condition after 100 odd years as the wire cord on these types of tassel are diabolically fragile. Just the one Kyu Gunto so for now it rests on a Type 94 to replicate this photo:

 

 

 

[lonely panet]

oh john, im weak at the knees,

 

 

[Bruce Pennington]

That's a cool way to match them up, John!  And a good reminder for us when we see seemingly mismatched items here and there.  Dawson's comment that "Japanese army officers were fiercely independent and felt no obligation to upgrade their equipment to be "uniform" in appearance." flies is the face of some who poo poo "mismatched" gunto because we (sometimes I find myself even in this camp) are so saturated with how items should look, we immediately assume the mismatch is due to post-war piece-together work.  Of course, much or most of it IS piece-together, but this is still a good reminder to be a little more cautious before labeling something as such.

[Jareth]

Found this in one of my photo albums

[drb 1643]

Here’s pictures of my two.

Tom

[PNSSHOGUN]

Those are great Tom, interesting how the stem weave is different on the earlier version with straps.

[Bruce Pennington]

  On 9/27/2020 at 5:37 PM, Jareth said:

Found this in one of my photo album

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Jareth,

Do you know what the heck that is?

[Baka Gaijin]

Hi Bruce,

 

Looks like the type of weave known as Shigeuchi or Shigekumi, it was originally popular for swords in the Tensho era (1573 - 1592).

 

Your can still get it  as Sageo, from good suppliers of Budo equipment in Japan.

[PNSSHOGUN]

Just a normal General tassel, this photo of Yamashita shows a similar vivid pattern of a brand new one:

 

[Bruce Pennington]

Thanks John.  I guess I've heard of it, but never seen it or maybe never seen it so vivid.  Is that the same as Matt's tassel in post #43?

[Austo1]

The very vivid zig zag pattern generals Tassels in the photographs look like they are of the rarer Cotton Type Zig Zag stitching.

Regards

Doug General Tassel.docxFetching info...

[Bruce Pennington]

  On 9/30/2020 at 4:05 AM, Austo1 said:

Cotton Type Zig Zag stitching

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Great example, Doug, thanks!

[Ontario_Archaeology]

Part of the issue when analyzing tassels and colour is the difference in lightings, to prevent this I now have all 3 of the general tassels side by side, (one fake. far left.). 

 

[Ontario_Archaeology]

Close up images of the middle tassel, I'm not 100% sure on it. I meant to do this in December but got busy.... 

[Ontario_Archaeology]

And one more that wouldn't fit above 

 

[Ontario_Archaeology]

More variation. Far left is fake.