Blazeaglory Posted January 25, 2020 Report Posted January 25, 2020 For the life of me I cant really find what this is exactly. Its usually mentioned as Kotetsu's "secret hada" and is roughly 3" from the mune machi Can someone point me in the right direction or post a detailed pic with the above mentioned? Thank you in advance Quote
paulb Posted January 25, 2020 Report Posted January 25, 2020 I always understood that this was a larger itame hada than the rest of the blade and also a little rougher. However this opinion is based on what I have read or been told rather than seen 1 Quote
Blazeaglory Posted January 25, 2020 Author Report Posted January 25, 2020 On 1/25/2020 at 8:24 PM, paulb said: I always understood that this was a larger itame hada than the rest of the blade and also a little rougher. However this opinion is based on what I have read or been told rather than seen Thats what I was thinking as well. Basically just one bigger itame "swirl" 3" above mune machi? Quote
CSM101 Posted January 25, 2020 Report Posted January 25, 2020 Kotetsu and his tekogane. Take a look at the photo from the blade and where to find it. Uwe G. 3 Quote
Blazeaglory Posted January 25, 2020 Author Report Posted January 25, 2020 On 1/25/2020 at 9:07 PM, CSM101 said: Kotetsu and his tekogane. Take a look at the photo from the blade and where to find it. Uwe G. Interesting, I pictured it more like the hada in the pic below Do you think this is an attempt to reproduce Kotetsu's Ohada? I found this picture from someone who claimed to have found a Kotetsu at a garage sale Quote
CSM101 Posted January 25, 2020 Report Posted January 25, 2020 As far as I know tekogane is core steel. And No. This seems to be no Kotetsu. Uwe G. Quote
Blazeaglory Posted January 25, 2020 Author Report Posted January 25, 2020 On 1/25/2020 at 9:30 PM, CSM101 said: As far as I know tekogane is core steel. And No. This seems to be no Kotetsu. Uwe G. Sorry for the questions but is it only on one side of the blade or both? Quote
CSM101 Posted January 25, 2020 Report Posted January 25, 2020 I don't know. If you think about it, i would assume on both sides. Uwe G. Quote
Ken-Hawaii Posted January 26, 2020 Report Posted January 26, 2020 My sword mentor has a Kotetsu, & yes, there's o-hada on both sides, although not exactly opposite. In hand, those areas really do look literally "rougher." 1 Quote
Blazeaglory Posted January 26, 2020 Author Report Posted January 26, 2020 On 1/26/2020 at 12:26 AM, Ken-Hawaii said: My sword mentor has a Kotetsu, & yes, there's o-hada on both sides, although not exactly opposite. In hand, those areas really do look literally "rougher." Thanks. So it's something he did on purpose, almost like a signature right? Could something like that get polished away after so many polishes? Just wondering if it's only on the skin or through the entire blade. The more I read about Kotetsu, the more I'm intrigued. Quote
Ken-Hawaii Posted January 26, 2020 Report Posted January 26, 2020 It's a good question, Dwain, & something he & I have discussed. My mentor's katana has certainly seen some polishes, but the o-hada is still clear, so it's far past skin-deep. 1 Quote
paulb Posted January 26, 2020 Report Posted January 26, 2020 Just thinking it through I don't think O-hada could be polished away. What would be more likely to happen is that as you polished the weld lines would open and become more visible until ultimately core steel showed through. I recently did a write up on a Kotetsu wannabe and one of the factors that confirmed to me it wasn't an authentic work was the lack of this feature. Every blade I have studied (admittedly on paper not in hand) has this as part of it's description. If it isn't there be doubtful. 1 Quote
Blazeaglory Posted January 26, 2020 Author Report Posted January 26, 2020 On 1/26/2020 at 9:32 AM, paulb said: On 1/26/2020 at 4:15 AM, Ken-Hawaii said: It's a good question, Dwain, & something he & I have discussed. My mentor's katana has certainly seen some polishes, but the o-hada is still clear, so it's far past skin-deep. On 1/26/2020 at 9:32 AM, paulb said: Just thinking it through I don't think O-hada could be polished away. What would be more likely to happen is that as you polished the weld lines would open and become more visible until ultimately core steel showed through. I recently did a write up on a Kotetsu wannabe and one of the factors that confirmed to me it wasn't an authentic work was the lack of this feature. Every blade I have studied (admittedly on paper not in hand) has this as part of it's description. If it isn't there be doubtful. Very interesting! Almost like early fraud prevention lol Quote
Blazeaglory Posted January 26, 2020 Author Report Posted January 26, 2020 After learning all this, I chose to look at one of my wakizashi that resembles a Kotetsu. The forging is so tight that there are no kitae-ware, or very tiny and few, even in the bohi. Its hard to find any pattern on the ji because it's smooth as glass and always looks wet but the jihada that can be seen points to Kotetsu. The Nakago, 2 different hamon's and Boshi point to kotetsu as well. The only pattern that really stands out from the rest is what looks to be Ohada, roughly 3 inches from the mune machi. Other than some minor scratches and old polish, its in great shape and as sharp as my early Mino/Shizu blade, if not sharper. Now before I get crucified and the usual members start slanging insults or jumping to conclusions, I'm not saying its a genuine Kotetsu. What I am saying is every Kantei I've done on this always finishes at Kotetsu. I'm well aware of his fame and the majority of counterfeits. I'm still a rookie in the Nihonto world but I've handled my fair share of blades in person and have examined hundreds online, as well as read constantly. I know quality when I see it and this wakizashi is quality. So, imho, this wakizashi is either one of his unsigned, from his school and someone close to him or a forgery by a really good smith who was familiar with Kotetsu style. Please, if you're going to debate, which I welcome, please do it respectfully using Kantei points and not just heresay or bitterness. I say this because many times, even now, I've seen others claim fake or not genuine mei based off pictures while the blade was actually papered to the smith the person said was not. Anyways, please forgive my ramble and feel free to critique. I'm not trying to say I own a Kotetsu or brag, I only want to talk Nihonto using a blade that's close to me Quote
CSM101 Posted January 27, 2020 Report Posted January 27, 2020 Dear Dwain, It simply doesn´t work that way. You give us maybe 5 cm of a blade and then you want a proper kantei. There are more points than just tekogane or something that looks like that. If you want an answer than show the blade someone you can trust. Or send the blade to Japan. I don´t want to give you an anwser. Or if my life would hang on it then I would give you a Thumbs down. Simply because hada and hamon are not consistent enough. But like I wrote: send the blade to Japan. Uwe G. Quote
Lance Posted January 27, 2020 Report Posted January 27, 2020 I'd like to place a guess (that nobody asked for) as to how this large portion of hada originated, As the sunobe was first drawn out from the billet the smith decides where the nakago and blade start and that point gets the extra hammering (in both directions) creating the stretched larger area of hada. After that the rest of the blade gets drawn out consistently and shaped as usual. As a master smith this quirk became a routine part of his forging regimen,enough to make it a kantei point. Regards, Lance Quote
Rivkin Posted January 27, 2020 Report Posted January 27, 2020 No, its not a Kotetsu. Don't take my word on it, especially based on a photograph. But it is not a high quality sword. Jigane varies randomly, hamon is in nioi save for some sparkles of nie here and there. Kirill R. Quote
Blazeaglory Posted January 28, 2020 Author Report Posted January 28, 2020 On 1/27/2020 at 10:42 PM, Rivkin said: No, its not a Kotetsu. Don't take my word on it, especially based on a photograph. But it is not a high quality sword. Jigane varies randomly, hamon is in nioi save for some sparkles of nie here and there. Kirill R. So one person says they need more pics for a proper kantei but I guess you got it all figured out from this pic alone. Like I said, not trying to brag, but every time a person comes over and looks at the blades I have listed for sale, they always choose this one (which isnt for sale). Last week I was offered 2000$ for this "not high quality" mumei sword. I guess that must be the going rate for horrible swords then haha Anyways, Im not opening this can of worms again...Forget I even mentioned it Quote
Blazeaglory Posted January 28, 2020 Author Report Posted January 28, 2020 On 1/27/2020 at 6:55 AM, CSM101 said: Dear Dwain, It simply doesn´t work that way. You give us maybe 5 cm of a blade and then you want a proper kantei. There are more points than just tekogane or something that looks like that. If you want an answer than show the blade someone you can trust. Or send the blade to Japan. I don´t want to give you an anwser. Or if my life would hang on it then I would give you a Thumbs down. Simply because hada and hamon are not consistent enough. But like I wrote: send the blade to Japan. Uwe G. Have at it. There are more pics if you explore my Flickr page. And like I said before, Im not saying its Kotetsu. And yes I plan on sending this blade to Japan for next shinsa. And btw, I know how it works and I didnt ask for an answer from you or anyone else here and could care less what you personally think TBH. With all due respect. https://www.flickr.com/photos/blazeaglory/albums/72157704244397475 Quote
SAS Posted January 28, 2020 Report Posted January 28, 2020 A very nice sword in good polish, I like it! Quote
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