Mon in unusual locations

PNSSHOGUN · December 23, 2019

Does anyone have examples of Gunto with Mon in odd spots? I will post a few as I track down where I found them but ones of note were:

-On the Ishikuze

-On the very top of the Kabutogane

-On the top of the Ashi

Here is a variation I haven't seen before either:

vajo · December 23, 2019

That looks crude John.

PNSSHOGUN · December 23, 2019

Well there is the chance it has been added, still an unusual spot regardless...

Here is the one with Mon ontop of the Kabutogane: https://nihontou.jp/choice03/toukenkobugu/katana/851/00.html

PNSSHOGUN · December 23, 2019

And the last on the Ashi: https://www.artswords.com/021006generalssword.htm (if anyone here has this particular sword and wants to sell it... please PM me)

Dave R · December 23, 2019

Ashi or Habaki?

PNSSHOGUN · December 23, 2019

Ashi, the photos aren't totally clear but it's in gold near the suspension ring, not sure what it is though.

Bruce Pennington · December 23, 2019

Here:

PNSSHOGUN · December 29, 2019

One Bryce posted from another thread:

brannow · January 12, 2020

Hi John,

The sword with the Mon on the Ashi was a very interesting one. The blade was a Kamakura period Ko Mihara. It had a Burmese Rubi set in the lock release button and a tiger with a poem on one side of the habaki and a mon on the other side. The most interesting thing though was the story the seller told me after I bought it from him. He was a antique gun dealer and had a store for many years and it was bought from a vet who told him it had belonged to General Yamashita. I took it to Japan many years ago and tried to substantiate what swords Yamashita owned but was not able to find much information. One of his swords is on display in a museum and I dont remember which one.

PNSSHOGUN · January 12, 2020

Thanks for the extra information Bill, perhaps it was General Yamashita's. At the time Yamashita was a fairly strict Buddhist, it seems unusual for him to possess such an elaborate sword considering his other known sword (on display at the West Point Museum) is so unassuming but who knows for sure, it's a sword I have coveted for years!

And lastly this, no idea of its veracity: "(Library and Archives Canada Photo, MIKAN No. 3590968)

Swords surrendered by Japanese Officers in Japan, including two from General Yamashita, August 1945. "

Bruce Pennington · January 12, 2020

What do you think those 3 in the back are? They seem to have metal backstraps, but they're way too short for kyu gunto. Navy patrol or police?

brannow · January 13, 2020

John,

Interesting it almost looks like there might be a Mon on that hanger of the west point sword also.

PNSSHOGUN · January 13, 2020

The sword is currently on display in Singapore, there are a few good hi-res photos out there, I wasn't able to make out any Mon on it though, in fact it doesn't appear to have any particularly unique identifiers beyond the tassel and nice leather cover. Sadly it looks like it hasn't been taken care of, large amount of the samegawa has rotted away.

PNSSHOGUN · March 27, 2022

Two Mon on each side of the Kabutogane, here. Often when double Mon are present it is a family name in silver accompanying it. Guess this fellow was just really thrilled about this Mon....

sbf · March 27, 2022

Not that unusual, but pleasing to the eye.

Steve

BANGBANGSAN · March 27, 2022

On 1/13/2020 at 6:49 AM, Bruce Pennington said:

What do you think those 3 in the back are? They seem to have metal backstraps, but they're way too short for kyu gunto. Navy patrol or police?

Bruce

Those are Type 30 bayonet

BANGBANGSAN · March 27, 2022

On 1/13/2020 at 3:10 PM, PNSSHOGUN said:

The sword is currently on display in Singapore, there are a few good hi-res photos out there, I wasn't able to make out any Mon on it though, in fact it doesn't appear to have any particularly unique identifiers beyond the tassel and nice leather cover. Sadly it looks like it hasn't been taken care of, large amount of the samegawa has rotted away.

John
I visited the west point museum in 2016. Took some photos of Yamashita's sword, I don't see Kamon on it.

Ian B3HR2UH · March 27, 2022

Here is a sword that has a mon on the kabuto gane and also on the saya .

Ian Brooks

MarcoUdin · March 28, 2022

2 hours ago, Ian B3HR2UH said:

Here is a sword that has a mon on the kabuto gane and also on the saya .

Ian Brooks

How is it pinned on the saya, if you don't mind me asking?

PNSSHOGUN · March 28, 2022

Extraordinary example, the placement of Mon seemed to be particularly fast and loose on Type 94. Apart from the example above with the Mon on the Ashi, this is the only time I can recall a Mon placed on the Saya.

Here is a early mounted Type 94 (note the drilled but unpinned Kabutogane) with unusual Mon placement, this time on the lock button. This was from the recent large auction, unfortunately wasn't lucky enough to get it.

Ian B3HR2UH · March 29, 2022

Hi Marco , I am afraid that I have no real idea how these are attached on either the Kabuto gane or saya . Solder I guess but I will leave that to those who have more knowledge of practical matters than I do . . Ian

PNSSHOGUN · March 29, 2022

The other sword with Mon on Saya, it also has the Mon on the top of the Kabutogane. For whatever reason you don't see Mon on Koa Isshin swords very often.

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/vtg-ww2-Japanese-army-officer-koa-428631247

Bruce Pennington · March 29, 2022

Dang! I hate it when sellers don't post the serial numbers!!!

Quite a rare find, John. One for the files, even without the number!

PNSSHOGUN · March 29, 2022

Early Type 94 with Mon on side of Kabutogane:

PNSSHOGUN · April 26, 2022

Another one with Mon on top of kabutogane, looks like same fittings maker as for some unknown reason the pattern of the Sakura on the Fuchi faces the opposite way of other Gunto.