Share your horror stories

[Bazza]

Dwain, here in Japan they jokingly call these incidental expenses 授業料 Jugyo-Ryo, or educational fees. 

Well, good gravy, in my 55 years of collecting I've almost made a meal out of Jugyo-Ryo!!!

 

BaZZa.

[Bugyotsuji]

If you want to drink a good wine, and you know nothing about the subject, it is good to ask around, get some advice (friendly staff at the off-licence can be super helpful), read up a bit, ask questions of friends, and spend a little money to try different wines. Some, even most, you may enjoy to some degree, but once in a while you will discover something quite exceptionally palatable, something that suits you down to the ground. This personal discovery might not come for many years, or it might be quick, and there may even be better wines up ahead. Ultimately though, it is that click from your inner key that is most important.

 

For me, collecting antiques, particularly armour and matchlocks, and later and even more so, Nihonto, I always made sure to be in the company of someone whose eye I trusted to save me from potentially bad situations, like riding a bicycle with training wheels attached. Later I have always learned to ride alone, but that meant that I had to take the falls from the bike as well as the enjoyment of the ride itself. With swords this independent riding process has been slow, partly because I have not put in the hours of study I know are necessary. On the other hand I have tried to attend hands-on meetings and visit museums for many years, thus a very young but precious feeling has been born inside me.

 

To balance the two Tanto episodes I described above (actually there was a third, but 'nuff said) I recently found a fourth blade that hit the spot, with a kind of dark beauty, despite it not being Koto, and hardly even being Edo Period at all. But this does not matter to me now. I am confident in the workmanship, and how it fits into the stream of history, and I shall treasure it. The cherry on the cake was when my sword Sensei slid the blade from the saya. Silence welled, and my heart began to thump. Within three seconds he was sliding it back in again. He removed the tsuka and had a glance at the nakago and the Mei. 'Piers San', he said, 'this is the very best one you have found so far.' I asked him to do some remedial work for me on the koshirae ( i.e. replace the missing half of the silver Neji-Mekugi). He suddenly said, 'I would like to show this at the NBTHK chapter meeting next weekend.' Within two days he was showing me photographs of the process he had already gone through to recreate the Neji-mekugi. And I know how seriously busy this guy is. Despite his minimalistic comments, I am guessing he likes it! 

[Bazza]

My journey with wine has been very like that which Piers so eloquently describes - and far more successful than my journey with swords.  My wine story started when I was 18 and tried for the first time "Stanley Claret" from a (now) old-style flagon.  A light bulb went off "Mother, where have you been all my life??!!"  To keep to the theme of the thread, the horror stories here abound solely due to far too much of a good thing on occasions...  Nonetheless, I regret I have but one liver to give my country.

 

With swords, like Piers, I perforce learned to ride alone as there were no Sensei in my part of the world 55 years ago.  I looked for those lightning moments when a flash illuminated the sword of the moment I was looking at.  This was rare.  Never mind your tanto journey Piers, mine has been peppered with at times quite expensive follies.  Yet we persevere...

 

BaZZa.

[Bugyotsuji]

Episode Three

 

Just happened today, and a different kind of creeping horror.

 

(Some years ago I went to a party and almost immediately my Irish host cornered me. I did not know him particularly well, or anyone else really. "Tell me honestly what you think of this", he said, handing me a glass of unknown wine in front of everyone, everyone else knowing what it was, and I was on the spot. Should I be diplomatic or honest? Keep calm, I told myself.)

 

In much the same way the dreaded moment arrived this morning. My Sensei has never put me on the spot before, but he handed me a blade pinned in its shirasaya tsuka. "Tell me what you can see in this!" Luckily there was no-one else around, as I looked guiltily at it.

 

Well, it was a longish slim Tanto with a hi running right through the Nakago on both sides, Kakitoshi. I held it up to the light bulb, twisting it to find any ghost of utsuri. Hmmmm, "no, or anyway not much utsuri that I can see there" I said carefully. He laughed. "There is no utsuri in this blade", he said. Step one passed, I guessed, and took a deep breath. What about the 'ji' he asked. I couldn't see much, and the blade seemed like a well-sucked cough sweet, very Togiberi.

"Mokume?" I asked. Nope. "Itame it is surely not?" Nope.

 

"Piers, it's ayasugi." Eventually I found a spot that could be ayasugi, so I reluctantly agreed with him.

 

The Mei was 月山 and he asked me how old it was. The answer was in the faintly positive sori. If Kamakura with all the polishing the originally neutral sori would have been negative by today. This one was late Muromachi Gassan and there was a little sori left. 

 

"Now, what hamon is that?" he asked. Very thin and faint, I stared at it for a while, adjusting my specs nervously. "Erm..". I said clearing my throat, "well it looks to be a suguha in nioi deki." Nope! Gulp. "er, well, then, slightly notare suguha in nioi deki, perhaps?" I smiled weakly.

 

Nope!

 

"Piers San!" he said. "This blade has no 'Ha' at all."

 

"Ah, ha ha ha, I said, mortified. "So the Togishi has added a cosmetic 'hamon' line?" Yup. There were however the remains of a hamon at the boshi.

 

The only relief/escape he provided was that almost everyone else had shown it to had fallen into the same trap, including the Gakugei-in (curator) at the sword museum. 

 

The only come-back I could muster was when he showed me his proud new acquisition, a 50-Monme monster O-zutsu from Sendai. "Oh look!" I said, and pointed to the faint marks of a Mitsudomoe stamped imprint and a Kuyomon stamp underneath the barrel and to the left of the the Mei.

"Where?" he asked, and "oh, yes,    I hadn't noticed those!" 

[Tom Darling]

Here's a horror story of horror stories, and it's absolutely true. A lady walked into karate dojo and asked the teacher if he was interested in buying Japanese swords. He showed her how to take off the handle and showed her the signed nakago. "Please bring in your swords". The lady came back a month later with seven tangs, that were sawed off, Probably because they fitted in her purse, This happened forty years ago, maybe some of you heard this story? I didn't ask if he bought the tangs, as I was in shock!

 

Tom D.

[Bugyotsuji]

What were the smith names?

[Tom Darling]

I didn't ask and didn't want to know or have any haunting memories.

 

 

Tom D.

[SAS]

And now we know why some swords have weld lines.....

[TheGermanBastard]

A douzen swords sent to Donald Myra of Port Alberni, Canda for polishing and paid for in advance. Never returned. A hand full of other collectors in the same boat. All swords reported as stolen to the RCMP.

 

So case you should happen to have bought one of these Id be happy to buy it back.

[Tanto54]

Dear Tom,

 

Are you sure that your Sensei wasn't pulling your leg?  I wish there was a Snopes for Nihonto - I'm sure that the "Lady and the 7 Tangs" would be on there...  Without a chopsaw, the effort to cut off 7 nakago would be tremendous (and my wife is one of the few women that I know with a chopsaw).

[Tom Darling]

Dear George,

 

I wouldn't think a charming lady did it, I guess she  had it done. Could of been her husband, maybe a welder with a cutting torch, son or neighbor, or she had plenty of time to do it herself. Women can do anything a man can do, and maybe even better. . He was a very serious collector, and I too wouldn't believe it, if, it was anybody else. He was not my Sensei. Best, " I believe it, I believe a dozen swords were sent for polish and prepaid, was never sent back". Shame on him for doing what he did.

 

 

Tom D.

[Brian]

Don Myra was that $^%@ selling the Gaijin's Guide to Polishing videos showing how to use sandpaper to polish.
He deserves to be prosecuted.

[Bazza]

Don Myra was that $^%@ selling the Gaijin's Guide to Polishing videos showing how to use sandpaper to polish.

He deserves to be prosecuted.

I bought Don Myra's Gaijin's Guide to Polishing (a set of videos including shirasaya making etc etc) DEFINITELY NOT TO POLISH, but out of curiosity to see what he was up to and what damage he could do to a sword.  The videos were a horror story in their own right.

 

I'm always astonished at the abysmal lack of knowledge of people who claim to be able to polish Nihonto.  There is one such man known to me here in Australia and he "works" for a smallish military museum, with an "apprentice" no less.  Aaaaagh, what Brian said.  I did ring Don Myra's home one day and spoke to his wife who said Don was very ill and as he couldn't work he did "polishing" to make ends meet.  I have no idea what his medical issues were (it was now a LONG time ago), but it is possible he could have passed away.

 

BaZZa.

 

(small edit)

[lonely panet]

i refurred to the person of whom you speak Bazza

 

BARRY THE BUTCHER.

 

a true walking horror story. ive heard if you say his name 3 times whilst looking into a mirror he appears and ruins your best sword

[Marius]

Now, Sengo leads to Muramasa leads to evil sword legends and all.

 

So the box is there, I don’t want any bad surprises or damaging anything. I open it on the bed. If there’s any fall, at least it won’t do harm. I remove the Saya and marvel at the blade,I take some rubbing alcohol to wipe the oil, my right hand reaches the Kissaki and I don’t know how, the tip slides from my right fingers and gives me a deep cut, millimeters only from the artery. I still have a scar today!

 

 

 

You have been careless, that is all.

 

You might have done what I have done, too - moving the cloth up and down the blade (NEVER NEVER DO THIS!)

 

Well, my left hand goes too far up, catches the tip, pointing finger and thumb are cut, the former deeply, with bundle of nerves severed (the finger is still a bit numb after all these years). Bleeding like hell, I grab some paper towels to stop the blood for a moment, I use the time to clean the sword (Sukesada wakizashi). Once the sword is cleaned and oiled, I use some bandages and take a cab to go to a surgeon. He sees the would, asks  (admiringly) "That is a nice cut. How the hell did you do this?" I say " with a Japanese sword".  He asks with genuine interest: "Katana or wakizashi?"

 

Not much of a horror, but it taught me to be very cautious and focused when handling swords...

[raynor]

Good reminder, all it takes is a moments lack of focus and fingers will fly as these are tools made specifically to cut people. Much more effectively then a knife in a similar situation, blades curved niku gets the job done good if we just give it a tiny chance..

 

Not my horror story but I saw a documentary where a German blacksmith of some renown, name escapes me at the moment, whacked a German longsword hard edge to edge with another longsword then as hard with a nihonto to prove German swords were better.

[TheGermanBastard]

I bought Don Myra's Gaijin's Guide to Polishing (a set of videos including shirasaya making etc etc) DEFINITELY NOT TO POLISH, but out of curiosity to see what he was up to and what damage he could do to a sword.  The videos were a horror story in their own right.

 

I'm always astonished at the abysmal lack of knowledge of people who claim to be able to polish Nihonto.  There is one such man known to me here in Australia and he "works" for a smallish military museum, with an "apprentice" no less.  Aaaaagh, what Brian said.  I did ring Don Myra's home one day and spoke to his wife who said Don was very ill and as he couldn't work he did "polishing" to make ends meet.  I have no idea what his medical issues were (it was now a LONG time ago), but it is possible he could have passed away.

 

BaZZa.

 

(small edit)

 

Hello Bazza, may I ask when you spoke to his wive? I last checked on him two ears ago through the Port Alberni city council and he was still alive as the lady took the local whitepages and he was listed there. 10 years go my impression was that he was living by his own without a wive. This is mere speculation but this may have been a reason why he got out of track. To the bets o my knowledge he had been around a very long time and all at a sudden went crooked. Personally I believbe there must have been a chnage in life events. In the end it is a most unfortunate situation and my only advice to fellow collectors is to not send to many swords at a time and to not pay upfront for a polish but only after it has been completed. If anything goes bad it will atleast reduce the potential loss ...

[Stefan]

Sengo Muramasa. Over two decades ago i bought  a blade by this smith. It has been pretty cheap. At  the moment of buying I did not  know the reason for  the low price.

I learned the reason  very fast....Each time I handeld  the blade it  cut me deeply.  At this time I did  have over decade experience with sharp nihonto. Therefore it has been  very unusual for me to be cut by an blade.

A year later, I sold the blade , pretty cheap. 

Afterwards  I called the old owner if did have made the  same  experience with this nice sword. The answer ? Of course , it was yes. Therefore  he sold it  so cheap.

Years  later  , I ve been told that  the  man to whom  I sold it, also sold the blade pretty cheap after a year....

[vajo]

Haha the ghost story ????

[vajo]

I had a very sharp NCO. I cut me twice on it. Now i have the sword in the sleeping room on a kake for home defense. It cut me never again, i think we are friends now ????

[Stefan]

Haha the ghost story

Form the unfortune of the present  owner, this happend really. I do have several scars from the friendly blade. Before this, I called all the legends, as we say in  german "Mumpitz" , or in english nonsens.  Nowadays. being  gray int he beard, i do know that there is a glimpse of truth in those legends.  I cant understand why´, but  to deny those experience, it does not make sence also.

[ChrisW]

Thankfully I've never been cut by any of my nihonto in my relatively short time as a collector! Though I've had a 17th century french court sword do that to me unexpectedly. Was cleaning it and my grip slipped and it poked a nice hole in my thumb.

[Tom Darling]

Has anybody ever heard of a wakizashi jumping, popping, springing out of the shirsaya tsuka when removing it from the tsuka.. You're holding the handle and hitting the holding hand to get it out (loosen or pry ) of the tsuka?  What do you guys think?

 

 

Tom D.

[PNSSHOGUN]

Yes I'm a little perplexed at all these tales of being cut, the only close calls were when not giving the sword my full attention or something similar. Unfortunately I have slashed myself once when the tip of a Shinken cut through the top of the Saya during a draw, only myself to blame, no ghosts to be seen for miles!

[Tom Darling]

Can anybody admit owning a Muramasa that didn't cut them?  I would say if they didn't get cut, it's not a Muramasa!  You wouldn't have to submit.  IMO.  Peace.

 

 

Tom D.

[vajo]

Hi Tom this procedure is then called cutting test. ????

 

Best

Chris

[Alex A]

 and paid for in advance. 

 

 

 

One thing ive learned in life through a few bad experiences, is to no longer do this.

[Surfson]

Not my horror story, but I was told about a collector that had 300 papered blades and he kept all of his papers in a large shopping bag.  A new cleaning lady thought it was useless old paper and threw it out.  Ouch.

[raynor]

Happened to my dad over twenty years ago but it was his second wife tossing very valuable books not origami.

[16k]

Sengo Muramasa. Over two decades ago i bought  a blade by this smith. It has been pretty cheap. At  the moment of buying I did not  know the reason for  the low price.

I learned the reason  very fast....Each time I handeld  the blade it  cut me deeply.  At this time I did  have over decade experience with sharp nihonto. Therefore it has been  very unusual for me to be cut by an blade.

A year later, I sold the blade , pretty cheap. 

Afterwards  I called the old owner if did have made the  same  experience with this nice sword. The answer ? Of course , it was yes. Therefore  he sold it  so cheap.

Years  later  , I ve been told that  the  man to whom  I sold it, also sold the blade pretty cheap after a year....

Sounds a lot like my story!