Kantei For Five Tsuba

[kissakai]

Hi

I’ve seen a couple of sword kantei but not for a group of tsuba so here goes

This year I submitted five tsuba for shinsa and received the attributions a few days ago. I will not get the actual papers for another few months

I purchased four of these from the NMB and one from the UK Birmingham Arms and armour fair. All between 2016 to 2017

I’d welcome any guesses and observations. I’d add some clues and a final reveal later. More details after I have receive the actual papers

Good luck but I will say there were at least one surprise

 

T210  "Six ken" 62 x 57 x 4.5

 

 

 

 

T219  "Waterwheel" 75 x 71 x 2 to 5.9

 

 

 

 

 

T220   "Flower and leaves" 82 x 82 x 2.8

 

 

 

 

T238   "Abstract"

 

 

 

 

T287.  “Daikon and steam” 87 x 85 x 3.6

 

 

 

 

Grev

 

 

[Marius]

Six ken tsuba - ko Shoami

Waterwheel - Naoaki (?)

Flower and leaves - ko-tosho

Abstract -  late Akasaka

Daikon and steam - (ko)tosho

[seattle1]

Hello:

 1.Saotome, 2.Naokatsu, 3.Ko-tosho, 4.Akasaka, 5.Katchushi (Edo).

 Arnold F.

[Jussi Ekholm]

1.?

2.?

3. Ko-Tōshō

4. Akasaka

5. Tōshō / Katchūshi

[Ron STL]

2 - This sure looks like Jirotaro Naokatsu, if not the Naoaki. Surprised it's not signed. Ron STL

[Curran]

  On 7/11/2018 at 7:34 PM, Ron STL said:

2 - This sure looks like Jirotaro Naokatsu, if not the Naoaki. Surprised it's not signed. Ron STL

 

Yep. I was surprised it isn't signed either.

I know the attributions on these, so can't join the kantei session.

I remain disappointed by the NBTHK Hozon level shinsa since whatever happened in 2014 staff shift, but Grev's results are mostly   in line with what I expected.

[Lee Bray]

1 - Ko Shoami

2 - Naokatsu

3 - Tosho (Edo)

4 - Akao

5 - Tosho (Edo)

[MauroP]

My try (hazarding something a bit unusual):
1. den Kanayama
2. Hōan
3. ko-tōshō
4. kōdai Akasaka
5. tōshō (but Myōchin or Saotome could be candidates)

[kissakai]

All those who have replied have much more nerve than me.

I would find guesing one tsuba would unnerve me so very well done for having a go

I think we can but No 4 - T238   "Abstract" to bed as being Akasaka but no era given

 

There is one or two difficult attributions but we can work up to them

I did ask Paul Martin for clarification after he sent me the basic 'pass' and attribution but I'll have to wait a few months for the papers

There some very good calls that are correct but I'll keep this going for a few days

[kissakai]

Another update

 

 

No 2
T219  "Waterwheel"
Den Naokatsu
This was difficult for hence shinsa submission
I assume 'den' was because it was mumei whereas you would have expected it to be signed

No 3
T220   "Flower and leaves"
Tosho
Note the there were guesses for ko and Edo era but the era was not stated

 

Leaves No1 & No5 which no one has quessed correctly so please have another go

[seattle1]

Hello:

#5 is not tosho or katchushi ????, beats me. For #1 I'll revise with little sureness to Sado.

Arnold F.

[kissakai]

Hi Arnold

Not Sado - I think of Sado as quite heavy in weight and design

Yes a surprise but just wait until you here about the last two!

[Brian]

Any of them failed as modern made?

[johnnyi]

#5 Saotome?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

johni

[kissakai]

Not Saotome

All passed shinsa with a school or the one 'den'

[kissakai]

Thought I'd also reveal No 5

T287.  “Daikon and steam”

Shinsa says Shoami which was a surprised to me but there are a couple of pre Edo Shoami and you can see some similarities

The give away may be the surface which is quite homogeneous. Virtually all Shoami have ether one or two ana so it is unusual and of course the give away seppa dai area is not there!

 

I welcome some attempts however wild at the last tsuba as I will be surprised if anyone gets the school which as a clue is preceded by 'ko'

T210  "Six ken" 62 x 57 x 4.5

I'll tell you all tomorrow

[mywei]

Ko Akasaka? Completely blind guess

[kissakai]

Blind guess is OK but in this case it is not ko Akasaka

[Brian]

Ko-Shoami?
(Oh wait..I see Lee tried that)

[Kurikata]

A try: Owari ?

[MauroP]

Never seen ko-Owari, but sometimes the shinsa sensei take out strange rabbits from their hats...

[johnnyi]

ko sukashi?

 

 

 

 

 

johni

[kissakai]

 Not ko Owari or ko sukashi

I will reveal in two or three hours time 

[Brian]

What's left??
Can't be ko-kinko!

[kissakai]

Not ko kinko

[yogoro]

Ko-Umetada ?

[kissakai]

The final tsuba has been revealed.

ko Umetada

 

I have been in conversation with Curran and he knew all the results

One comment from Curran:

 

I can see the Ko-Umetada call, but that is a very rare call.

I didn't know the NBTHK was still making it. They seem adverse to 'Ko' on anything but Ko-Shoami.

He may add to this post and he raised a few pointers

 

I was hoping for Kanayama but academically this is better

Note that only 'ko' attribution was for the Umetada and not the tosho which was a shame

 

This was the email from Paul Martin who took them to Japan

 

Mumei Mon-sukashi tsuba (tosho) pass

Akasaka sukashi tsuba pass

Autumn grasses tsuba, Shoami, pass

Ken with Mon sukashi tsuba, pass, Ko-Umetada

Waterwheel? tsuba Den Naokatsu, pass

 

One of the reasons for speaking to Curran was due to the strange results as as their description varied from mine I wondered if I had mixed them up but it appears I have the hopefully correct. Papers will reveal the true story but that instalment has to wait a few months

I hope you enjoyed it as much as I did and my hat is off to you all as it was way above my head

 

From my own records:

T210 Six Ken. Kanayama (Three different eminent collectors suggested this school

There is enough activity showing on the mimi to suggest Kanayama rather than Owari

Circa 1550

 

T219 Waves and Sun rays: Naokatsu group – Circa unknown

 

T220 Hanabishi: ko Tosho (BH) – Circa 1500

 

Material

Iron with tsuchime (hammer marks) and the hitsuana filled with lead or lacquer

 

Additional Information

This tsuba was personally bought by the seller (Chris) from the Eckhard Kremers

collection. Mr Kremers was a student of Profesor Sasano and this tsuba was

owned at Sasano. Looking at Sasano’s images and notes this should 

1454 - 1513 due to the size. It is with strong confidence that I put it next to the

Tsuba Yamagata Ni Hishi (page 40-Kremers) and Hi-Tsuki (page 39-Kremers).

Earlier tsuba tended to be around 90mm in diameter. Authenticity was given

by Mr Kremmer during the Ashmolean tosogu event on 10/09/16

 

238 Abstract: Akasaka (BH) Circa 1750

 

T287 Daikon: ko Tosho. Circa 1525

Subject

The daikon and steam is illustrated in Southerby’s Catalogue 18th June 1998 No 921

 

There is the rider they the shinsa may be wrong or new information has come to light.

I spoke to a sword collector that submitted his sword for shinsa three times until it had (in his view) the correct smith

I'd like an approximation of the date for Waves and sunrise tsuba

Now over to you for comments

 

 

Thanks

Grev

 

 

[seattle1]

Hello:

Thank you Grev. It seems to me that #1 as Ko Umetada is most peculiar and highly uncharacteristic. The call for #5 as Ko Tosho once again should remind us of the uncertainty that there is actually a difference between the men making Tosho and Katchushi; it is sort of like coastal Alaskan grizzlies and interior grizzlies are one and the same and overlap and neither is a polar bear.

Arnold F.

[Lee Bray]

Thanks, Grev.

I went with my strange call for Akao for 'T238 - abstract' because the design reminded me of this piece I own.

Live and learn...

 

 

 

[Jussi Ekholm]

Thanks for this Grev, it was really fun.

 

Personally I'd give great value to comments from Sasano & Kremers.