Kabuto Inherited- Want To Learn More About It

[DILLONDOHERTY]

May grandfather purchased a Kabuto when he was stationed in Japan during the 50s. It was passed to me but I know nothing about it other than the family he bought it from only sold it to him because they did not have any children to pass it to.

[DILLONDOHERTY]

Here is a photo of the Kabuto and one of the yoroi bitsu that it was in.

[Greg F]

Hello Dillon, welcome to Nmb nice Kobuto, i like the maedate. Others that know a lot more than me will probably give you more info. Wouldnt hurt to take more pics. There is an Armour forum that would be worth checking out also.

 

Greg

[YOJIMBO]

my neck hurts  

[vajo]

Hi Greg. That armour forum is terrible to get in. I tried it 4 times but not replay. 

[Greg F]

Hi Chris, try the samurai arms and armour forum if thats not what you already tried. All the best.

 

Greg

[Shogun8]

Hi Dillon,

 

Offhand, I would say your kabuto is a nice example of a toppai kabuto, notable in that it is higher than most. Haruta school, would need to see more pics to comment on dating.

 

You're very welcome to post your kabuto on the Japanese Armor Society forum at www.japanesearmorsociety.org. Many of our members are actually in Europe right now attending a symposium in Leiden that wrapped up today so apologies if there is a slight delay in responding to you.

 

Looking forward to seeing you there.

 

John

[Shogun8]

Hi Greg. That armour forum is terrible to get in. I tried it 4 times but not replay. 

 

Hi Chris,

 

I'm sorry to hear that you've had a difficult time accessing our forum and/or getting a response. Can you send me a PM to give me more details regarding the issues you're experiencing?

 

Thanks in advance.

 

John

[DILLONDOHERTY]

Hello guys. I will post more photos tomorrow and will make sure to post pics that dont hurt any more necks. I will also check out the forums mentioned. I want to say thank you tp all that have replied to my post...I have had these pieces for a few years now and it has been frustrating trying to find info on items that are from another country, especially when you dont know what much about the subject.

[DaveT]

Hi Greg. That armour forum is terrible to get in. I tried it 4 times but not replay.

There was originally a log in issue with The Samurai Arms & Armour Forum. That is now resolved. If you want to connect with some of the most knowledgable minds on katchu then its worth joining.

 

The current 696 members have joined with no problems.

[Brian]

And there is nothing preventing some of those members educating us here too, before they provide more info there, just like John did.
Were are happy to promote other specialist forums here, it's not like we are a profit based forum. But add some info here too for the members with an interest.
And those that feel it necessary to provide info via pm and not post it publicly...unless you are unsure of your info or accuracy thereof, what do you think you are accomplishing?

[Luc T]

Hi Dillan. This looks like a very intersting toppai kabuto. We just published an article in our yearbook about this type of kabuto.

We can discuss this here, as Brian suggests. Do you have pictures of the inside, without ukebari?

 

Luc Taelman, chairman of the Japanese Armor Society

[Shogun8]

Hello all,

 

Don't want to hijack Dillon's thread, but just a quick note regarding Vajo's (Chris S.) earlier post and my subsequent response. Chris did PM me and the issue seems to be that the Japanese Armor Society forum requires all users to use their real names because we want the forum to be totally transparent and to prevent trolling, due to past experience. If one tries to register with a pseudonym, their registration is automatically deleted. This information is clearly stated in our policies and registration process.

 

We welcome Chris' registration and participation on our forum - and anyone else interested in learning about katchu.

[uwe]

Hi Dillon,

just stumbled over this thread. A nice toppai kabuto you inherited! Actually I would call it "shinomi-nari kabuto". A subgroup of the "toppai family", so to say. As mentioned, for more info, more pics are needed

Be careful with this old buddy....

[Baka Gaijin]

Interesting, that where one would expect Inome (Boar's Eye piercing) on the Wakidate (Side Plumes), they are depicted as circles.

 

Also, given the shape and thin construction of the Maedate (Central Badge...), look to be contemporary with the Wakidate which looks like a pressing and I suggest of much much later construction.

 

What do you think Luc, Uwe & Dave?

[uwe]

Hi Malcolm,

 

guess you refer to the kuwagata/kuwagata-dai?! Yep, has a "modern appearance" to me also....

[vajo]

Which Forum is correct?

 

https://www.japanesearmorsociety.org/phpbb/ucp.php?mode=login&sid=26490508206943531512f8f7113b4d37

 

http://www.nihonto-yoroi.com/forum/

 

 

http://nihon-no-katchu.proboards.com

 

 

http://www.armsandarmourforum.com/forum/

 

 

I fear i register on different forum because they look on smartphone, tablet and PC totally different and i search over google. Which forum is that we talking about?

 

Whatever, i got answer from none of them with my true name ????

[Baka Gaijin]

Hi Chris, it's the second one from the top:

 

http://www.nihonto-yoroi.com/forum/

 

Cheers

 

PS Thank you Uwe, I shall now go and write Kuwagata 1000 times in my note book......

[uwe]

...........

 

Chris, there are two diffrent forums (dedicated to Japanese armor) actually on line:

 

https://www.japanesearmorsociety.org/

 

and

 

http://www.nihonto-yoroi.com/

 

[DILLONDOHERTY]

[YOJIMBO]

my neck hurts     

[uwe]

Hi Dillon,

 

very nice kabuto. Worth a closer inspection! Is there a signature on the back plate? Please have a look at the gap in the "ukebari" (cloth lining).

The red tassels don't belong there. The small holes in the "fukigaeshi" (turn backs of the first plate of the neck guard, "shikoro") served usually the attachment of a "mon" (family crest), now missing. Which make sense, in a way!

[Luc T]

It looks like a nerikawa with builr up suji.

[IanB]

Dillon and Brian,  you want education OK. Toppai bachi first appeared in the late Sengoku period as the more traditional akoda nari kabuto were found to be ineffective. It was a period in which ashigaru armed with spears appeared on the batttlefields in considerable numbers, prompting considerable changes to the armour being worn. The pointed shape was far superior in deflecting a cut to the head and the closer fitting neckguards, shikoro, with which they were fitted protected the head better from spear thrusts than the more open manju or kasa types used earlier. Early toppai bachi tend to be rather squat with gently curved sides, made from about 10 or 12 plates and with a prominent, more or less horizontal peak to protect the face. By the Edo period, some groups such as the Saotome began to make high quality, taller versions with a greater number of plates. There were three basic forms: those that were more or less strictly concical, those that curved outwards from the base towards the top, which, when of moderate height, were likened to an acorn and those that were convex at the base becoming concave towards the top that were likened to the hairs of a writing brush. 

I agree with Luc that your example Dillon appears to be made of rawhide, neri gawa, as shown by the thickness. There also appears to be an iron plate or koshimaki around the base to which the neckguard attaches. The ribs, suji will have been modelled in lacquer to imitate multiplate construction. Who made it is impossible to say without a signature inside but the Iwai group are a possibility. Initially they were based in Nara and made both iron and rawhide armours for people as high ranking as the Tokugawa, later tending to concentrate on mounting and tailoring armour parts made by others. They set up branches all over the place. Having said that there were many others who made rawhide armours, many of which are now lost as any damage to the lacquer allows the ingress of moisture that swells the hide forcing of more lacquer and leading to total destruction. 

Ian Bottomley

[Bugyotsuji]

Interesting example. I had two toppai, shallower that yours, but stupidly sold one of them not too long ago. I like the tehen/hachimanza decoration at the top. (Many of this type were joined together to a point at the top.)

 

Re neck-ache.

If you are using an iPhone to photograph with, it helps to 'edit' the photo first. Any kind of editing is fine, such as changing the light, or cropping the shot, easy to do within your phone. Once you push 'Done', the photo should be fixed in permanent alignment. (This may not be true for all smart phones.)

[Brian]

Bravo Ian
Fantastic post, learned a lot. Thanks for taking the time.

[Luc T]

We published an article about toppainari in our JAS yearbook 2018.

The author is Takemura sensei.