Informations About The Rjt

[Dave R]

 I remember " Ryujin swords" (there is more than one firm using the name) mentioning going through the skin of a Gunto, after a Japanese polisher had refused to touch it, telling him it would just be a chunk of modern steel. In fact, it's the reason they did that very handy guide about Showa manufacturing methods, which now looks to have disappeared off the internet  I will post that again, and also 2 very handy diagrams about construction of blades, and apologies if this info' is redundant.

[george trotter]

Hi Dave,

Oh, I see, not RJT in three classes but gendaito in general. ..that explains it....yes sure, RJT are mid-level to upper level IMO.

I have not seen one (yet) with kizu or flaws, but who knows.

I have not seen Yasukunito with kizu or flaws that I can remember either, but on Yasukunito, I have noticed that of the 5 or 6 that I have had the opportunity to handle over the last few decades, 4 had badly rusted tangs. In fact they were "rotten tangs" from the nakago tip right up to the mekugi ana - only the tangs at the mei area were OK. Made me think that there was some feature of their tamahagane that was liable to rust. The two "good" ones Yasunori (naval mounts) and Yasuoki were very good. Anyway, like you I have not chased Yasukunito....but I do like RJT. Again, that said, I have to LIKE the sword, I don't just buy the 'type'.

Interesting discussion Dave, thanks...

[vajo]

I don't think that this general classification of methods is correct. 

The smiths who took part on the RJT program made the swords in the way they have learned it. 

You can't say they where made in Kobuse or Soshu kitae or what ever without destroying the sword.

[Kiipu]

4 hours ago, Dave R said:

 I remember "Ryujin swords" (there is more than one firm using the name) mentioning going through the skin of a Gunto, after a Japanese polisher had refused to touch it, telling him it would just be a chunk of modern steel. In fact, it's the reason they did that very handy guide about Showa manufacturing methods, which now looks to have disappeared off the internet  I will post that again, and also 2 very handy diagrams about construction of blades, and apologies if this info' is redundant.

 

I was able to view and download the webpage in question via the Wayback Machine.  It was, as you inferred, a rather interesting read.  I for one am glad that you have such a good memory!

Wayback Machine

ryujinswords-tang-stamps-2017-1218.pdf

[Dave R]

1 hour ago, Kiipu said:

 

I was able to view and download the webpage in question via the Wayback Machine.  It was, as you inferred, a rather interesting read.  I for one am glad that you have such a good memory!

Wayback Machine

ryujinswords-tang-stamps-2017-1218.pdf 155.5 kB · 5 downloads

 

 Thank you very much for your hard work in recovering this article. One has to wonder why such a useful source of information disappeared... You now know where  I have some of my less mainstream ideas and opinions from.

[PNSSHOGUN]

11 hours ago, george trotter said:

Hi Dave,

Oh, I see, not RJT in three classes but gendaito in general. ..that explains it....yes sure, RJT are mid-level to upper level IMO.

I have not seen one (yet) with kizu or flaws, but who knows.

I have not seen Yasukunito with kizu or flaws that I can remember either, but on Yasukunito, I have noticed that of the 5 or 6 that I have had the opportunity to handle over the last few decades, 4 had badly rusted tangs. In fact they were "rotten tangs" from the nakago tip right up to the mekugi ana - only the tangs at the mei area were OK. Made me think that there was some feature of their tamahagane that was liable to rust. The two "good" ones Yasunori (naval mounts) and Yasuoki were very good. Anyway, like you I have not chased Yasukunito....but I do like RJT. Again, that said, I have to LIKE the sword, I don't just buy the 'type'.

Interesting discussion Dave, thanks...

Regarding the rusted Nakago, I wonder if it is related to the process of dipping the Nakago into salt water before placing it the Tsuka for a superior lockup? My other thought it was really just used hard and put away wet in the field.

[george trotter]

Regarding the rusty tang Yasukunito...I just don't know the reason. All I can say is I have noticed it as it was "common" on the Yasukunito I have seen.

 

Regarding the quality of RJT blades. I am no expert on any blade but have collected for a long time. I started in Koto/shinto/shinshinto years ago (see pic -  top to bot: Mino Kanesada 1700s, Kanabo Masazane 1530s, 3 gen Echizen Yastusugu 1660s, Ishido Mitsuhira 1660s, Shimada Sadasuke early shinto) so I know quality work when I see it. I went to RJT out of personal interest and can say that I think the work is very good. We don't know the exact details of course, but the RJT material, workmanship, inspection, testing process as set up was first class. I am not going to test one, but I think an RJT would stand up to one of the pre-WWII swords very well.

I have never seen a flawed one, but I have seen a few that just don't "appeal" to me. 

So long story short, I have to wonder where all these doubts and debate about "standards" of quality and not surviving one polish are coming from.

They are good swords made to do a good job...period. It seems to me all this chatter is just that (no offence intended).

[vajo]

Here is my small collection of RJT gendaito. I have swords of all periods in collection but my true love are these RJT ones. If you compare the swords you see how different they are. The quality is wide above from most of that what you will in other periods. Not one sword has a forging flaw. These are strong swords. Some have a brutal cutter design, others are made as fast fighting swords. I love them all.

 

[george trotter]

Yes, very nice Vajo...and not one sword has a forging flaw...same as my RJT swords - all excellent.

Thanks for the photo...nice collection, you are very fortunate to have them...smith names?

Regards,

 

[vajo]

Thanks George.

 

1. Masayoshi

2. Yoshitada

3. Munemitsu

4. Morinobu

5. Suketada

6. Okimasa

7. Masatsugu

8. Hisakuni

9. Akihisa

10. Morimitsu

 

 

[george trotter]

Very nice.

Is no. 6 the famous Tsukamoto Okimasa? - if so, I have one by his elder brother Tsukamoto Masakazu (private order, no star, made 4/17 - he was an RJT by then I think).

Also, is no. 9 Yamagami Akimitsu (looks like) - if so I have an RJT by his elder brother Munetoshi (64.0 cm, short kissaki, sturdy blade, made 5/18), and also a private order by Munetosh (66.0 cm, long kissaki, lighter, more elegant blade, made 9/16).

Although I also have a 69.8 cm RJT blade (the RJT scheme regulations allowed it), it is interesting in the case of Munetoshi, who made elegant swords privately, made shorther, sturdier blades for RJT scheme.

An interesting field of study the RJT sword.

Regards,

[vajo]

Yes George. It is Tsukamoto Okimasa & Yamagami Akihisa.

The swords have a wide range of size, weight and design. You are so right. It is really fascinating to study and compare the swords. The RJT program allows a lot of variations in the scheme of forging these swords. 

 

Looking on the different boshi and shape i find nearly all sword periods in that swords.

 

[george trotter]

Chris, you are very lucky to have those two smiths, Okimasa especially. All your swords are good and yes, I agree, if you look carefully in RJT, you can see many "styles" of sword in them...I love to study them.

Keep collecting,

Regards,

[vajo]

Thanks George

 

There are so many works of high rated RJT that i never have seen on the market and at the monent with all that covid restrictions it is not easy to buy and get it. I hope that will be better in the future. Some Jo-Saku smiths would be very exciting to have. But mostly they are all hidden in collections 

[IJASWORDS]

A little seen RJT (star stamp) smith is ENDO TOMONARI. Here is a July 1944 example, in premium RS mounts. It is in war time polish, which is very basic as are all war time polishes. But polished enough to see a wide suguha hamon, and hada. This is a powerful sword, that would give confidence to the officer who would use it. 

It would be stunning polished, but I tend to like swords the way they were found. 

[Bruce Pennington]

Dang

 

I do have one other Tomonari recorded, in RS fittings, but not as nice as this!

[vajo]

Wow Neil thats a nice sword. 

[Droocoo]

On 3/30/2021 at 10:02 AM, Bruce Pennington said:

Dang

 

I do have one other Tomonari recorded, in RS fittings, but not as nice as this!

 

Bruce,

 

Have you got a photograph of that sword?

 

Andrew

[Bruce Pennington]

8 hours ago, Droocoo said:

Have you got a photograph of that sword?

Just these 3

Edit: Dang.  The nakago seem to be the same sword.  Yet the open spaces in the ito, at the top of the tsuka look different.  Maybe @IJASWORDS can tell us if these are just older pics of his gunto?  Or am I looking at 2 different swords?

[IJASWORDS]

Bruce, same sword, Andrew is the lucky new owner. 

[Bruce Pennington]

22 minutes ago, IJASWORDS said:

Bruce, same sword, Andrew is the lucky new owner. 

Thanks Neil, I was about to duplicate it in my files.

[Droocoo]

Three is a crowd! I am going to embark on writing up the sword's history soon, after I learn a little more about RJT. I have been reading through some excellent threads here and on other forums linked from here.

[Bruce Pennington]

On 3/28/2021 at 9:26 AM, vajo said:

8. Hisakuni

Chris,

Is your Hisakuni star stamped?  I don't have any of his on file.  If it is, could you post photos for me?

[vajo]

Good Morning Bruce. I take a look this evening after work. 

[vajo]

@Bruce 

there is only the mei on the nakago. No marks, no stamps, no number.

[Bruce Pennington]

3 hours ago, vajo said:

No marks, no stamps, no number

Rats.  Thanks for checking!