What Does The Term "art Sword" Mean To You?

[Alex A]

I read it occasionally. Subjective i suppose. I stumbled across a sword at Aoi earlier, made me think of the term.

https://www.aoijapan.com/wakizashi-taikei-naotanebunka-1nen-2-gatsu-hi-february-1804

 

Ps, just noticed its on consignment, not mine and not sales pitch, nice sword though.

[paulb]

Alex

I think the term is used in several ways:

The first and I think most common is in describing a sword that goes beyond pure functionality to achieve something that is not only supremely fit for purpose but beautiful.

Remember the NBTHK describes it's function as the preservation of art swords. Traditionally made using traditional material and with aesthetic as well as utilitarian appeal.

 

The scond I have seen used less often but refers to more modern blades, shin-shinto and later where a blade was made purely as an aesthetic work and not intended for combat.

Having said that these swords are still fully functional and capable of doing the job.

[vajo]

Art - to bring them away from a deadly weapon.

[nagamaki - Franco]

 

 

What Does The Term "art Sword" Mean To You?

 

Greetings,

 

It means that no matter how many times I look at a particular sword the word outstanding comes to mind followed by a rush of endorphin flooding the mind, a response that simply is not there when looking at most other swords even as good as they might be. It means a sword that leaves no doubt as to the kantei questions of when, quality, tradition, school, and finally the maker to any expert or collector judging it. And then there is something more, a precision, a clarity, a uniqueness that sets it apart where the sword smith leaves you with the impression and even surprised as to the degree of, that what you're seeing was exactly as intended, orchestrated.

[vajo]

Greetings,

 

It means that no matter how many times I look at a particular sword the word outstanding comes to mind followed by a rush of endorphin flooding the mind, a response that simply is not there when looking at most other swords even as good as they might be. It means a sword that leaves no doubt as to the kantei questions of when, quality, tradition, school, and finally the maker to any expert or collector judging it. And then there is something more, a precision, a clarity, a uniqueness that sets it apart where the sword smith leaves you with the impression and even surprised as to the degree of, that what you're seeing was exactly as intended, orchestrated.

Hmm, then 99% of all other swords are not Art in the definition.

 

The NBTHK defines Japanese swords as an objekt of art. And this it is.

 

The NBTHK was established and sponsored by the Japanese government as a foundation in 1948 to save the Japanese Art Swords from destruction

 

So what is an Art Sword?

 

Btw Alex.

The hamon is really cool. Pure Art.

[nagamaki - Franco]

Wasn't the question "What Does The Term "art Sword" Mean To You?" 

[paulb]

Franco

you are absolutely right and your answer above is spot on.

 I'll  try and have a go but I'm not sure I can be as clear and concise. 

Sometimes when I pick a sword up I can feel the hair on the back of my neck rise, my heart rate quicken and I catch my breath. this doesn't happen every time or even the majority of the time but when it does it is when in my opinion all the features, shape hada and hamon come together in a balanced composition. Where each element compliments the others and the whole offers something far greater than the individual components. It is true that I see this more often in older swords, but then I tend to look at more older swords. I have had this reaction to examples from all making periods.

This has nothing to do with functionality, although on the basis that form follows function if the art sword did not meet the functional needs of a sword it would also fail to carry the aesthetic qualities I would be looking for.

As suggested above for me an art sword is a blade where the smith creates something that goes well beyond functionality and in the words of George Cameron Stone makes something "the nearest thing to perfection made by human hand"

[Carlo Giuseppe Tacchini]

Art Sword = sword that touch my soul as  "the girl with pearl earring" by Vermeer do.  

[BIG]

Here we go...

 

http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/index.php?app=core&module=attach&section=attach&attach_id=129432

 

Best Regards

[Okiiimo]

I believe it's effectively a marketing term necessary to justify preserving an aspect of cultural heritage to the western powers who had little understanding of the cultural meaning and history of nihonto as a result of the loss of WWII. I posit that by adding the label "art" to an object allows it to transcend it's original purpose to become an object worthy of preservation and study on the basis of cultural history, craftsmanship and form.

[BIG]

Think there are different ways to define an art sword...

Kantei by Tanobe-sensei. Mishina-sensei's decision to polish. Sayagaki by Yoshikawa Koen. Expertise by Mr. Hagenbusch.

 

Best Regards

[Alex A]

You could say that they are "worthy of preservation and study on the basis of cultural history, craftsmanship and form " without the word "art", but as antiques.

 

but I suppose your right in stating that "art" lends an hand.

 

Interesting point.

[Ken-Hawaii]

"Art is in the eye of the beholder" - in this case, my eye, & I choose to not let others decide what is art. But I know it when I see it, at a "gut level."

 

Ken

 

[Chango]

I know it's an art sword when the Kami in it "speaks" to me and convinces me of how important it is.

 

Too bad I'm so damn gullible!

 

Seriously though, it's the same for me as any object of fine art... I'm impressed by something that took great skill, time and technical knowledge to produce, something with history (recorded or implied) and that hard to define gut feeling I get when beholding something special.

[Alex A]

Hmm, then 99% of all other swords are not Art in the definition.

 

The NBTHK defines Japanese swords as an objekt of art. And this it is.

 

The NBTHK was established and sponsored by the Japanese government as a foundation in 1948 to save the Japanese Art Swords from destruction

 

So what is an Art Sword?

 

Btw Alex.

The hamon is really cool. Pure Art.

 

You raise an interesting point about folk referring to "all" Japanese swords being "art" swords. I suppose even kazu-uchimono could be described as "art", as it obviously took skill to make them. As you know, there are many schools known not for "artistic" merit but for their non-aesthetic no nonsense approach, schools like Dotanuki (I'm also a fan). However, whilst they are known for being utilitarian, a lot do have "artistic" merit, but compared to the example at the beginning of the thread, then how much "artistic" value?. Hard to put into terms so il try a percentage, 20%?. What artistic value could you put on a kazu-uchimono?, 5%?. Think I'm looking too much into this  

 

Again, back the sword I presented at the beginning of the thread, for me an "art" sword. The hamon runs high, I doubt any Samurai Dotanuki owners back in the day would swap before a battle for something this "artistic". Beautiful sword though, I get the impression that the smith went all out to create "art". Everything on that sword is INTENTIONAL, there is even some spots of what looks to be tobiyaki on identical distances along the blade. For me "intentional" is a key word, if I put this sword as a percentage, id go with 70%.

.

Its difficult to be precise on this subject and as Ken mentioned above "beauty is in the eye of the beholder"

[paulb]

Alex

In something I wrote some time back I mentioned a definition used by a very well known and highly regarded collector. 

 

1. All traditionally made swords may be regarded as art

2.Those that rise above the standard and offer the viewer something more might be considered fine art

3.There then comes those that go even further, challenge the observer and show the skill of the maker at the highest level (Back to Cameron-Stones definition of perfection) which he described as High Art.

Drawing a parallel in another field. Virtually every amateur painter could consider what they did as art, Those few that go beyond this and gain public recognition and appreciation through great skill produce fine art. Then there are those very, very few that are immortalised as great masters of their art. Not necessarily easy to understand and often challenging but a whole level higher.

 

If a sword is traditionally made it should be considered art, or at the very least a work of craftsmanship. There is then a considerable range taking it from that basic beginning to something much finer.

But who fits where in this scheme, once you get beyond the technical competence exhibited, is as you say subjective.

[FlorianB]

Interestingly I have struggled with this term many years ago.
This is - in short - my answer:

A smith has an idea of how a blade should look like.
Every step of his work has irreversible consequences to the final result. And the result could only be seen after polishing!
So: The better a smith controls the steel the better the result is.

An Art-Sword has to be technical perfect (including its function) and should show the smith’s intention clearly.
The aesthetic value results by what we see on the blade - shape, hada, hamon et cetera. And the aesthetics could only be appreciated by understanding how a blade was made.

There’s a lot more to say (and I have to stop myself by doing so) but I think this is the essence.

Florian

[Darcy]

Art object takes its definition from an opposite sense to utilitarian items. 

 

A blacksmith's blade, a machine made sword with serial numbers, poorly made Showato, those are utilitarian blades. They have no worth beyond their utility value. They are subject to destruction then since they may be nothing but weapons.

 

Thus an art sword is something that is simply more than a weapon, more than a utilitarian item, because of the skill involved to make one, and the subjective beauty it has, as well as its age and history. 

 

Rudimentary blades from prehistory are still "art swords."

[b.hennick]

I remember well, being at a sword show, where the display room focus was Masamune and his students. It was an exciting display but when I held one amazing sword, my hands started to perspire, my mind was exploding with thoughts of excellence, WOW, I can't believe this etc. I had a connection to an ART SWORD. Not just good sword but a great art sword that moved my mind and heart. It made me feel, "I want one of those". The other swords in the display were excellent but this one, to me, was above excellent. 

 

That one display caused me to look at my collection and say to myself, I would give all of this for that one blade. It took a few years but I did manage to get a sword by that Smith and later some other art swords. My high school French teacher talked about "la creme de la creme - the cream of the cream. To me at least, that sword was part of the cream of art swords. 

 

I set a goal, worked towards that goal, made sacrifices and reached the goal. I think that all serious collectors can do the same. I have to say that my goals have changed over the years. They continue to change as I am exposed to more and better art swords.

To help set goals you need to handle great swords (go to shows), join a club or clubs, find a mentor and read books. 

[Jacques D.]

Art starts from Jo saku level, nevertheless a kazuuchi-mono made by a saijo-saku smith is not art. 

[Alex A]

The first thing that crossed my mind when i read your statement Jacques was what about an exceptional works by a lower ranking smith, is that not art?

[nagamaki - Franco]

Art starts from Jo saku level, nevertheless a kazuuchi-mono made by a saijo-saku smith is not art. 

 

 

Jacques, 

 

Did you get up on the wrong side of the bed this morning? 

[Stephen]

Art sword=$$$$$$

[Jean]

In Art Sword, there is Art, which is a concept which has widely varied acoording the when and where through ages, concept which has never reached a universal agreement on its meaning... Every one will have its own definition, in no case it can be linked to a smith ranking. As we have all stated at least once in our collecting life, each sword has to be appreciated according its own merit (which depends of course of your taste )

[Jacques D.]

Jacques,

 

Did you get up on the wrong side of the bed this morning?

Swords are utilarian objects before all. Swordsmithing is directly related with the skill of the swordsmith, only the bests of them can elevate good workmanship to art level. Appeal does not matter in this subject, a suguha hamon with a perfect distribution of nie of the same size in the habuchi can be expression of art.

[Jean]

"Swords are utilarian objects before all".

 

They are not anymore and modern swords are still considered as art. In fact, if you take kanteisho, what do they judge if not quality? Now on mumei blades (O suriage), the attribution is only an opinion and even NBTHK is reluctant to grant upper certificate to chu saku smiths because they are biaised. Nothing can assure you that a Juyo O suriage blade has not been forged by a chu saku smith.

 

A lot of blades made by jo saku smiths and above won't be granted more than a TH kanteisho, same as for chu saku smith.

 

History interfers equally in the Juyo kanteisho.

 

So kanteisho are not necessarily a good way of judging the quality of blades.

 

From what I have read, Fujishiro at the origin of this ranking has selected 5000 swordmiths over many more than 30 000. This means that the last of the chu saku smiths was (for him) better than the 25 000 remaining ones.

 

All this to say that a blade must be judge as a art sword on its own merit and independantly of who made it. This one of the reasons why kantei is made tsuka on.

[Chango]

I think the distinction of "art sword" vs utilitarian sword is just semantics. The finest art swords in the world have likely (and still could) cut exceedingly well and who knows how many millions of cheap blades (of Japanese make or not) are on display as objets d'art in museums, businesses and teenager's bedrooms around the world.

 

So since today's swords really only have a legitimate purpose as display pieces (apart from occasional kata practice/competition for some) I suppose it's not a question of whether a sword is art or not, but whether it's good or bad art.

[Bazza]

Albert Yamanaka once wrote something I've never forgotten - If a Nihonto doesn't have sugata, then it has nothing.

I think this what Barry Hennick in his epiphany above (post #19) felt at a subliminal level.  We (some of us??!!) are wired for this.  It is what makes a top wine judge, or an ikebana Master - and katanakaji at the start of the smithing process and kanteika at the very end, with a togishi in-between.  I once sold a sword because it "looked clunky".  Didn't miss it for a moment.

 

BaZZa.

[mywei]

Albert Yamanaka once wrote something I've never forgotten - If a Nihonto doesn't have sugata, then it has nothing

Agree but as with the topic of this thread it is all in the eyes of the beholder. If taken for face value then you could say all Kanbun sugata shinto, or Bakumatsu Kinnou-to would have no/little art value

[Jacques D.]

Jean 

 

Kantei has nothing do do with art or good workmanship.

 

 

They are not anymore and modern swords are still considered as art

 

 

Japanese law is the main responsible of that fact weapons being forbidden in Japan, and a mukansa is not a mukansa for nothing....  
 

Now on mumei blades (O suriage), the attribution is only an opinion and even NBTHK is reluctant to grant upper certificate to chu saku smiths because they are biaised.

 

 

 

I strongly desagree with that. Shinsa attribution is a collegial one based on a consensus between several experts. True experts are able to see the difference between good workmanship and art; how many of collectors are able to do it ? very few

 

All this to say that a blade must be judge as a art sword on its own merit and independantly of who made it.

 

 

Agreed but only the bests can reach art level and not always for all of their production. Once a Japanese expert showed me 2 Rai kunistoshi side by side and explained me why one was largely better than the other. I must admit i didn't see all differences  but understood the methodology.