Not A Trick Kantei

[paulb]

Dear All

Below is a description and images of a ko-wakazashi. I would be interested in hearing peoples views. this is not a kantei, it has never been submitted to shinsa. The one thing I am fairly confident about is that it isn't by the smith whose mei is on the tang. I have blocked this out so as not to be a distraction. I have looked at this blade for some time and think I have reached a loose conclusion but I would value some other thoughts.

Dimensions and shape.

Sunobi tanto/ ko wakazashi, ubu, hira-zukuri,  iori-mune,. Slight sori.

Nagasa 36.5cm

Sori 0.5 cm

motohaba 3cm

kasane  0.6cm.

 

Hada strong and clear itame with some nagare. A great deal of ji-nie, and chickei which is very bright, dark nd clear. There iis muneyaki which also contains strong chickei.

 

Hamon Nie deki over a crumbling and loose nioi-guchi. A great deal of activity in the form of inazuma and kinsuji. The nie in the hamon is consistent in size dark, bright and clear.

Posted a lot of images as there is a lot going on throughout the blade.

ideas as to age and possible school appreciated.

 

 

 

[seattle1]

Hello:

 At the junction of Late Koto/Early Shinto, perhaps Shimada group, Sukemune or someone close???

 Arnold F.

[paulb]

Thank you Arnold

I dont know the Shimada group very well (actually hardly at all) but looking at Sukemune oshigata in Markus' koto volume his work is described as being predominently nioi based with a tight nioi guchi and no or very little nie.

This balde is very much nie deki with a lot of ji-nie, the nioiguchi is quite broken and frayed, certainly not what Iwould describe as tight, but this is more easily seen in hand than the images.

I also think Sukemune's Hotsure is more flambouyant than this piece which is suggesting hotsure rather than producing it, if that makes sense.

It's an interesting suggestion and Iwill follow it up with further investiation

Thanks again.

[Ray Singer]

Sue-koto. Reminds me of Kanabo work. Shimada is also possible. I find that many times schools which are described in books as nioi deki show plentiful nie when seen in hand.

For reference, here is an example of a Kanabo sunobe-tanto with some similar elements in the hamon. Clear differences are the long kaeri and the mune-yaki in your sword.
https://www.aoijapan.net/wakizashi-kanabo-hayato-jyo-masazane-saku/

[Alex A]

I was thinking late Muromachi Mizuta school (Hada, hamon and sori seem to fit)), although Muneyaki is linked with Shinto Mizuta school. (had to come from somewhere lol), best I can do.

[Ray Singer]

One other option I would like to throw out there is Kaifu (late Muromachi). Longer kaeri with mune-yaki is a trait. Nie-deki hamon and a coarse jitetsu. Hirazukuri ko-wakizashi are common. Their sugata can tend to be on the less refined side. Blades show a fuller, more rounded fukura. Nakago also have a resemblance to your sword. If I focus just on the sugata, I would feel better about Kaifu then my previous bid of Kanabo.

[Jean]

It is always difficult to pin down such a blade.

One thing sure is the era: sue Muromachi

 

When talking about ko wakizashi, at once Mino comes to one's mind.

 

The nakago can fit sue Mino, but the sugata lacks sori.

 

There is a Soshu influence when you see all these chickei, kinsuji...

 

Shimada school comes to my mind at seeing the mune yaki, but the nakago does not fit

 

Close up pictures showing chikei makes me think of Etchû blades.

 

 

Looks like Uda but the nakago?

 

 

As often, as long as the blade is not a text book, kantei is difficult ...

[CSM101]

Mizuta I would say No. And Uda is a good possibility.

 

Uwe G.

[Ray Singer]

Uda is also a good call. Hamon and presence of mune-yaki fits. The shape of the nakago seems right as well. Now that it was pointed out, the nakago shape is very similar to an Uda I owned. I can almost visualize a mei of UDA KUNI___ there.

[seattle1]

Hi Paul:

 I hope I wasn't giving you any misdirection, but I recently acquired a Sukemune wakizashi with a couple of origami to the Kan'ei era and because it is fresh in my mind and I had spent a fair amount of time researching that rather convoluted line it seems to have much in common with your blade. It has strong and highly visible itame of various sizes, tighter in the monouchi, with masame approaching the mune and the habuchi with much (!) very visible chikei. At the base narrow ko-gonome with ashi and sunagashi, then taller gonome, then smaller again and less well defined. It is in nioi but there is nie too.

 The line is one of the longer continuous ones from koto times well into the Edo era, and style tended to change with fashion. At one time they started with a Bizen focus, then were looped into Sue Soshu style, and a little later than my man, who is Fujishiro S475 on the right, there is some connection with Tsuda Sukehiro.

 Just rambling one; nice thread pulling in such varied points of view.

 Arnold F.

[paulb]

Hi Arnold

No problem regarding misdirection I wanted to hear others ideas. Already the thread has given me some avenues to explore that don't normally figure in my thinking.

What is interesting is the uniformity regarding period (relative uniformity) which is not far away from where I was aiming. Perhaps optimistically I had placed this in to Oei period work so around 1400-1430. The problem of course is that around that time and later Soshu was the flavour of the month and everyone was trying to recreate it. To be honest I am not a great lover of later Soshu work so haven't spent much time studying it. This has given me cause to.

I think most of the suggestions put forward have some merit and warrant further investigation. I think it also highlights how, as you progress from the end of the Nambokucho onwards, styles tend to merge in the attempt to recreate a popular line. I have said before by the time you get to Sue-Seki Sue-Aoe Soden Bizen etc. differentiating the base traditions becomes extremely challenging. This is particularly true with the second and lower level smiths.

I appreciate everyone's thoughts so far

thank you

Paul

[Jean]

Paul,

 

Yes, from the sugata it looks like some of the ko-wakizashi made by Yasumitsu. I was thinking to the one which was on the cover of Darcy's book on Bizen tradition, the hada is not enough refinedc

 

https://www.aoijapan.com/tanto-bishu-osafune-yasumitsu-1st-generation

 

This blade is tired.

 

Here is better hada pictures from from Oei Yasumitsu

 

http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/17414-achieved-collection-gokaden/?hl=yasumitsu

[Kronos]

Muromachi but I'm leaning more toward 1400's like you than later, maybe not as early as Oei. I'm not sure you'll ever get a satisfactory answer even from shinsa as with the second and lower level smiths as you say they all tend to merge together a bit. There's clear soshu influence but that doesn't narrow it down any so you may not get a better idea than a general quality assessment such as a number of interchangeable schools.

 

To me I'd want to rule out anything mainline and focus on rural schools as it has that country look, Mizuta seems like a very good call. There is also some form of sue-mino smiths making similar in nie-deki in the momoyama/early shinto and also the takada school.

[paulb]

Thank you all again for your thoughts it has helped to crystalise my thinking. I also have the  advantage to haing the sword in hand.

 

Starting with what it isn't. The sword is signed Norishige. I can spend a lot of time identifying things this blade might have in common with that smith but basically there are two immediate issues:

1. It is the wrong shape, there are no published examples of Norishige making this form of blade (I think because this form appeared some 50 to 70 years after his active period)

2. The quality isn't good enough. I think this is a perfectly good blade but is it something you would expect from one of Masamune's ten famous pupils? no it isn't.

So what is it?

• Based on the sugata I am still inclined to place this in the Oei period or very slightly later.
• Something that isn't immediately clear in the images perhaps is the darkness of the hard steel activity creating these large and prominent chickei. This has some similarity with Norishige but I think is too sparse and random for his direct line. It does however suggest northern province work.
• the other thing which stands out with the sword in hand is the individual very bright and dark nie running through the hamon. I have heard the effect described as "looking like individual pin pricks in white paper" which I think is a good analogy

So the shape is suggesting oei, the steel northern province. The nie fits descriptions of Uda work so I think there is a good possibility this may be what it is. As Ray says shape, nakago and hamon are all in line with this school.

 

Based on the sound advice that if it looks like a duck walks like a duck and sounds like a duck the chance are it's a duck I think that Uda is as close as I am likely to get at present.

 

However I intend to look in more detail at some of the other suggestions if for no other reson than to eliminate them. If I find more Iwill come back to the topic.

thanks again to all who contributed.

[Jussi Ekholm]

I would think towards Uda too. You can check good reference examples from early 1400's in Markus' Kotō-kantei (which I am sure you have already checked).   

 

I think this is somewhat the rougher "style" people think generally about Uda. I have seen so limited amount of blades in hand but I happened to saw very nice tanto of Uda school at NBTHK Scandinavia meeting. If I remember correctly it was by Uda Kunihisa and had very fine jihada, bit of opposite of average thought of Uda. So I think your blade would be more "typical" Uda blade with standing out jihada.

[Darcy]

All good answers and well reasoned.

 

Without zooming in on the photos and lack of strength in the hamon my first thought was Kozori.

 

The louder steel mixed in points to something Soshu influenced. Shape of the hamon made me think Mino. I like the Shimada and Uda answers.

[Carlo Giuseppe Tacchini]

My money is on late Muromachi Uda.