Rookie Questions - Is It Worth Getting Nbthk Papers ?

[Hill677]

Sorry for the Rookie Questions

 

I`m considering buying my 1st Tsuba !! 

 

It is being sold by Aoi - Art, it comes with Aoi estimation papers but no NBTHK papers.

 

Question:

 

1. What are Aoi estimation papers ? are they his guarantee of authenticity?

 

2. Would it be worth paying & waiting to have it submitted for Shinsa ?

 

3. It is attributed to the Omi school. Can anyone provide some history on this school

 

Thanks in advance

 

Cheers from Canada !!

[b.hennick]

Most tsuba under $1000 sell without NTHK papers. People often complain that the papers do not tell them much. They have a Higo tsuba that they think was made by a specific artist and comes back papered to Higo. 

If you have a $500 tsuba and you spend $250 to get papers I do not think that you immediately have a $750 tsuba. OTH, if you have studied a tsuba and think you know who made it and when it was made, you might want to see if shinsa results confirm your judgement or make you think more about the piece.

If you have a $250 tsuba. with papers, you need $500 to break even. I suggest that you look at the messageboard sales section to see what is being sold with and without papers. You would probably be better to buy a $500 unpapered tsuba.

[Hill677]

Thanks Barry for the fast reply.

 

The tsuba is just over the $1000 Cdn value and there is no signature.

 

Your comments make sense "if you have studied a tsuba and think you know who made it and when it was made, you might want to see if shinsa results confirm your judgement or make you think more about the piece."

 

Can you comment on my 1st question " Aoi estimation papers ? are they his guarantee/assessment of authenticity?"

 

Thanks

[b.hennick]

p.m. sent

[Hill677]

Barry PM Sent

[Brian]

No, they are not a guarantee. Just an advanced opinion. You can get a lot of tsuba at that price point.
Decide if you are buying the tsuba because you really like it, or you are buying a nice example of that school. If the school, then you would need papers to guarantee that.
OTOH, if it is unsigned, then the tsuba should always stand on its own merits.
It comes down to how much value you put in the school attribution.

 

Brian

[almeister]

Hill677

I am a blade person - not a tsuba person - however I have bought off AOI - They are quite professional !

An "estimation paper " (to my knowledge is done by the owner of AOI - he is very experienced Tsurasan )

I received one of these from a blade I bought from him , which included a hand drawn oshigata from him .

You have not provided link from what I see for the sale of the item ????

You mention the word " ATTRIBUTION "

Generally a professional dealer won't use the word "ATTRIBUTION " unless backed up by a certificate ?? As this is what the certificate generally states - if a certain mumei piece made by craftsmen/school can't be identified - they attribute the work to the school/craftsmen if considered genuine !

Many of AOI'S pieces are certified - however if auction/consignment they may not be , if you see on the listing " NO GUARANTEE " - that means exactly that - no certificate !

You can also always email them to ask further questions - you may however be asked to create an account with them to do so - it doesn't cost anything to do that !

"Edit " - this blade also came with NBTHK Hozon

Hope this helps !

Cheers , AlanK

[kissakai]

Hello 'Canada'

I have bought many tsuba over the last few years and have asked this question before but not on the NMB

I have been content with the advice on the NMB about my tsuba so I've never worried about submitting a tsuba for papers

This changed a few weeks ago when I had a Yamakichibei tsuba but when I asked the 'experts' it was a split decision on its authenticity

That meant (to me) it was worth putting it forward to be papered

I know the papers will tell me very little but I'll know if it is thought to be a copy

Paul Martin is the man to contact if you want it papered

 

Why don't you add the link on this post?

Aoi are 100% trustworthy and they will give you their opinion which is usually spot on

 

 

 

[Stephen]

 

 

Aoi are 100% trustworthy and they will give you their opinion which is usually spot on

  

might want to lower that percentage just a tad, no one is perfect,and Tsuruta san has been known to make a mistake on tsuba.

[Brian]

A BAD mistake.
Yes...even copies and fakes make it through sometimes. Everything not by a shinsa is an opinion. Sometimes, a very educated opinion. But that's why they call it an "estimation" themselves and not an attribution.

[Hill677]

I greatly appreciate everyone's opinions & advice.

 

Collecting is new to me & I don`t even know the basics.  Yesterday I learn the Tsubs I like in the Soten Style .

 

Here is a photo   "Tsuba: Mumei attributed as Omi school ‘the battle of Dan No Ura’"

 

Tsuba:
Mei (signature) : Mumei (unsigned) attributed as Omi school.

Length : 7.73 cm x 7.18 cm ( 3.04 inches x inches)
Thickness of rim: 0.39 cm ( 0.16 inches)
Jidai(era) : Edo period.

Special feature: The Battle of Dan-no-ura is carved inlaid with gold color.
Initially, the Taira clan overwhelmed the Minamoto clan, but the tide gradually turned, and Yoritomo’s forces of the Minamoto family defeated the Taira family in the Battle of Dannoura at March 24, 1185 and won the war.

AOI estimation paper
In Kiri box.

[Ken-Hawaii]

Hill677, please sign all your posts with at least your first name, per Brian's rules. Don't want to call you "Canada" forevermore!

 

Ken