Bugyotsuji Posted February 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 Piers, could you describe the kote and suneate that you returned as I am curious. Pity that you didn't take a picture. Do you think the owner would be willing to send you one ? Thanks, Paul. Paul, lacking the correct vocab I am going to have trouble, but just before I hit the sack, the forearms and shins were in wafer thin iron sections with little hinges, and the iron had Yasurime file marks. The Sune-ate looked really heavy, but were as light as a feather. They had flying iron knees, and a gorgeous square of red leather in the inner ankle areas. The designs of the elbow bosses were carved from iron, like a Katchu-shi tsuba, as were the backs of the hand covers. Not those lacquered pushed out rosettes that you usually find. The backing material was unused and gorgeous. The attached Sode were in large generous black lacquer plates, hanging quite far down the Kote, and with a curved draping shape to them. I was told that these Kote, sode and sune-ate were identical to those on a famous set of armour which was rumoured to have cost 1 Oku Yen some time ago. Will try and get some shots for you in a day or two, but I suspect these pieces will now be going to a bigwig in this area, who is directly descended from a Daimyo family. :| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted February 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 I would think a medical instrument for lancing boils and carbuncles. John Hmmm... yes this did cross my mind and it does make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kusunokimasahige Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 Well kunai came in a lot of shapes and forms, yours might have had a ring attached. Medical instruments were of course also used.. though this doesnt look medical to me since it has been blackened or either still has the wrought iron look about it. The quick despatch idea is not far fetched at all. Shuriken and te-ken also came in various shapes and sizes as well as the blow darts used... this is imho definetely shinobi related. KM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted February 15, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 Couple more pics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kusunokimasahige Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 yup definetely weapon related. KM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlo Giuseppe Tacchini Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 Might be a Bō Shuriken 棒手裏剣 http://www.baskweb.com/site/store/10528 ... uriken.jpg How feels the balance ? Looks ackward. P.S. Not saying it's legit and Ninja related. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Tait Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 Would this qualify for Edo Period Corner? Hmmm!? Actually, I doubt it's Edo, Taisho or Showa more likely - and it's got nothing to do with Nihonto either! but PM if you have an interest! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Tait Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 OK, Back on topic! Was the colour of tassles, attached to koshirae, significant in Japanese culture? This one is attached to a tanto. Is it possible to say anything about it without the context? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John A Stuart Posted February 16, 2009 Report Share Posted February 16, 2009 I have been told the colour of tassel on jutte indicated rank. In fact the jutte itself was a sign of status. Tassel on tanto??John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted February 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 18, 2009 Might be a Bō Shuriken 棒手裏剣 http://www.baskweb.com/site/store/10528 ... uriken.jpg How feels the balance ? Looks ackward. P.S. Not saying it's legit and Ninja related. Thanks Carlo for the link, and thanks to everyone else for offering suggestions. This afternoon I showed it to a rather grand old chap, a customer at the local Sword shop who is fairly knowledgable in these things, and his immediate suggestion was Kanzashi-kakushi, (Shikomi-kanzashi?) I think he said. Definitely an 'Eiri' 鋭利 (sharp) weapon and probably for a woman, made to be concealed in her hair ornament. PS Just had a search around some J sites and under the first set of pics here it says that her hair pins are actually concealed weapons! :lol: Warning, do not look if you are easily shocked! http://www.hobbynet.co.jp/orikomitirasi ... 1/cat_227/ And, "Hissatsu Shogoto-nin... Hide's Kanzashi" http://page6.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/f75142059 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hybridfiat Posted February 18, 2009 Report Share Posted February 18, 2009 My guess is Its a yari kanna, a small hand plane used to access the corners when doing fine fitting. They came in a variety of sizes and are still made and used today. The flat side curved away slightly and has a convex surface. Ive been trying to find a good original yari kanna for ages. They come up on fleabay occasionally, missnamed as ninja weapons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted February 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 Steve, I have been thinking all day off and on about what you suggest. I had a look at Yari-kanna sites all over the J web. What you say makes a lot of sense. There is a slight curve, whether intentional or accidental in the blade. The original bend in the iron haft/Nakago suggested that quite a bit of horizontal weight had been exerted onto the top of the neck and body at some time. These Yari-kanna tend to have a Nakago set into a wooden handle, I see. The haft of mine has some indentations in it, suggesting possible elevation of grip for gluing/binding/fixing within a wooden handle. One question pops into my mind. Yari in general had square or rectangular cross-sectioned Nakago, so what about Yari-Kanna Nakago? Mine is oval in cross-section, which would stop it spinning within a Shikomi Kanzashi, yes, but... would an oval be strong enough to stop circular rotation within a Yari-kanna haft in the hands of a Daiku or Miya-Daiku? Surely for a Kanna it should at least be square in cross section for maximum grip within the woodwork? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hybridfiat Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 I agree with your reasoning. I cannot give you an answer Im afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlo Giuseppe Tacchini Posted March 25, 2009 Report Share Posted March 25, 2009 Piers, have you run out of money or simply too busy to post new items ? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted March 26, 2009 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 Piers, have you run out of money or simply too busy to post new items ? :D Carlo, You never miss a trick! This month I have been in London and cut off from the 'normal' environment. It's been a fall-back to my second hobby, which is messing around with fast cars and racing circuits, interspersed with quick visits to antique fairs and auctions here and there. There is very little Japanese on offer, and what there is tends to be cracked or broken. Missed out on a lovely Satsuma vase at auction though! Tomorrow I fly back to the Land of Wa and resume my 'Shima-nagashi' lifestyle. The only things I have found so far for the collection are an 1860 'SC' (Special Constabulary) London policeman's truncheon and two tiny (overall length 4 cm) fully-working rim-fire... (edit, 'pin-fire', thanks to Brian for the correction) pistols, which were described by the two traders variously as 'fob pistol' and/or 'cyclist dog scarer pistol'. (Chatelaine?) None of these, however, would be suitable for this thread, so I have remained silent. Tomorrow morning I am planning one last flying visit to Bermondsey antiques market where I continue to hope to find some little overlooked Japanese Edo Period gem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlo Giuseppe Tacchini Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 messing around with fast cars and racing circuits, Lucky one. Stopped with that before electronic injecton entered the world of cars, go figure... :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted April 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 'Safely' (?) back in Japan under the flightpath of the Taepodong and now readjusting to life with a wife and resumed responsibilities. We had a full display on Sunday for the cherry blossom Matsuri on the main steps of Tsuyama Castle. I wore my 'new' Toppai Kabuto for the first time and it was well received. It is becoming clear that the better off Samurai would have picked and chosen what bits of armour they would wear for each occasion, a sort of fashion show each time, and they would have gone round commenting on each other's appearance and discussing the relative merits of their latest piece of kit / fashion accessory. Swords, their Koshirae and Tsuba would also have been part of this kaleidoscopic ever-changing display. Last night we dressed in full armour/armour for the Rotary Club dinner. The curtains on the big plate glass ballroom windows were pulled and there in the garden, in front of the cherries and the waterfall they saw us lined up under the spotlights, bowing in salute. We marched into the dining hall to the banging of gongs and drums, and the blowing of conches, where we did a full Tanegashima display, to the amazement of the 100 or so guests. There was Imperial family staying at the hotel last night, so the police presence was heavy and thus we were not allowed to carry real guns, or even set off the planned fireworks. We had to find replica guns; one way or another we managed to get about 18 for everyone to hold. This involved borrowing the display guns from a very famous castle near here, which only happened because of 'Ko-ne' (connections), and actually making some guns up from scratch. Some of the results were stunning, including two O-zutsu 30 & 50 Monme guns which a couple of drunken guests picked up and waved around. The bang of the big drums to indicate the guns going off was a bit disappointing, though. As we were changing, one of our group offered me a little Kutani milk pourer with a naval scene and a battleship on it, possibly ”Yamato” he says(?) （Two funnels... I'm now thinking "Mutsu"). He said he has the teapot that goes with it, and wants to give me that too. He absolutely refuses to take any money for it (them). Hoping to post pics when I get a minute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John A Stuart Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 Hi Piers, It would be great to see someone videograph one of your assemblies and upload to youtube or something so we could all have a look see. Sounds like a fun time even though less bang for the buck than normal. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted April 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 Hi Piers, It would be great to see someone videograph one of your assemblies and upload to youtube or something so we could all have a look see. Sounds like a fun time even though less bang for the buck than normal. John It's really, really hard work, John. The vans are loaded with trolleys and stands and Taiko drums, gun boxes, bags of armour/armor, flags and posts, Shogi folding stools, bentos, ad nauseam, and all this has to be lugged in and out of every venue by us poor suckers. I will see if anyone got some moving pictures for YouTube... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kusunokimasahige Posted April 8, 2009 Report Share Posted April 8, 2009 Piers, you are absolutely right! same here when we as Romans display, vans loaded up, shields, spears, artillery, tents and tent posts, wall postings cooking utensils, earthenware, shovels, pickaxes, armour, swords and especially the ballistae, onagers and other artillery pieces prove hassle. (thank god the Dutch society only has one scorpio) Re-enactment is fun but getting the stuff to where it has to be is often cumbersome. Great display story!! KM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted April 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2009 Yes, sir! And here are the little Kutani milk jug pics: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlo Giuseppe Tacchini Posted April 9, 2009 Report Share Posted April 9, 2009 Piers, I hate you... :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted April 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2009 Tuesday night in the gardens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted April 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2009 Henk-Jan, the feeling is mutual re your fascinating Roman stuff. It's wonderful, but we risk going even more off thread!!! :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlo Giuseppe Tacchini Posted April 9, 2009 Report Share Posted April 9, 2009 Oooook... Full "western way" tea set for 6 people (22 pieces), mint conditions... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted April 9, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2009 Carlo, have you ever drunk tea with that splendid purple Mt Fuji set? (Looking through the woods from...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Green Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Piers, That looks like great fun. I need to learn how to make the sandles. I know it's not hard, just gota start I guess. I'm getting ready to re-lace a nice edo armor that I have had for a few years. I've been laquring the tips, so as to get it through the holes. Lots of work. I wore my REAL edo Kote to an SCA war last year. They did not hold up to our crushing blow combat. Send more pics. Mark G Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted April 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Just WOW! Best place to test the Ko-te, though, I guess. Thanks for the feedback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlo Giuseppe Tacchini Posted April 10, 2009 Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Carlo, have you ever drunk tea with that splendid purple Mt Fuji set? (Looking through the woods from...) No, I use the traditional ones, but my mother and grandmother had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bugyotsuji Posted April 10, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2009 Embedded with the regular privateers (not Ashigaru) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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