dominnimod Posted June 24, 2016 Report Posted June 24, 2016 I have an old edo or earlier tsuka in extremely rough conditions.It is falling into pieces,literally. Rayskin falls and ito seems to desintegrate with air Right now i have it covered with a small plastic bag to avoid the deterioration go any further,but it feells like if i dont do anything it will end being a pile of wood and cotton. It really isnt anything special or expensive(yellow ito-black rayskin-corn menuki) but i would like to conservate it as i belongs to a full koshirae i have. I have been looking about laquering tsuka and i found this: https://sbg-sword-forum.forums.net/thread/36927/tsuka-maki-lacquering-tutorial?page=1&scrollTo=530272 Thoughs?Someone tried it with an old tsuka? Thanks Pics:
Alex A Posted June 24, 2016 Report Posted June 24, 2016 Hi Josh, can we have some photos? If its past it and literally falling apart, id say best to have a re-wrap with good quality Samegawa and silk Ito. Its good to want to preserve, but it must be in reasonable condition, but sometimes its too late. 2
dominnimod Posted June 25, 2016 Author Report Posted June 25, 2016 Hi Josh, can we have some photos? If its past it and literally falling apart, id say best to have a re-wrap with good quality Samegawa and silk Ito. Its good to want to preserve, but it must be in reasonable condition, but sometimes its too late. I uploaded the pics doc
Stephen Posted June 25, 2016 Report Posted June 25, 2016 Id ask some one in the business, not weekend warriors, myself included. We have a long list in links. To my eye what your planing sounds feasible, but that may cause problems. Does it crumble to touch? Then likely its a goner.
Ford Hallam Posted June 25, 2016 Report Posted June 25, 2016 In my opinion something this fragile should be best left alone by non-specialist. It's falling apart because it's made of organic materials that have dried out. To safely preserve it would require the advice of a couple of specialists in the various materials involved, wood, fabric, animal skin etc. There are various stabilising and consolidating processes and materials that might be employed but along with those the manner of storage and/or display must also be considered. None of this would be a cheap or quick option though. A new copy of the tsuka, using the existing metal fittings, might be the most practical approach. There really is no point in putting new same and silk wrap on a knackered wooden core. That way you'll have recreated the handle for the koshirae and can still keep the old remnants as a reference to what is was. And old but no longer functional parts are always useful for study purposes. As for lacquering it, that'd be like painting a badly rusted car body. It may look ok for a short while but with nothing stable underneath it won't last long. And you'd be completely altering the original appearance anyway, so what would be the point? 4
dominnimod Posted June 25, 2016 Author Report Posted June 25, 2016 Id ask some one in the business, not weekend warriors, myself included. We have a long list in links. To my eye what your planing sounds feasible, but that may cause problems. Does it crumble to touch? Then likely its a goner. It doesnt crumble at touch ,but if you handle it a bit you might find that some of the pellets of the rayskin have fallen,and the ito seems very worn too
Alex A Posted June 25, 2016 Report Posted June 25, 2016 Hi Josh, Il be honest, i don't think its as bad as you described. The only thing i see that stands out is the missing samagawa, maybe you buy buy an old piece from Ebay and patch it up, I had a similar problem a while ago, i spoke to three experts. All three suggested a re-wrap but one guy was willing to have a go at repairing it. Four months later i gets an email saying it cant be done, too fragile. I'm now at at point where il be happy just to get it back, its in Japan Actually, on closer inspection, one side is worse than the other, id be torn between just leaving it and getting it re-wrapped, knowing me, id just leave it on the kake with the good side looking out If, so, don't handle tsuka.
Dr Fox Posted June 25, 2016 Report Posted June 25, 2016 Josh With you on wanting to keep as is a piece of history. But as you point out it is rotting away, and will not get any better. Handling the item will of course accelerate, exactly what you are trying to avoid. But there are times when we have to bite the bullet, and accept an items life expired date. So where are you now!. 1. Strip and reuse core and fittings. (note Fords post!) 2. Have a new tsuka made in sympathy with the old, and keep a complete koshirae. Point: When organic items get to the point of disintegration, they do not reflect their former glory anyway, so little is gained.
dominnimod Posted June 25, 2016 Author Report Posted June 25, 2016 In my opinion something this fragile should be best left alone by non-specialist. It's falling apart because it's made of organic materials that have dried out. To safely preserve it would require the advice of a couple of specialists in the various materials involved, wood, fabric, animal skin etc. There are various stabilising and consolidating processes and materials that might be employed but along with those the manner of storage and/or display must also be considered. None of this would be a cheap or quick option though. A new copy of the tsuka, using the existing metal fittings, might be the most practical approach. There really is no point in putting new same and silk wrap on a knackered wooden core. That way you'll have recreated the handle for the koshirae and can still keep the old remnants as a reference to what is was. And old but no longer functional parts are always useful for study purposes. As for lacquering it, that'd be like painting a badly rusted car body. It may look ok for a short while but with nothing stable underneath it won't last long. And you'd be completely altering the original appearance anyway, so what would be the point? I know you are the expert on this so i wont go against you,but as far as i know,laquer might do good for its conservation, firstly unifying all the tsuka surface,sticking all together to avoid its deterioration and protecting it from external agents,and secondly,it will make it a tsuka that conservates its original components. This last reason is also the reason why i wouldnt be very happy at a rewrap,since it will simply end up being a modern tsuka, made similar to an old one that might have been destroyed in the process. About the appareance,im sure there might be non bright barnishes so it dosent look that glowy,however laquered tsukas don't look that bad.
dominnimod Posted June 25, 2016 Author Report Posted June 25, 2016 I have noticed that that both,tsuka and tsuba of the koshirae seems to have been restored at some point showing samagawa patches and new inlays I will follow your advices and simply leave it as it is, but keep in mind that laquering a tsuka have been done in Japan for ages,as it made them really resistant,in the case of this tsuka,i simply though that if its gonna end rooting away i could at least slow down the process Thanks everyone for your advice,you really make this a great forum
Alex A Posted June 25, 2016 Report Posted June 25, 2016 Hi Josh, i understand you don't want a modern tsuka. I think lacquering it wont make you feel any better about it
dominnimod Posted June 25, 2016 Author Report Posted June 25, 2016 Hi Josh, i understand you don't want a modern tsuka. I think lacquering it wont make you feel any better about it Yep,i will simply keep it as it is,and attempt the samegawa fixes if i get the chance,Thanks 1
nagamaki - Franco Posted June 25, 2016 Report Posted June 25, 2016 Agree with Ford, and add, understand that even if you do nothing it will continue to deteriorate for the reasons already explained. Outside of placing it in a vacuum, keep it out of any direct light especially sunlight, don't handle it directly (unless a need to), and in storage I would place in something like an empty scroll box with a tight lid, and perhaps even wrap the box in saran wrap to slow the exchange of air and moisture. 2 cents from a weekend warrior. 2
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