Japanese Antique Sword-A Famous Fighter's Sword

[timelag]

This a sword which I bought at a local place in China, which is the same as which is shown at Japanese temple, it is about 2000years ago.

[Mark]

without commenting on the item for sale please note some forum rules

 

You must sign all posts with your name

 

You need to list an asking price for an item if it is for sale

[Alex A]

Who is the famous fighter?

[timelag]

the fighter is Yoshichiro，and the same sword is at a Japanese shrine.

my name is Charlie, this sword is 2million usd

[Alex A]

Thank you. Do you have any kind of authentication ?

[timelag]

Nope, I bought this from a rural place, it is the same as national treasure of Japan

[Alex A]

Ok thanks, I will think on it.

[b.hennick]

Hi Charlie

I hope that you marked it up at least 50%

Regards,

Barry Hennick

[Shugyosha]

But it's not actually the National Treasure of Japan?

[Stephen]

wow thats a find of all finds ,,,,would you sell for one million,,,,sorry for low ball offer, its all i have

[timelag]

http://www.pref.nagasaki.jp/bunkadb/index.php/view/378

[timelag]

no, it is not exactly the one placed at Japanese shrine, but even the dimension are the same 

[Shugyosha]

So you're saying you bought a sword in China that looks a bit like a sword that's still in Japan?

[christianmalterre]

really really phantastic !

Indeed! :o

 

i want to purchase it!- just did but spent my last 3 million Euro i had in my portemonnaie for a old blind horse....

 

will come back on this great offer if someone will not crab it faster...

 

LOL!

 

Christian

[vajo]

Ancient Japan was influenced by china? The weapons were the same?

 

I have something that looks like the club of the first human. I know the place were a lot of these things lying around. Its called forest.

I'm a rich man 

[timelag]

there are two possibilities：1.this sword is from Japan, maybe a fighter travelled at China and left this sword at China, since Tang Dynasty, China and Japan had very frequent communication 2.The sword now at Japan is from China, since China has more advanced technology at ancient time

[timelag]

I am an ancient Chinese weapon collector, I found this sword 10 years ago 

[timelag]

The price is not a big problem, there will always be someone will pay for something at a price that others think unblievable, how can we judge the price for a national treasure

[vajo]

The shrine sword has a documented history. You find yours some where in china.

[timelag]

what do you think of this, I just pay half million for this roral dragon ruler 

[timelag]

sure, that is a problem, this sword has no ducument attached

[Marius]

To broaden our knowledge, here is an excerpt from Markus Sesko's Koshirae Taikan:

 

2.5 koma-yō-tachi (高麗様大刀)

The Tōdaiji-kenmotsu-chō lists two so-called koma-yō-tachi (高麗様大刀) which are no longer extant today, both with the supplemet “mounted with silver fittings” (ginsō, 銀荘) and a “silver ring as pommel.” Already Japan ́s earliest poem collection, the Man ́yōshū (万葉集) from the 8th century, mentions koma- tsurugi (狛剣) to refer to swords from Korea.*16 Some experts assume that these koma-tachi or koma-tsurugi were came to Japan in the course of the earlier imports which came greatly via Korea and that the kara- tachi were introduced somewhat later in the aforementioned course of Táng-Chinese ideas and goods (see picture 46). Others speculate that koma-tsurugi were imported from Korea but koma-yō-tachi refers to Táng- Chinese swords which were imported via the „old“ way over Korea.

Regarding the appearance of swords of that type we can orient ourselves on an extant specimen from Hirado ́s Kameoka-jinja (亀岡神社, see picture 48) and Ise Sadatake ́s (伊勢貞丈, 1717-1784) drawing (see pictutre 47) in his work Buki-zusetsu (武器図説) which is titled koma-tsurugi (狛剣). 

 

According to the transmission of the shrine, the sword goes back to a member of the Shichirō family (七郎) who participated in the conquests of Korea initiated by empress Jingū (神功皇后, 169-269). So it is assumed that he brought it back from the mainland. The truth of this transmission remains uncear but in direct comparison with the koma-yō-tachi entries of the Tōdaiji-kenmotsu-chō, the extant specimen of the shrine is a clearly older sword type. The end of the tang is bent back to a ring like at kantō no tachi. The hilt is of horn and we see – at least on the drawing – signs of a wrapping. The tsuba is similar to later kara- tsuba, that means it is not the classical tōran-gata-tsuba which one would expect at such an early sword. The koma-yō-tachi listed in the Tōdaiji-kenmotsu-chō had a same covered hilt wrapped with Kudzu and a pommel of tortoise-shell, and the scabbard had yamagata-gane fittings. That means the swords from the protocol are younger than the piece from the Kameoka-jinja. Maybe the latter represents with its “silver ring as pommel” a kind of intermediate step from the kantō no tachi to the kara-tachi. This leads to the speculation that koma-tsurugi were imported from Korea and that koma-yō-tachi were swords made in Japan based on Korean models which were already influenced by Táng-Chinese kara-tachi. 

[mywei]

I thought April Fools day had already passed?

[Brian]

Charlie,

It would be wise to get this to a recognized museum and get some form of documentation. Otherwise, all you have is a lump of iron that could have been made last week. Aging items is easy.
I won't comment on the item itself, but trying to sell an item of that value online is certainly destined to fail..I'm sure you understand that.

[Stephen]

You pay 1/2 million what...yen?

[Heringsdorf]

To me this looks like it was made not that long ago, and then it was aged to make it look old.

Two million usd for an undocumented sword of very questionable origin! What do you smoke?

[timelag]

Brian,

tks for your advise, i know that is impossible.to sell it via internet, i just send this picture out,hope to envoke some intetest of collector

[timelag]

You pay 1/2 million what...yen?

I paid half million RMB equal to 80,000USD for that dragon ruler

[vajo]

Timelag you are from china?

[timelag]

Timelag you are from china?

yes, i am at beijing