Always Edo?

[obiwanknabbe]

I was just curious about something i tend to see all over the for sale sections on Ebay and other sites?

Why is it that almost everything is marketed as being edo period? Was this a very prolific time for Tosogu production or is it just that people tend to over generalize when they dont know how old something actually is? Im just starting to learn about this subject so Im sure I will have many questions.

 

Thanks

 

Kurt K

[Alex A]

The tosogu is marketed as Edo period because its Edo period

 

The Koto period ended with the Sengoku, not a time for an emphasis on tosogu quality, so most was utilitarian and simply got binned, lost in battle or eventually may have been upgraded for more attractive fittings during the Edo period.

 

I remember looking for a specific koto fuchi a few years ago, I described it as looking for the holy grail back then , rare and was told they usually stay in Japan. I never seen one for sale in a year of searching and eventually had to get one made, all fun.

[Rivkin]

I think its a complex issue. First, in Meiji there was no need for fittings except for a few new rich and foreigners. These markets produced demand for some strange things that are poorly thought of today, however some of the pieces are among the best Japanese work.

Second, dating fittings is much more uncertain than swords. Many were not signed, the vast majority - undated. Oei vs. Momoyama vs. early Edo - is ongoing controversy; there are some examples with established provenance to shrines, but overall the evidence tends to be murky. Metallurgy can help (ko-kinko shakudo is different from Goto school, which is even more different then Natsuo etc.; Iron is also somewhat different), but it is destructive and outside of larger Tokyo Art/Hitachi Metals Co there is not a lot of work done on the subject.

Third, there is a large class of iron and kinko fittings attributed to Muromachi or Momoyama. They tend to not carry autograph premium (i.e. aside from first generations of Goto, makers tend to be unknown and never will be known) and can be had for reasonable money. In fact, they can often be found as a steal in a pile of tsuba at a Japanese estate sale/antique dealer at look trade meetup, flea market etc.

[Curran]

It took me a long time to come by a good early ko-kinko fuchi.

Eventually I found an early ko-kinko kashira that sort of matches.

 

I also have a papered and published silver ko-mino f/k from the Gifu Museum.  As thin as then are, I cannot imagine someone crazy enough to remount them.

Finding pre Momoyama f/k sets isn't that easy at all.

[Alex A]

Kurt, in regards to what I was saying, you might find this article interesting. http://www.nihonto.com/abtartuchigatanakoshirae.html

Average Samurai would have owned average fittings, ive added some pics of pre-Edo fittings (some good stuff in there too). Look at the simple fuchi and plain horn kashira (not surprising there is not many of those left ). From the Momoyama period things started to get flashy, there was of course more wealthy samurai pre-Edo that could afford better, Ko-Goto, etc. Good stuff was likely to get kept, bad stuff obviously not so likely.

 

Curran, be great to see those if you get the time. I was looking for a very plain, simple yamegane fuchi for a tensho koshirae (solid enough) like the one in the picture with the red saya, short in height at 6mm. Knowing my luck theres probably a bucket load being sold from Japan now. You may find similar Edo, but always have some kind of decoration and usually around 38mm, not 40mm, necessary for a late Muromachi clunker.