Tokubetsu Juyo Rai Kuniyuki

[Guido]

  On 1/17/2016 at 4:26 AM, pietro said:

Quick! Someone note down what he said about not being "too hard on newbies who are just starting", before he has a change of heart and edits his post.

 

I almost did just that after you wrote

 

  On 1/17/2016 at 4:26 AM, pietro said:

Again, commitment and conviction relies entirely upon having the money to spend.

 

but age has mellowed me ...

[Brian]

  Quote

Tanto 54 (George): The sword-daughter analogy is ridiculous. If I had any daughters, I certainly would not prize even the rarest sword as greatly. Once you have sold a previously loved sword, does it really matter what happens to it? Unless you are hoping to buy it back in the future. You can't protect everything, and the cold sword does not have a soul (some may want to disagree). Daughters and sons do have souls, and carry your genes.

 

 

In the world of Nihonto, the answer is very much YES.

There are not a lot of antiques out there going back 1000 years, still in great condition. And this is only because the answer is an emphatic yes.

The old saying "we are not the owners, we are merely the custodians of these swords for the next generation" sounds all cute and like lip-service, but for most serious collectors, it is true.

For the Japanese, even more so. And for many of them, they would refuse to sell a sword to someone who was going to abuse it.

I don't have kids. Never wanted any. But I far prefer swords to kids. They last longer too.

I don't believe swords have a soul. I do believe they are the perfect merging of weapon and art.

If you stick it out for 10 years or more, you'll probably feel like many of us do.

[Greg F]

I feel we are definitely just custodians of swords and that its extremely important to do our best to preserve them and a big part of that is who we pass on or sell them to. Thats why I think Nmb is a great place to sell as its more likely to be bought by someone who feels the same way.

 

Also enjoying this topic, Cheers.

 

Greg

[Jean]

I don't feel like this at all. We are custodians of all our belongings be it swords, paintings or anything else. We won't take them with us upon passing away. That's all. What is valid for swords is also valid for my silverware and all my belongings, I am very matter of fact and take care of all my belongings, not only swords. I have given in my will written instructions of where and how to sell my swords because they are valuables

[JonnyO]

 

and the cold sword does not have a soul (some may want to disagree).

 

I would disagree by saying that it is my observation that a lot of the men who made some of these works of art definitely put their soul into their work.

That is probably the thing that drew me most to Nihonto- exactly WHAT went into some of these works ( now art ) by the hands and hearts of these craftsmen.

To me, some are spiritual creations and a part of the life of the smith still resides in what his hands created.

But hey, what do I know?

 

Darcy's # 19 comments are like some of Markus's and Jean's-I must re-read and re-read them to burnish them into my brain- as a newbie. :-)

The knowledge shared is invaluable.You could go your whole life and not have the privilege of learning such nuances and History.

Thank you! Your words of wisdom are greatly appreciated!

[Tanto54]

Dear Pietro,

 

OK, let's try another analogy (for a guy who supposedly owns an Ichimonji, you've got me worried...). Let's pretend that Italy has a great Football (soccer) team this year (you have to pretend because they haven't won since 2006... I using sports because maybe you are more passionate about that than Nihonto). What if the Germans (an arguably richer country) offer all the Italian players thousands of dollars more to play for the German team? I imagine that many would turn the economically superior offer down because of certain intangible aspects. I also imagine that any of the beloved Italian players who did take the offer would be despised by many Itanians. I believe that some Japanese dealers and many non-Japanese Nihonto enthusiasts value similar intangibles in their Nihonto studies and dealings (and I'm not talking about simple xenophobia or nationalistic pride....). I hope that you will stop for a moment and consider some of the insight offered by others (e.g., Darcy, Curran, Guido, etc.)

[seattle1]

Hello:

 I have been to the DTI a number of tines and have always found the dealers to be helpful and willing to show their goods and answer any questions within the linguistic limits at hand. The DTI experience is an eye opener for any collector and it does not have to be a wallet emptier. If you want to handle nice swords and tosogu you will surely get your fill.

 For those for whom a trip to Japan is not practical for the time being, and if you want to handle fine swords you can attend a show in the USA where the NBTHK, American Branch puts on, as they usually do, a "meibutsu" type display of outstanding and educational items. I know of at least one Juyo Bi which was available for hands on study, and other Juyo and swords with lower designations, but always worthy of study, are there to be seen and handled. My admiration for the generous owners of such treasures who allow their blades to be handled by anyone in line from senior collector to the most junior novice is very substantial. Gimlet-eyed observers are always near by to minimize the risk of damage or injury, and all such sessions I have observed went well. I do not know if there will be a study session in Tampa this year, but Tampa and San Francisco, and perhaps Chicago, are usually on the schedule.

 Arnold F.

[Jean]

You know what? For me, Buying/owning a sword is like making love, the pleasure/excitement is in anticipation, once satisfied, the pleasure of owning fades away. I have studied my blades and keep on studying them. Once I know them by heart, I'll get rid of them..... To buy others.... And go again through the process

[Alan F]

I recognise that there was a lot of B.S. in my last post. Trying too hard to be funny and controversial, but failed miserably.

 

Tanto54, your first analogy was not really all that ridiculous. I understood the point you were trying to make. It ties in with what Darcy said about the unthinkable for a Japanese sword dealer: Selling a special sword to a "doofus", however much money he has. Please do not worry. My swords are very special to me, and they are very well cared for. They will be passed on to the next owner, or my surviving family, in the same condition in which they were received (or better).

 

As soon as I said that the sword has no soul, I knew that there might be disagreement.

 

I agree with what Jean said. At least half of the fun is in the pursuit of a particular item, and in the anticipation of receiving it. Sad that he said the pleasure of owning it eventually fades a way. But, that's just the way it is perhaps.

 

Eight of Darcy's ten keys to "getting a good relationship" began with the mantra: don't waste time.

 

Isn't the process of acquiring fine nihonto (and deciding what to buy), by necessity, a time intensive and laborious pursuit? For most of us, anyway. Unless your budget is not limited. Shouldn't even the snobbiest dealer in Japan be prepared to show a little bit of patience with his customers?

 

Pietro

[jesse]

Jean - So what your saying is that you are a Nihonto Ho???  

[Jean]

Jesse,

 

Paraphrasing "when I'm 64" (btw it will be true in a month and a half) "indicate precisely what you mean to say" by Nihonto Ho.

[Darcy]

  On 1/19/2016 at 1:43 AM, pietro said:

 

Eight of Darcy's ten keys to "getting a good relationship" began with the mantra: don't waste time.

 

Isn't the process of acquiring fine nihonto (and deciding what to buy), by necessity, a time intensive and laborious pursuit? 

 

 

 

This is all mixed up in a lot of ways. Pietro  .

 

Unravelling what you knotted up: it's business advice, it's not collecting advice. You're conflating the two. 

 

Second: as a collector you can take 50 years of going to shows, reading books, going to museums, and all of this before making your purchasing decision. That is certainly a time intensive and laborious pursuit. This is your own time. If you feel that this is the correct investment to make to arrive at your decisions, then it is. So the second degree of mixing it up is thinking that using time and wasting time are synonyms, and they are not. In fact, you may never ever buy anything and that is OK. You are still a collector just have not bought yet. But you will be a student for sure. 

 

You will find that for a serious decision everyone will expect that you take an appropriate amount of time. 

 

-edit- not going to get sucked down the rabbit hole.