Identification Of A Relatives Sword

[Hutt]

Hello,

 

Thank you for accepting my forum registration. My wife has inherited a sword from a relative who has the papers to bring it home as a WW2 keeps sake. I would like to find out whether it has any cultural or financial value, and if not, I'd like to learn how to preserve and care for it, for my pleasure.

 

I have spent a few days reading up, so as to not hopefully be completely useless to you i hope. Of that; firstly, could you explain how to remove the handle to photograph the tang, and what details you require photos of? I attach a photo of the handle as the first port of call.

 

Many thanks for your help.

[SwordGuyJoe]

Pop the wooden peg out (mekugi) and grip the handle (tsuka) at the bottom with the cutting edge (yakiba) away from the body. Tilt the non-cutting (mune) toward you slightly - the tip (kissaki) should be above the origination of you left arm (shoulder). Tighten up your grip and wrist of your left hand. Make a fist with your right hand and hit your left wrist relatively gently at first - if you over do it and the sword is not "stuck" your likely to pop it out and drop it. Increase the strength of hitting your left wrist until you feel the sword give way.

 

Once it is loosely in the tsuka, grab the ring at the top of the tsuka and below the hand guard (tsuba) and gently pull the tsuka off and voila! If that doesn't work and the tsuka is stuck on, let us know. We can help from there.

[Hutt]

Thank you kindly Joe, I'll do this tonight. What aspects of the sword are useful to photograph, excluding the signature on the tang?

[SwordGuyJoe]

Macro photos of the hamon (tempered edge of the blade) and hada (grain of the steel), and full length shot of the sword. Based on the fittings alone, you've likely got a showato (non-traditional sword made in Showa era) mounted for iaido - but I could be wrong. The pics will tell.

[Stephen]

Commonly known as civilian mounts

[Grey Doffin]

How to care for a sword, including how to remove the handle:

 

http://www.nbthk-ab.org/Etiquette.htm

 

Grey

[Hutt]

Right apologies for the terrible quality. It being Autumn in the UK the sun has set by the time I'm home. Attached are the best I could get with my iPhone. Thanks so much for your help!

[Stephen]

something hide, look up kizu in Japanese sword index. Does it have seki or showa stamp?

[Stephen]

might be wrong but...http://www.japaneseswordindex.com/oshigata/toshihid.jpg??

[SteveM]

You are right, Stephen. Toshihide (敏秀)

[Hutt]

So it appears there is some shinae near the base of the blade, the rest of the blade looks clear apart from some rust.

 

Is this a Horii Toshihide? If so does it have any worth in any sense? If not can I treat it as a normal knife and use some fine grit sand paper to remove rust and polish the blade? Any idea to condition the silk on the handle?

 

How would this blade have been made, any ideas to its history?

 

Thanks again in advance

[SteveM]

Is this a Horii Toshihide?

No, this is a different Toshihide. There is a noted smith by this name (Asai Toshihide) but your sword seems to be made by a different Toshihide (sorry to be confusing, but many smiths used the same or similar names). I say it seems to be different, but his signature could have changed over time. In any event, it doesn't look like any of the Toshihide signatures I've seen on other swords by him. Mind you, I only know this smith from the 10 minutes research I've done today with the help of Google.

 

Don't use sand paper on the blade. Don't worry about any rust on it just yet. Search on this site for tips on how to clean rust off. There is a very recent thread featuring a story similar to yours (rusty sword found in someone's attic). The short version is that if you use anything more abrasive than a towel or a wooden spoon, you will likely muck up your sword.

 

One of the gendaito afficionados can explain better than I can, but your sword is probably one of three types:

1. traditionally forged sword

2. mass-produced sword

3. fake sword made in some random factory somewhere

 

If its been in an attic since the war, then its a good bet its either 1 or 2 above (although fakes abound, from all eras). Since the smith took some time to add his name to it, and the date (1942) on the reverse, there is a good chance it is from the first group, and is a traditionally-made sword. In this case you should take good care of it, even if that means just keeping it lightly oiled so that it doesn't get any rustier.

 

You can search on this site, etc.. for information on the process and expense of polishing Japanese swords. The short answer is: expensive - maybe £1000 for a ballpark figure. For WW2 swords its an expense that may be more than the sword is worth - a labor of love, if you will. For the other bits of the puzzle; manufacturing process, history, etc... you can search this site and the internet at large. There are lots of resources for learning about WW2 blades. The silk on the handle looks OK to me. Its definitely aged, and its hiding some rusting menuki, but the wrapping itself is OK. No need to rush into any restoration work yet, until you figure out what kind of blade you have. One of the gents here can provide the name of someone in the UK who knows a good blade when he sees one. Once you know if you have a great blade, or a very average one, you can figure out how much you want to spend restoring it.

 

I urge you to fight the temptation to take the rust off using anything abrasive (sandpaper, commercially available polishing stones, etc...). The rust is fine for now.

[Stephen]

You can burnish off the rust with bone or old ivory/antler. or just keep it oiled, something caused the stress to bring the kizu. no lost treasure here, better to move onward and upward.  Just mho

[SwordGuyJoe]

I'd say it's real, but showato.  The part that is interesting is what looks like the removal of a seki or sho stamp.  Look at the variation in file patterns in the attached photo where a stamp would be.  I am not doubting or questioning your relatives story, but there would be little to no point to file the stamp away, unless your wife's relative was well educated in what the stamp stood for and knew that traditional swords (50+ years later) would be more valuable than non-traditional ones.  Okay - maybe I do doubt the relative's story if I am being really honest.  It wouldn't be the first time this board has seen "bring back" swords that aren't actually aligned with the story that comes with them.

 

[Stephen]

I dont think so Joe, corse file marks on both sides and even see under Hide...

we never did the date, dont look like it starts with showa..maybe wipe the other side down with some oil so we can date it

[SwordGuyJoe]

I've been wrong more than once today, so it wouldn't shock me if I'm wrong here too!

[SteveM]

The date on the sword is 2602 (二千六百二年).

 

This is the year according to the Imperial calendar system, and corresponds to 1942.

The imperial calendar system was a favorite of swordsmiths during the war years.  

[Stephen]

Thanks Steve ..should have picked up on that.

[Hutt]

Thank you all, certainly seems like it's not anything particularly special from your kind observations. Which are much appreciated.

In that case, I will take your advice and seek a way to maintain; rather than restore the blade and hold onto it myself as I personally enjoy it greatly.

 

Many thanks.

[pcfarrar]

If your based near Birmingham or Stockport you could bring it down to one of the militaria fairs. The Northern To-Ken society has a table at both fairs and would be happy to look at it.

[Hutt]

Thanks Very Kind, I'm in Bristol, but frequently also in South Devon...