Ivory - The Writing On The Wall

[Davis]

Good evening all

Here in the UK, the Conservative Party has pledged in it's manifesto that they will ban all sales of ivory.  It has since been confirmed by Conservative Central Office that the ban would be total and include antique items predating 1947.

 

When this eventually happens, what will become of antiques made from ivory or including ivory?  Will they cease to have a value or will their blackmarket value skyrocket?

 

Source - Antiques Trade Gazette 27th April 2015.

 

Mick

[Dr Fox]

I am also in the UK, and I can say the Conservatives have more on their plate than the banning of ivory.

British politics is getting the biggest rump kick its ever had. And its long overdue.

Me, I will wait till the end of this week, before I worry about the Tory manifesto.

[Davis]

Some politicians did receive a good kicking. However, the Conservatives are now the Government and have pledged to ban the sale of ivory.  They also intend to campaign for a complete international ban.

Mick

[IanB]

MIck,  Whilst I agree fully with an attempt to ban all post 1947 ivory trade worldwide, so far all the existing legislation has come to nothing.  What I cannot see is how extending this to pre 1947 will make a scrap of difference. Poaching elephants and the smuggling of their tusks to China and elsewhere will carry on without a pause. If such legislation is passed an awful lot of military gents will have to make do with Indian made mamaluke swords with plastic grips, concert halls will have to buy pianos with plastic keyboards and those with large collections of netsuke, okimono or even kakemono with ivory ended rollers will have families who are either stuck with them in perpetuity or will have to give them away. This is all reminiscent of the intent to ban swords - until they saw the prices some fetched in major sale rooms which made them blanch. They still haven't paid out fully for the banning of handguns so I suspect this will slip quietly onto a back burner.
Ian Bottomley 

[Davis]

Ian, Completely agree with you - you raised some very good points.  I do think though, that this will be put to parliament sooner rather than later.  There are too many high profile public figures who wish to court popularity.  They are on record as saying that they wish that our major collections of ivory should be destroyed.

 

New trendy thinking?  Recently Helen Ghosh, Director of the National Trust said that their properties have too much "stuff" in them.  Her solution, pack it all away and just have a few exhibits on display.  You can imagine the future, say at Snowshill Manor.  A collector makes the journey there to view the Japanese Arms and Armour and is disappointed to find almost empty rooms.  Instead on display is perhaps a single vase to stare at but you would have a bean bag to sit on!

 

Mick

[Guido]

They are on record as saying that they wish that our major collections of ivory should be destroyed.

 

Among them the Duke of Cambridge: http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/nature/prince-william-wants-all-royal-ivory-destroyed-9131140.html

[Pete Klein]

I believe it is very important for we all to emulate ISIS in the destruction of antiquities...

[Brian]

One way or another, elephants and rhino will go extinct. So it takes 50 years instead of 20...the end result will be the same. Destroying art and things that cannot be changed nowdays is futile and irresponsible, and will change nothing. Pete's sardonic comment is indeed a good one. We are this close to imitating those who we abhor.

 

Brian

[Pete Klein]

Thank you Brian.  That is EXACTLY where I was going.

[rkg]

We're already there - In the states, you are already required by law to deface artifacts if they are to be sold and they aren't politically correct (cut the fletchings off of Native American arrows if they were made from Eagle feathers, etc).

 

rkg

(Richard George)

[manfrommagnum]

The real shame in all of this is that legitimate elephant hunting is the only thing really sustaining elephant populations through the economics. Tribal civil wars are what had nearly wiped them out. Everyone is paying the price when the ignorant have risen to power.

[Stephen]

Maybe in a few hundred years Mother Earth will rid its self of the human virus. Nature rules! 

[Guido]

Maybe in a few hundred years Mother Earth will rid its self of the human virus.

There's a simple way to speed up the process. Any volunteers?

[Pete Klein]

These carbon based life forms 'infest' V'ger, interferring with it's intended functions and therefore must be neutralized...

 

[steve0]

The real shame in all of this is that legitimate elephant hunting is the only thing really sustaining elephant populations through the economics. Tribal civil wars are what had nearly wiped them out. Everyone is paying the price when the ignorant have risen to power.

 

Poaching is what is wiping them out.

[Stephen]

YOU FIRST

[Pete Klein]

Sounds like the first time I played Doctor...

[manfrommagnum]

Poaching is what is wiping them out.

That is not quite accurate. Civil wars and starvation warfare is wiping them out. A problem that has plagued Africa and india for over a thousand years.

[Dr Fox]

Among them the Duke of Cambridge: http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/nature/prince-william-wants-all-royal-ivory-destroyed-9131140.html

 

Now heres a family that really needs to court popularity. William will have to be a lot older, and the public memory a lot shorter, before his assertions of 'doing the right thing' will inspire.

[kusunokimasahige]

Though this might pose a threat for collectors, the TTIP and TPP pose a much bigger threat to us all.

[seattle1]

Hello Henk-Jan:

 What is the threat of the TPP?

 Arnold F.

[kusunokimasahige]

Well Arnold :

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/13/trans-pacific-paternership-intellectual-property

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/heather-gautney/why-the-transpacific-part_1_b_6598604.html

http://www.citizen.org/TPP