Vertical Storage

[Gasam]

Hi all,

 

I am getting a new safe certified for weapons storage by my insurance company. One of the main reasons for getting it is to store the nihonto collection thoroughly out of reach of children. I have 3 kids and they are constantly having friends over so our house is always full of kids and I cannot always be around.

 

I do not believe that any of them would venture to touch the blades, but with something like this I really do not want to take any chances. The risk of a kid being cut might be low, but the result would still be a cut kid, and I cannot have that.

 

The blades are all in shirasaya, waks, katana and expecting first naginata soon.

 

Can these be stored vertically? They are stored horizontally now, top of closet.

 

After reading the "oil seeping through shirasaya" post recently, I too realize I have been over-oiling the blades. That is finished with now however. So oil running down the blades should not be an issue I think.

 

Still, kissaki down seems the "right" storage orientation if stored vertically? Or?

[paulb]

Hi

Day to day my blades are stored horizontally edge up in fitted drawers. When I am away I store them in a gun safe. They are stored virtically, kissaki up. to date I have had no issues. However I do not keep swords in oil. After doing so for many years I felt that I was more likely to do dmage removing oil than I was storing them in a centrally heated house in the north of the UK. So far this has not caused me any problem.

[cabowen]

I would suggest laying the safe on it's side if possible to store them horizontally. There is a company in Japan that markets a safe specifically for swords and it is a horizontal one....You could set up a pulley system to aid in opening and keeping the door open if it is heavy, as most beefier safes tend to be....Of course it depends on how much space you have....

[Rich S]

I've stored my swords for about 40 years vertically (kissaki down) with no problems.  I do not keep them oiled; constant temp and low humidity make it unnecessary. Never had a sword (or any of my knives) show any signs of rust. Depends on your specific conditions on whether storing vertically or horizontally is needed; likewise with oiling.

 

It's 13 F and 0 wind chill here! Where's global warming when you need it!

Brian, sent us some warmth.

 

Rich S

[Gasam]

Hi again folks,

 

And thank you for your replies.

 

There is no humidity to speak of in Norway, and indoors temp should be an even 20-22 C.

 

Will proceed then with minimal or indeed no oil.

[Eric Santucci]

There are some great horizontal safes on the market these days. Try searching for MonsterVault (under bed safes) and Wardog safes.

 

http://www.wardogsafe.com/sporting-platinum.html

 

http://www.monstervault.org

 

-Eric

[Derek]

I keep my swords horizontal and edge up in a safe.  I mounted the vertical safe on its side, and I have no issue opening or closing the door, although I could see some people having trouble with the weight of the door.

[smicha6551]

I'd be loathe to take a conventional safe and put it on its side, unless it was a rather flimsy job - a 200 lb door swinging with gravity (the weight of my smaller gunsafe's door) would be no fun if it got out of control.  I've seen heavy duty safes that are horizonal so I know they exist.  I don't know your kids specifically but I wasn't a kid that long ago and I'd certainly play with them (and do something stupid) given the opportunity.  Much like with guns, attempts to hide them are likely going to fail.

[Kronos]

Plus it's quite easy to open a safe with the door facing upwards as you can get good leverage and simply brute force it.

[Derek]

Without going into specifics here, neither of those issues are relevant to me.  

In my case, a $300 vertical safe on its side is better than not buying a $3000 horizontal safe.....

[Derek]

And if you are willing to spend $3000 plus, I would buy this:

 

http://www.browning.com/products/catalog/gunsafes/detail.asp?fid=025F&cid=160&tid=298032

 

 

Very nice.

[cabowen]

Have a look at these "job site boxes" that they sell at Home Depot, etc. 16 gauge steel, covered lock bays....16 cubic feet of storage.....They would be tough to get into....Usually around $300-$400....

 

 

[Eric Santucci]

The horizontal safes I posted are also designed for small areas ( under bed, in a closet, etc). This makes them desirable for those that don't have a lot of space to store items and can't fit a large several hundred pound (or 1,000 pound safe like that Browning) in their rooms. (By the way, I do agree that Browning is nice if you have the space and the infrastructure to support it).

 

The MonsterVault safes are reasonably priced. They essentially run around $300 or there about depending where you get them from. The Wardog, on the other hand, is considered top of the line by many and thus the hefty price tag.

[Brian]

Tachi were stored vertically, and they didn't melt or spontaneously combust. I suggest that storing a sword vertically is more of a problem for tradition than any other problems, as long as there is no excess oil. I store some of mine in my rifle safe, and so far they are still in one piece and uncorroded. Do what you need to do with your circumstances, and you will be fine.

 

Brian

[cabowen]

Not true. Tachi were displayed vertically but they weren't stored that way....At least I have never seen a "tachi-dansu" that held the tachi vertically...Katana-dansu, the traditional storage chest for swords (all swords it seems) hold the blades in a horizontal position. Tachi or katana, the blades are stored in shirasaya and placed in a horizontal position in a katana-dansu. There is a reason for this- to keep the oil from pooling in the end of the saya. Japan is a very humid country and oil is a necessity. If you don't need to keep oil on the blade, it doesn't really matter. It is tradition. There are many traditions associated with sword use, care, and keeping. You can pick which you wish to follow I suppose, whatever is convenient.

[Gokaden]

I would store the blades (if in vertical storage) with the Kissaki up.

 

If you dont oil the blade its ok. (Kissaki up or down not matter, but Kissaki down in old times means you commit to fight to the death)

 

Kissaki up:  If you do oil the blade it will slowly gather around your habaki area.

[Gokaden]

At 6:32 Sasaki Sensei opens his safe and I am pretty sure he has them stored vertically (with the Kissaki up).

 

Sasaki Sensei use the old style of live-in apprentices. He opens the door to any who wants to learn this ancient technique.

 

Here we see two young rivals, Yuichi and Yuki, undergo the fierce and sometimes humorous apprenticeship, hoping to win the big contest that can make or break their future as an independent polisher

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keKlbOwB1xE

[cabowen]

Keep in mind that a polisher generally moves blades through his safe in a rather regular progression. They usually aren't stored there for a long time....No doubt there are exceptions though...

[rkg]

So let's back up.  What threats are you concerned about?  Fire, theft (and by whom),  just keeping the kids from playing with the pieces (under the assumption they wouldn't actually make a serious attempt to get to them), or...? 

 

Best,

 

rkg

(Richard George)

[Gokaden]

I looked att the video again and this time I am sure he had MOST blades in that safe with the Kissaki down...too much Sake last night!

[Edfest]

I had the same concern with my children, so I put a lock on my closet... $15. One of those gate latches with a small padlock keeps curious children curtailed.

[Gasam]

Indeed my first concern were kids getting at the swords. Maybe not so much own kids, but kids that visit and perhaps decided they wanted to see the "Samurai Swords".

Small chance they would do it, I think, but possible dire outcome, so felt need to do something.

 

At any rate: small 5-7 rifles gun safe installed, bolted to floor and swords wiped down and now safe (pun intended)