Oil Stains On Shirasaya

[Grover]

Hi

 

I have a Sukesada wakazashi in Shirasaya and when looking at it the choji oil seems to be sweating out of the saya, that is there are oil stains on the outside of the shirasaya.  Is this ok should I be concerned?  I live in a hot climate in the Southern Hemisphere and the swords are in a safe.

 

Cheers Steve 

[Lance]

That does seem unusual,   assuming it's made from traditional Honoki wood and without actually seeing it my guess would be too much oil on the blade. If it's in your safe vertically? the oil could run down the blade and pool in certain areas. 

 The main  concern I could think of would be a chance for dust  to get caught in the oil, and scratch the blade wihen removing or inserting the blade in the saya. I'd try using  a lighter coat of oil  on it and keep an eye on it for a while. 

 

Hope this is of some use.

 

 

Regards,

Lance

[Jean]

Steve,

 

What are you fearing exactly. I don't see the problem. Have a new one done, if you are worrying. Few chances that the oil goes through it. Takes century to have oil pouring out of the shirasaya and with a blade dripping oil... How old is it?

[Grover]

Thanks for that.  My main concern was if the saya became unable to breath.  The sword belongs to a friend and I want to make sure it is kept as best as possible.  None of my shiraysayas are showing stains.  Maybe too much oil on my behalf I will keep an eye on it.  Getting another made is not easy best place to go for me is Australia and I am not sure if there is someone down there that does shirasayas it would be good to know if there is.

 

Thanks again I will stop stressing over this for now.  I have attached a pic of the saya.

[Grey Doffin]

Hi Steve,

There would have to have been a pile of oil on the blade for the oil to have so noticeably passed through the wood of the saya; seems more likely that the stain came from outside (oil on hands maybe?).

Grey

[Grover]

Grey

 

Thansk for that I guess it is possible that I may have spilt oil on the outside of the saya at some time.  I kinda didnt think that there was a problem but I always remember "the only stupid question is the one you dont ask".

 

Cheers mate

 

Steve

[nagamaki - Franco]

Hello, time ago a sword returned from (Japan) polish came back saturated with oil which soaked through the saya. In time after removing excess oil the stains on the outside of the saya blended in as the wood darkened and went away (evaporated I would imagine). Initially it was a worry as the saya had a new sayagaki, but no problems in the end.

[Jean]

Why do you oil the blade? Is the weather damp? If not, inside a safe, don't oil it. Hot weather does not mean anything for Nihonto. Damp is everything.

[kazarena]

Steve,

 

I had the same problem a couple of years ago. I was worried it would permanently give a reasonably new shirasaya an unpleasant appearance, not to mention other issues. But then while I was looking for solutions the spot disappeared, like Franco described it above: partially blended, partially evaporated but the difference in the colour was gone.

 

Since then I'm trying to be more careful and not to leave excessive oil on the blade. As I recall now, this problem appeared a couple of years after I started storing swords vertically. My guess was that I was always putting too much oil in the past but it wasn't an issue for horizontal storage.

 

Regards,

Stan

[bubba-san]

It does look like it was handled by someone who had oily hands . The wood itself does not look like honika wood , it has a grain like oak .?

 

 

There also could be a problem with the type of oil that was used .. It may have been some sort of machine oil , possibly a penetrating oil .

 

 

I would try and clean it with denatured alcohol , it leaves no residue . Will remove most oil residue. You can also use a 3 m pad fine grit to clean as it leaves nothing to scratch sword . Just a few idea ..... James

[Ken-Hawaii]

If you're in Papua, Steve, the last thing you want is for the wood to "breathe." The humidity there is even worse than here in Hawaii, & although I wouldn't suggest oiling the shirasaya on purpose, I also wouldn't worry much about some oil on the exterior, either. And, yes, the tsuka area mark was caused by oil on the hands - it looks exactly like what my bokken shows after I've sanded it down & handled it a bit. Not a worry at all.

 

Ken

[Darcy]

There are two things that can contribute to this outside of oil coming from the outside. One is someone constantly putting too much oil on the blade, and then storing it vertically. It does indeed pool and can come out, I've seen it on a blade I sold and then came back from the owner soaked through. 

 

Secondly depending on how the wood is cut, the oil will wick along the grain. Some grain being more porous than others, so it can give you an expressway to exiting. If the grain is aligned with the sword (a well made shirasaya from a top piece of wood) then it is a lot harder because the oil has to travel a longer distance and can only exit out the end. The total cross section of oil exposed to the end grain then is the same as the cross section of the sword: very small, less than a square inch, and as mentioned a long way to travel. It can't travel sideways through the grain.

 

In this particular shirasaya all of the oil seems to be gathered along an area that is showing kind of an angled cut through the grain of the wood, there are bands and rings in that area. That grain is going to align with end grain flush against the surface of the sword for looks like about 4 or 5 inches long by an inch wide maybe. So about 5 times the surface area, and a shorter distance to pass horizontally through the wood where this grain is exposed. That equals a lot more oil coming out. 

 

Furthermore, grain aligned end-against-surface of the sword, means that as you push the sword into the shirasaya you are compressing the oil between the flat part of the sword and the end grain, so quite literally shoving it right into the end grain under pressure if indeed there is pressure. Either way I think it is doomed, either loose with oil slowly flowing down standing vertically, or tight, every time over oiled and getting the oil pushed into the grain under pressure. 

 

It wouldn't be an issue if the sword were not soaked.

 

Only way to know where it came from is by splitting the shirasaya and having a look inside.

 

If it is just on the outside it can be removed or just the surface brought down a bit (don't use sandpaper) to take it off.  

[cabowen]

There is a reservoir cut into the very end of the inside of the shirasaya that is there to collect oil. If you apply a lot of oil and store the blade vertically, it will indeed eventually pool there and soak through, exactly as this has.

[Grey Doffin]

Hi Steve,

Looks like you're using way too much oil.  2 or 3 drops on a folded tissue is all that is necessary, and once you've applied that much you grab a dry tissue and wipe off most of what you just applied.  The tiny bit left on the blade is all that is necessary to protect it.

Grey

[w.y.chan]

Often assume it is the quantity of oil used but in my experience it is also the quality of wood and quality of oil. All my swords are in shirasaya but some tend to easily stain by oil easier than other, in that I mean a minimum of contact with oil can cause it to stain and remain there for a very long time. Some oil seems less resistance to drying. There is a brand call "Masamune" oil that is heavy and remains fresh even weeks after its been applied on blade.

 

Wah