aikuchi koshirae

[Darcy]

I am going to have some koshirae made for an Awataguchi tanto. I have very nice Yoshioka Aoi mon mitokoromono for it.

 

I am considering something that will be simple black with gold Aoi mon on it, something very formal. It brings up the question for me, the gold lacquer types that often come up like this:

 

 

What's the usage situation for this type of koshirae? Tokugawa stated regulations for duty saya being black lacquer with family mon the only ornamentation. But this type of presentation seems a lot more frequent than that. I can go either way with this, and am interested in a bit of discussion on aikuchi to sow the seeds of which direction I am going to go on this. My major goal is treating the subject matter (Awataguchi Yoshimitsu) with appropriate dignity and respect.

[Pete Klein]

Guido is the go to guy on this topic but I'll put in my two cents. The restrictions on koshirae were primarily for the Shogun's court. Daimyo had private and social use koshirae which ran the gamut of designs and could be very ornate. The merchant class also wore these ornate koshirae with their 'Sho To', short swords (they, of course were not allowed to wear the 'Dai To') and as they were often wealthier than the Daimyo they supported the Machibori fittings makers along with all the ancillary artists involved in koshirae fabrication.

 

For anyone interested in lacquer/maki-e technique this is a good video from the Takeshi Art Beat series:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oGqsN8M3iEg

 

PS: I LOVE this one too:

I need to win the lottery already...

[Guido]

As Pete said, both types of lacquer – kurorōiro and kinnashiji – are appropriate. Also, putting both kozuka and kōgai on an aikuchi tantō is certainly not unheard of, but usually done with tantō on the longish side, i.e. sunnobi tantō; it's a matter of overall balance.

 

Having said that, and assuming that the Awataguchi tantō is of average length for this school, and the mitokoromono shakudō nanako with gold, a saya done in kinnashiji might make the koshirae look a little bit crowded and unbalanced due to the black-gold contrast (see attachment). I therefore would stick with the initial plan of black lacquer and black horn fittings.

[Pete Klein]

As I mentioned, THE Go To Guy! LOL

[Darcy]

It's not a massive tanto at 22cm so I might be into finding a different set of mitokoromono then.... well just menuki and kozuka.

 

I'm a sucker for the bling but trying to do the right thing, makes me lean towards the black lacquer.

 

Thank you guys much for the guidance.

 

If I do replace the mitokoromono selection for it, well ... will have a very nice Yoshioka mitokoromono for sale lol. Or else have to buy an Akihiro.

[Brian]

Wow...Pete and Guido

Agree with Guido, especially with the clear composite he presented. Whatever you go for, looking forwardto the pics.

Pete, watched the video and can only say it is mindblowing to watch an artist like this at work. Anyone who thinks good makie is overpriced, just has to watch that and they will realize how underpriced it is.

Wonder if he even takes new commisisons nowdays, and how much of his work is koshirae related. I bet it would be very little.

 

Brian

[paulb]

Can I place a vote for the black lacquer option?

I think with a blade of such quality, and they dont get any better than Yoshimitsu, I would be concerned about overwhelming the quiet beauty of such a work with excessive bling.

Nothing at all wrong with the examples posted but the blade desrves the right to be appreciated in all of its quiet elegance without being overpowered by its surroundings.

to be honest for me a good shirasaya and habaki would be enough

(BTW my dress sense is equally unimaginative so overall my opinion is probably of little value!)

[Guido]

Or else have to buy an Akihiro.

The refinement of an Awataguchi blade complimented by a predominantly gold koshirae, and the boldness of a Sōshū blade contrasted by a predominantly black koshirae: perfect! At least IMO.

[Bugyotsuji]

Despite my double misgivings over the soundtrack and Beat Takeshi, that was well worth watching. Good find, Pete.

[Eric H]

Kinnashiji Aikuchi koshirae for JuTo tanto Awataguchi Kuniyoshi 22.2 cm

Btw this very same koshirae pictured by Pete Klein was used once for a Toshiro Yoshimitsu tanto....what a coincidence.

 

Eric

[Pete Klein]

Sorry, I forgot the link on that koshirae: http://www.nihonto.com/11.1.12.html

[Darcy]

Not getting any easier here.

 

Beat Takeshi, oddly enough I bumped into him at my hotel in Tokyo last time. Well not quite bumped in more like he and his security detail swooped by lol.

[nihonto1001]

How about an excellent shirasaya with horn inlay and sayagaki by Tanobe, along with a Premium++ habaki?

[Darcy]

Also the video was really interesting, just finished it now. Increased my respect for what these guys do. It can be easily missed in considering the sword and fittings metalwork but it is an equally important art in the big picture.

[Ed]

Darcy,

For what it is worth, I think I would focus on the overall aesthetic.

Whether you choose black or gold is personal preference and either would be nice.

 

Your black and gold mitokorimono would go nicely with the black theme but not so much with the gold (Guido's photo).

Although, I too feel that it may be a bit too much bling and visually overshadow the blade.

 

If it was my choice, I'm with Guido, I would go with the gold. A simple, yet elegant koshirae to compliment, not overshadow such an amazing Tanto. Note your original photo, the one on Fred's site and the one Eric posted, all elegant but not overstated. Even Fred's with the kozuka, it matches well and does not detract from the overall aesthetic, simple elegance.

 

 

And if you just can't decide, send it to me and I will alleviate your need to worry about it. Always willing to help a friend.

[Curran]

The refinement of an Awataguchi blade complimented by a predominantly gold koshirae, and the boldness of a Sōshū blade contrasted by a predominantly black koshirae: perfect! At least IMO.

 

Add vote to Guido & Ed opinion.

Initial koshirae that started this thread was a Maeda mon koshirae with what looks like Kaga Goto Shishi? Imagination sees someone of position in Kanazawa carrying that around. What was the blade? Something refined but nice with a suguha temperline?

 

As Guido said and as counterpoint on the Kaga-Maeda theme, I hoped to pick up a Soshu or Bizen w/ choji tanto to my personal liking and have it mounted in simple black with these [attached photo]. They are slightly smaller than norm, I presume always intended for a tanto. Haven't found the tanto yet. Ones at the level I want usually seem to have koshirae.

 

___________________________________

Darcy- looking forward to seeing the O-Sa tanto w/ koshirae.

Only saw a little of it in Tokyo, and appreciated it.

[Eric H]

Masamune koshirae

 

Eric

[rkg]

Good Guess, Curran :-)

 

http://home.teleport.com/~rkg/photos/yasu_front.jpg

 

I always thought the menuki were mainline Goto, but I'm no expert.

 

:-)

 

rkg

 

 

 

The refinement of an Awataguchi blade complimented by a predominantly gold koshirae, and the boldness of a Sōshū blade contrasted by a predominantly black koshirae: perfect! At least IMO.

 

Add vote to Guido & Ed opinion.

Initial koshirae that started this thread was a Maeda mon koshirae with what looks like Kaga Goto Shishi? Imagination sees someone of position in Kanazawa carrying that around. What was the blade? Something refined but nice with a suguha temperline?

 

[Darcy]

Oddly enough everything got confused for me because I had located really nice Goto dragons attributed to the 4th generation and was going to use those. I decided that I would try to not be an impulse buyer and walked around and checked every table at the Dai Token Ichi. This was on the third day. I figured they were sitting there three days they would sit for one more hour. Came back said I wanted to buy the dragons and they were gone.

 

Friend suggested using the Hisanori futatokoromono. I thought then maybe those were a bit too vivid for this. So ended up on the Yoshioka mitokoromono without giving a lot of thought to the size. Got some pushback on various fronts that it might be overkill.

 

Now kind of back to the drawing board but with commitments to various fittings already made and/or paid for.

 

Anyone want a nice Juyo level Yoshioka Aoi mon mitokoromono? Now I have too many mitokoromono. I am going to let this simmer for a bit, go back to Tokyo and look around again and see. I think the input may be correct that mitokoromono is overkill so will poke around and see where my nose leads me.

 

This is the other shishi on the Yasumitsu tanto.

[Darcy]

Eric, thank you, that was my original thought and I couldn't locate anything that was close to what I was thinking. So into the photo archive that goes.

[Stephen]

Recived this email on OP

I did not click on link and suggest you not as well....was wondering if anyone else recived this letter.

 

Nihonto Message Board • View topic - aikuchi koshirae

susan fortescue to you show details

 

 

 

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=20706

 

Nihonto Message Board • View topic - aikuchi koshirae

 

I am going to have some koshirae made for an Awataguchi tanto. I have very nice Yoshioka Aoi mon mitokoromono for it.

 

I am considering something that will be simple black with gold Aoi mon on it, something very formal. It brings up the question for me, the gold lacquer types that often come up like this:

 

Image

 

What's the usage situation for this type of koshirae? Tokugawa stated regulations for duty saya being black lacquer with family mon the only ornamentation. But this type of presentation seems a lot more frequent than that. I can go either way with this, and am interested in a bit of discussion on aikuchi to sow the seeds of which direction I am going to go on this. My major goal is treating the subject matter (Awataguchi Yoshimitsu) with appropriate dignity and respect.

[Darcy]

Stephen, some context to that would be awesome. As is... huh? :?

[Stephen]

Darcy,,

 

its a email I received, I don't have a clue to why Susan sent it to me other than the link is Trojan??? just a heads up in case something is fishy?

[Darcy]

The link goes right here! It's self referencing ...

[Stephen]

braver man than I