My new(to me any how) katana.

[waynes]

Hello, I recently purchased this katana from another members collection. I was wondering what the other members think. He believes it to be Soshu koto katana. Any info would be greatly appreciated.

[Mark Green]

Sweet!!!

Great Hadori job. Been mounted a few times eh! Good old workhorse.

Mark G

[waynes]

I just got the katana and it has a very nice feel in hand. It does have some ware and openings as visible in the pictures, but I believe it will make an excellent study piece. Here is some more info and measurements. The mune machi is 5.5mm thick and 29mm wide. The yokote is 4mm thick and 19mm wide. The nagasa is 26" and the sori is .7".The boshi is ko-maru. The ridge line is slightly raised. The mune is a low back hikushi. It has nioi, nie, and areas of chikei. The hada is itame with a few sections of mokume. Hopefully this can help in tracing it's origins. Thank you in advance for any info or thoughts

[huntershooter]

Lovely blade. ____________________Todd M.

[kusunokimasahige]

what age does it have?

 

KM

[Deron Douglas]

Sweet!!!

Great Hadori job. Been mounted a few times eh! Good old workhorse.

Mark G

 

Very nice.

 

Question: It has three holes, so would that be it was mounted 3 times and/or shorten three times. I once heard that if it was getting remounted (new tsuka) they would re-drill a new hole rather than use an existing hole even if they weren't shortening it.

 

Deron

[pcfarrar]

Louis Sekbo should be able to shed some light on this sword as it was originally his:

 

http://www.japaneseswordcollector.com/koto/koto.html

[kusunokimasahige]

Deron,

 

personally I think that there also have been swords with three mekugi.

 

maybe a bit overkill in attachment strenth, but sometimes with good reason.

 

i do not think all swords with more holes in them were fastened to the tsuka with only one pin... some might have been, sometimes a new hole was drilled since the old one was stretched or damaged.

 

KM

[Deron Douglas]

Deron,

 

personally I think that there also have been swords with three mekugi.

 

maybe a bit overkill in attachment strenth, but sometimes with good reason.

 

i do not think all swords with more holes in them were fastened to the tsuka with only one pin... some might have been, sometimes a new hole was drilled since the old one was stretched or damaged.

 

KM

 

Thanks,

that would make sense.

Deron

[waynes]

Wow, good eye/memory Peter. I didn't notice it for sale when he had it. I bought it off of Steve RB who did tell me that Louis polished it. I would really like to hear his oppinion on it.

[Guest Nanshoku-Samurai]

Hello,

 

I think that the polish is not good on this one. Looks acid enchanced.

 

Only my 2cents

[USMC-LCPL]

Naw... I don't think so. It has ware, sure, and I'm sure it's most recent polish didn't help that fact...

 

But I don't see acid etching here. What makes you think that?

[waynes]

I also don't see anything that would imply acid on this one. Ware-yes nice activity also a yes.

 

 

Semper Fi

[Mark Green]

Old and used maybe, but I doubt that there has been any acid used on it.

Louis has gotten very good at that hadori work. Not an easy thing to learn.

What on earth makes you think "acid"????

Mark G

[Darcy]

I don't think Soshu. Influenced would be right I think....

 

Maybe Iwami Sadatsuna, or Yamato Shizu, not the founder but the school in the Nambokucho period towards the end. Shinogi looks pretty high by the pictures but hard to know. A lot of masame in shinogi and ha would point towards Yamato influence. A lot of pointed gunome would point to Shizu school in Mino.

 

The hamon looks like Sadatsuna to me, a mix gunome and choji midare with thick kinsuji and yo, and the deep yakiba also is seen in Naotsuna and descendents.

 

Worth trying for papers I think, I'd be leaning towards the Yamato connection.

[waynes]

Thank you very much for your informative opinion. I now have a lot of studying to do. I would like to send this in to shinsa but the thought of sending my only good nihonto away for so long is not a thought I like. Perhaps I'll wait until there's one around the New York area. Also congratulations to you Darcy and Mr. Benson on an outstanding book, I can't wait to have the whole series.

[stekemest]

Isn't that a midare hamon and a jizo boshi? wouldn't that indicate mino tradition?

 

(still learning about Nihonto),

Peter

[waynes]

Hi guys, I hate to bring up such an old post but I just shipped it out to Mr. Bob Benson today to go to shinsa. I'm dying to see how it goes.

[loui]

Hi Guys, just saw this post, not on here much anymore, no real time for internet.

 

There is no acid etching on that blade, I do not use acid, never have, never will. It is a common practice by alot of polishers to do so but I chose the old style, conservative with no enhancements other than keisho on some tired swords. Who ever said I used acid I would like ot know how you came up with that.

 

That sword I thought to be soshu influenced, but a bit of an enigma, will be interesting to see how it comes back.

 

I received it from a guy that pulled it out of a barn in the US, it had been shoved in a hay bail at the bottom of the pile since just after the war. It was entirely written off and I might add that someone had used acid on it prior to me receiving it as well as a wire wheel. The acid had etched deep into the jigane and was coming off in chunks - that is what I dislike most about acid, 99.9 percent of the people out there don't know how to use it. Acid is very popular in the UK and I have not seen one come from there that isn't all but ruined.

 

I shaped it and put a quick polish on it to move it on to a new collector, price was right for him, it is not a top quality polish but the shinsa team will have no problems with it.

 

Regards,

 

Louis

 

Please no acid, just say no to acid.

[Curran]

In the one photo of hamon it shows that as you follow the hamon from kissaki to nakago, after the crests there will be a collection of nie in the trough after it.

Old Japanese standby is that this trait usually points to Mino school. It is a fairly reliable old trick, though not perfect.

 

For that and other reasons, I felt it was probably Mino though I could see some Soshu activity along the hamon. Is there the faint bit of mune tempering? Mino+Soshu = Darcy's call for possibly Naoe Shizu makes a lot of sense. When it comes to swords, I'd listen to Darcy's opinion over my own. But I still have the upper hand with kodogu for now....

 

It might be worth a submit to the next NTHK shinsa in the USA.

 

Curran

[waynes]

I just got the results today. It came back with a Hozon to Kashu Iyetsugu. That's all I know for now. I've found a few smiths working by this name in Kaga around early Muromachi, but not to much info. If anyone knows of anything else I'd appreciate it. Thanks in advance.

[Rickisan]

Hey Wayne -

Was it part of the July Shinsa?

Just curious....I sent a tanto over...still waiting on the outcome.

rick

[waynes]

Yes, this was from the July shinsa. Best of luck with the tanto.

[Curran]

From memory: Kashu Iyetsugu (or Ietsugu in some texts) is a longish line of at least 4 but probably 6 or 7 smiths working in from late muromachi forward into shinto and maybe shin-shinto period.

 

Original influence is Mino. Usually the nakago has a distinct Kaga shape (Kashu = Kaga).

 

I think I sold all my Kaga swords books. Just the fittings Kaga Kinko Taikan left, so I cannot pull up any oshigata.

[waynes]

Thanks for the response. I didn't realize untill recently that the name could be spelled either way. So now it's time to put my nose back in the books.

[Curran]

Waynes,

 

I can understand the attribution, as Kaga, Echizen and Owari work all spun off out of the Mino school in late Muromachi to the "Shinto" sword period. Darcy or someone else can correct me in that I usually associate IyeTsugu with 1570 to 1700 work. I think the Iyetsugu name is mostly associated with Shinto.

 

I thought this sword was earlier than that. I can understand the attribution as a good one, but I felt it was more mainstream muromachi Mino. As stated before, I am more of a fittings collector these days- so take my word lightly. The workperiod of IyeTsugu line may be earlier than I remember and yours on the early side of that timeline.

 

Look up "Kaga" in the Connosseuirs Guide under the Shinto section. They probably mention the IyeTsugu name. Also Kaga (Kashu) was big enough that there is a Kaga Taikan (big book of Kaga) and also a Kaga Shinto Shu (Shinto swords of Kaga). Someone on the list might own a copy and be able to provide info.

 

Curran

 

Ps. Do not confuse Kaga IyeTsugu (aka IeTsugu) with Bizen IyeTsugu (Ietsugu). Bizen Iyetsugu looks/is very different.

[Darcy]

Well the Hozon paper is confusing to me as I would never have gotten to Kashu Ietsugu on this sword. Every time I read about the smith they go on about how similar the work is to Aoe. They start around 1500 and go from there.

 

Ietsugu's heirs mix into the Kanewaka school which is Shizu descended, so maybe it is from around this time. I don't know, it looks older to me but they are the best opinion.

[waynes]

On the sho shin web site there is an earlier smith listed by this name. Here's the link.

http://www.sho-shin.com/hoku9.htm