Any ideas on age school tanto

[Cello]

I'm not very familiar with tantos and identifying them by shape and othe characteristics. Any ideas on this one I took a gamble on?it looks to me like it has a kaku mune? Would this indicate an early blade?

[J Reid]

Looks like a late Muromachi to early Edo period piece. A picture of the nakago would help ALOT in identifying the age. Kozuka is decent looking.

[Peter Bleed]

It's Japanese, probably koto. Dahhh

Hey, show us something we can work with.

Peter

[Cello]

Sorry I don't have it in hand yet as soon as it arrives for inspection I will post them. So would a flat mune indicate and older blade?

[Jean]

No.

 

It useless to speculate without pictures of the whole blade.

 

What is an older blade in your opinion?

[Cello]

 

This is from the "connoisseurs " which is why I thought it would indicate a generally older blade Heian being oldest... Edo newest and everything in between. So by saying older i mean more towards the left of a timeline.

[Geraint]

Hi Marcello.

 

I assume that from your question that from the images you have judged that the mune is flat? From your reading you may also have assumed that this might mean the blade is very early?

 

I suspect that when you get the blade in hand you will find an iori mune, the most common type. You should also question whether tanto are available form the Heian jidai.

 

This does not mean that you the tanto is not interesting, when you have it in hand some better images will help.

 

All the best.

[Cello]

I was thinking only the smallest chance it could be that old, as I know there are almost none around. I didn't buy it for its age it looked interesting to me and some what complete. i wanted a tanto with the Bo and Soe hi on it. Also it was presented by a high ranking korean general to a US service man with documentation (supposedly) so I'm hoping that may indicated so sort of quality but I have 14 days to return if it turns out to be junk . Ill post the all telling nagako soon

Thanks

[Jean]

Cello,

 

Nihonto entertains wildest hopes/dreams. 20 years ago I know someone who bought in France a Naotane in a garage sale for 5$.

 

you have almost no chance at all to find a mid Kamakura tanto so an earlier one...

 

Be very careful when it comes to gifts between officials, it is never a Kokuho or jubi.

 

I don't think that the President of Italy would offer as gift a Rafaelo to President Obama.

 

Your blade will probably be a sue Koto honest tanto but wait for the picture.

 

Concerning the mune, to think it is flat is a wishful thinking, above all considering the pictures.

 

Question: Do you know if it is signed?

 

try quickly to have the blade kanteied once you have it and compare to the price you paid, taking into account you need to have it polish and a shirasaya made.

[Cello]

One can dream right lol....I figured from the limited photos I had available I take a chance. I like the blade either way ( like it more if it would be kamakura. I only have one tanto so I'm excited to get my hands on another and start to learn more about them. I'll have more information by weeks end as to Mei etc. I appreciate the replies and discussion which is why I post. Without posts there's no discussion hence no NMB! I love seeing a thread go for months or years my naginata post is still alive 8,00+ views later

[Peter Bleed]

Marcello,

Indeed, we're still looking -because we like to look at and think about Nippon-to. I still want to see the nakago, but I also want to adjust my earlier "kantei." You know, after looking once again, I think this is shin-shinto.

Peter

[Brian]

Age meaning little to me, I would have also taken a chance on this based on the soe hi and bo hi. If well cut, they are usually a sign of something that isn't junk. It looks ok to me so far, maybe a shinshinto, but a nice example. We will have to see.

 

Brian

[Darcy]

Pop the tsuka.

 

Nakago will tell a million words.

 

Mostly you don't see the long hi on Kamakura tanto. Shintogo does it sometimes for instance but in his case then the bottom end of the hi is below the machi, not like on this. This makes it look awkward and awkward is not part of kamakura tanto usually.

 

So Muromachi? Or, end of Edo to make mounts stick together? I kind of lean to the latter.

 

Nakago will clarify it all though.

[Cello]

As soon as I have it I will be posted.Then we shall seen who hit the bullseye from what little info can be pulled from the pics I posted......

[Cello]

So I guess it's shinshinto not sure about the mei and the stamp?

[Jean]

August, Second year of Kaei = 1849 - yes - Shinshinto.

 

How is the mune?

[takakage]

With a mei of the well known hosokawa Masayoshi.......So, beware....Masayoshi yasuri mei are always well done and you can find samples on the nihonto koza.

 

"same " mei at the page 275.

[Jean]

Sakuyô bakkashi Hosokawa Masayoshi

 

Compare the different kanji...with one papered

[Cello]

The mune is iori as you said it would be lol....I will do the comparisons gimei? I hope not but I got it for a decent price soooo either way it all good

[Cello]

Hi jean

Can you post an image of the "same" mei page 275 that you have?

Thanks-

[Jean]

You must ask Patrick, he is the one who posted it :D

 

Meanwhile, search the web

[Cello]

Sorry about that damn iPhone screen is so small lol... So let me redirect that request to you Patrick....

Thanks-

[cabowen]

Many many fakes of Hosokawa Masayoshi. There were two generations as well...

[drbvac]

If the mei is gimei how do they re-produce the stamp - kakihan ? Do the fabricate a stamp or cut out the design in the nakago - no comment on this particular blade - just a question whether this stamp or any other .

[Cello]

I'm guessing they would just make a counterfeit stamp and stamp the blade same as you would a legitimate one.... The stamp on my tanto is definitely stamped not cut in.

[cabowen]

fake stamp...

[Cello]

So I'm guessing the mei on my tanto is just another gimei ??

[george trotter]

Here is a shoshi-gimei comparison that might help (Shin Nihonto no Kantei Nyumon by Hiroi & Iida, Sho58 p.226), The book is old now so may be superceeded. I think from these points shown your mei is not correct...but as Chris says there was more than one generation. If the oshigata are too hard to see maybe the kantei points will help...hope this helps.

Regards,

[Cello]

Thank George ... So to me I see some of the points in my mei but the kanji all seem a little crowded on mine. Would the fact that its on a tanto explain this or just my jaded eyes lol...

[cabowen]

In George's post above, the right side blade is gimei, the left shoshin.