Need advince for mounting

[Christophe]

Hi every one

I have a sword in shirasaya signe by Hirata Hidemitsu who was, as I learn in this forum, a Seki Tosho in WWII. He began working on 3rd March 1943. Most of his work would have a Seki stamp. My have no arsenal or acceptance marks on it. It have a NBTHK TOKUBETSU KICHO (green papers) - Showa period.

I'm thinking to have it mounted as a military sword even if I'm not a fan of this kind of mounting because of its smith and period. I beginning researching gunto mounting and their history but was quickly overstep between : Kyū guntō, Shin guntō, Type 94, Type 95, Type 98, Kaiguntō…..Can someone help me to found the best way to choose the mounting or tell me where I can found informations to carry out this project.

Thank you very much for your help.

Christophe

[Alex A]

Hi Cristopher, if you dont mind me asking, if you are not a fan of military mounts, then is it really worth the hassle and expense?

 

Alex.

[Christophe]

Hi Alex,

well for me mounting a sword means if possible to put it in its context. I know this may sound silly, but I feel that a sword in shirasaya is like an orphan, that why I try now to mount them slowly (two every year). I have only one sword from this period and I think I will perhap enjoy it more and learn more about gunto if I can carry out this project. Even if you are not a fan of something, studying it can only be beneficial. I don't know much about military mounting, so it can be a way for me to discover a new field.

Christophe

[Alex A]

Agreed Christopher, assembling can be educational and a pain in the ass :D.Im sure the experts in this field will advise you.

 

Alex.

[Bruno]

Maybe have a look at Army civilian gunto mounts, they look a bit more traditionnal than the standard gunto ones.

[Geraint]

Hi Christophe.

 

As I am sure you are aware this is going to cost you far more than you will ever be able to sell the sword for. However, if you are determined to try might I suggest something like this, http://www.guntoartswords.com/010621.html Perhaps this sort of koshirae with tsunagi displayed alongside your blade in shirasaya would be a good compromise. You will have the sword and koshirae both in original condition and at least you could get back what you payed for the koshirae at a a later date. As soon as you start playing with them to fit the blade you are going to devalue the sword.

 

If you have to start buying fittings and parts separately and then attempt to assemble them it will not look good unless you pay professional restoration fees. Also it will never be part of the swords context in most people's eyes. If you are going to do it be aware that gunto saya are by no means all the same size and won't take blades that are not original. If you have a little adjustment to make it is sometimes possible to remove the koiguchi and slide out the wooden liner, open it and adjust to your blade. There is a pretty limited range of tolerance for this. The tsuka will probably not have the mekugi ana in the right place so you will need to do some careful work to correct that. Still ready for it?

 

Whatever way you chose have fun.

 

All the best.

[Geraint]

Oh, and one more thing; watch out for the positioning of the spring latch, this must line up from it's position in the tsuka, through all seppa and tsuba and also into the koiguchi of the saya. They are much more of an individual fit than you might imagine, any misalignment will show up very much and destroy the sense of completeness.

[Christophe]

Thanks to all of you.

Alex, I agree when you said "assembling can be educational and a pain in the ass", I will just add "a sense of pride when it is well finished in the right way".

Bruno, I like your idea of Army civilian gunto mounts, it can be more my mind. I beginning to seach quickly and found this :

http://www.h4.dion.ne.jp/~t-ohmura/gunto_037.htm

but I have to start serious search and take time to found enough informations before starting. What is good is that I don't have to rush.

Geraint, thanks for the link. I understand when you say "his is going to cost you far more than you will ever be able to sell the sword for", but I have a speciel feeling for it and I would like to makes things right. I know I can not do it alone for every things and will have to ask for help from a professional and that cost money. I will have to work more and make perhaps sacrifice in everyday life, but its a challenge for me.

 

Is there any books that you can recommend me about gunto/civilian gunto mounts ?

 

Thanks again to all of you.

Christophe

[Marius]

  christ3221 said:

I know this may sound silly, but I feel that a sword in shirasaya is like an orphan

 

A sword is better off in a shirasaya than in a haphazard koshirae. Unless you use an expert artisan (at a cost which would allow you to buy a pretty decent sword) you are going to end up with a some Frankenstein monster, which will neither increase the value nor enhance the appeal of your blade. (BTW, when seasoned collectors buy a good sword in such a koshirae they sell it for parts and keep the blade).

 

Swords have been stored in shirasaya for centuries, their beauty having been admired regardless of changing fashion in mountings. You might want to learn to appreciate the blade a standalone work of art. A shirasaya is much better than a crappy koshirae.

 

Of course it is your sword and you will do what you want. One word of caution, which I am sure is not necessary in your case, but it has to be said. "Modifying" either the sword or an original koshirae means destroying it. I am stating this just in case, so please don't be offended, even if that was obvious for you.

[Alex A]

I see the assembly police have arrived, joking Mariusz . I do agree. A koshirae done badly is a waste of money and time, some may say a koshirae done well is still a waste of money and time , keep the original shirasaya!. Parts can be difficult to come by, it can take years. As for pricing, there are traditionally trained craftsman who are reasonable, allthough expect to be in a que for a while. Wanting a blade in koshirae is down to ones own taste, the blade can still be appreciated. If the parts are correct, the rest of the work is traditional and authentic, what harm can it do, besides blow a huge hole in your pocket.

 

Alex.

[Christophe]

Thanks Mariuszk for your post. I agree at 100% when you said that 'Modifying" either the sword or an original koshirae means destroying it",It was never in my attention to do so., and keep alwyas my sword in their original shirasaya.I will be never offended by your posts, because they can only help me in my study of nihonto.. I work on this project with a traditionally trained craftsman in Kyoto (third generations) who himself work wih two others in Okayama. I think a lot of people misunderstood my first post, and it's me fault, (difficult to explain in english). I have to decide which kind of koshirae I would like, what fitting I have to found (and know it take lot of time)........, after I will attend the differente steps of the process. I do it last year for a tanto (two years of search for the fitting). It was very rewarding to see them working. For me searching for fitting is a way to study more effectively. In the other hand, i enjoy them more on a koshirae then in a paulownia box

What i was asking for was a little help about the differences betweem gunto mounting for a sword with no stamp or arsenal marks so I can make a choice.

Christophe