hxv Posted April 3, 2013 Report Posted April 3, 2013 I have a small tsuba that I would like to get your thoughts on regarding motif, type and age. It's about 6.5cm by 6.2cm with 5mm thickness. The patina is dark chocolate color, may be even a bit darker. The surface texture is very fine and smooth, especially on the rim. The seppa dai is slightly dished on one side. The rim is rounded. There are areas where tekkotsu are clearly seen. It has the look and feel of Owari tsuba, but somehow, the surface finish and the rounded rim don't fit. It also has the look and feel of Kanayama tsuba, but it's a bit too thin at 5mm. It's certainly not Kyo Sukashi, not Shoami, not Ono, not Yagyu, not Akasaka, etc. I am sitting on the fence with regard to Kanayama/Owari, but I could be totally wrong on both counts, too. Any and all thoughts are appreciated. I also don't get the motif either. Regards, Hoanh Quote
Soshin Posted April 4, 2013 Report Posted April 4, 2013 Hi Hoanh, To me the tsuba looks like a middle Edo Period Owari sukashi tsuba. By the time of the Edo Period the rounded rim became more common on Owari sukashi tsuba as well as asymmetrical ji-sukashi designs as seen in this tsuba. The small overall size and thinness also makes me think Edo Period. From the photographs I don't seen any tekkotsu on the surface or along the rim the tsuba. You commented that the surface is smooth to the touch which is an important observation as tsuchimei-ji and tekkotsu would often be present in some form on pre Edo Owari sukashi tsuba. The smooth iron of your tsuba is not a reflection of a reduction in skill of Owari tsubako of the time but the changing aesthetic of the time period this is my opinion based upon my own observations. I will leave the design for others to figure out but would say that the wild geese and ginger are both related to Winter season. Try looking around the web for Owari sukashi tsuba examples and will likely see some of the same designs. Picking up one of Sasano books would also be helpful as he discuss many commonly designs seen in tsuba with different types of openwork designs. Yours truly, David Stiles 1 Quote
hxv Posted April 4, 2013 Author Report Posted April 4, 2013 Hi David, Thank you for your thoughts and suggestions. I tried to take pictures of tekkotsu on the rim, but didn't succeed. There are several places on the rim where linear tekkotsu are clear - not super prominent but definitely visible. Regarding motif, I think the hitsuana are formed by pairs of flying geese. What I don't seem to be able to figure out are the carvings at the 5:00, 7:00, and 11:00 positions in the first picture. You are most likely correct about Owari and mid-Edo. What throws me off are the rounded rim and the smooth, moist, Yakite-Shitate-like surface texture, especially on the rim. Regards, Hoanh Quote
Marius Posted April 4, 2013 Report Posted April 4, 2013 Hitsu-ana: ginger (myoga) 11: wild geese (karigane) or plovers (chidori) 7: money exchange weight (fundo) 6 & 12: chopsticks (hashi) ??? No idea what the symbol at 1 o'clock is. Looks familiar, though... Quote
Soshin Posted April 4, 2013 Report Posted April 4, 2013 You are most likely correct about Owari and mid-Edo. What throws me off are the rounded rim and the smooth, moist, Yakite-Shitate-like surface texture, especially on the rim. Regards, Hoanh Hi Hoanh, The surface of your tsuba would be refered to as migaki-ji in Japanese. I seen the same thing in terms of tekkotsu on a Edo Period Owari tsuba that was once in my collection. I purchased it from a Japanese dealer. Notice the strong linear tekkotsu. Here is a link to it as it was latter resold by Grey D. The custom box was the nicest I have ever seen. http://www.japaneseswordbooksandtsuba.com/store/tsuba-%26-kodogu/m133-owari-tsuba-nice-box Yours truly, David Stiles Quote
BMarkhasin Posted April 4, 2013 Report Posted April 4, 2013 Hoanh, Attractive tsuba. The symbol at 1 o'clock seems to be two bats, wings touching, facing opposite directions. Best regards, Boris. Quote
hxv Posted April 4, 2013 Author Report Posted April 4, 2013 Thank you all for helping me with this tsuba David - I followed your link and yes, the linear tekkotsu looks very similar. Mariusz - I looked up fundo weight and sure enough, there it was! Also, now that you mentioned chopsticks, I can totally see it. Boris - Bats! I would not be able to figure that one out. Could the carving @5:00 o'clock be a fan? When we put all of the elements together, what do we get? Regards, Hoanh Quote
Marius Posted April 4, 2013 Report Posted April 4, 2013 Could the carving @5:00 o'clock be a fan? When we put all of the elements together, what do we get? Quite likely. But it could be a pestle, too -here is the famous rabbit on a tsuba from Sasano's book, which you own: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_Lpe_Xrk_-gs/S ... itsuki.jpg All elements together? As in many other tsuba, this one's decoration is pretty eclectic, full of auspicious symbols, like a wedding kimono Quote
hxv Posted April 4, 2013 Author Report Posted April 4, 2013 Mariusz, I just now looked up & read the description of that particular tsuba you mentioned. I see all of the elements now. Regards, Hoanh Quote
raiden Posted April 4, 2013 Report Posted April 4, 2013 due to the rounded rim, and other characteristics mentioned, one idea to be considered is the works of kariganeya, predecessor to the Akasaka school.....but without seeing it in hand, it is impossible to determine a more accurate kantei. also sometimes it helps to put a smaller pic of a tsuba or ftting as they were not meant to be viewed so closely in a natural setting. just my 2 cents Quote
b.hennick Posted April 4, 2013 Report Posted April 4, 2013 A similar approach is to take a tsuba, lay it on a surface and place a tsuka on the seppa dai. The view "as mounted" is often better than just the tsuba. It shows what the tsubashi wanted people to see when the tsuba was worn. Some like to give the tsuba a 1/4 turn to clockwise to show how the tauba looks during the draw. There is a good article in a KTK catalogue on mon that refers to the rotation Quote
christianmalterre Posted April 4, 2013 Report Posted April 4, 2013 Hirobei is said to ben moved from Kyoto to Edo... an second theory tells us that workers of Owari province came to Edo...there but is only the heron and mallow one certainly attributed to Kariganeya...such i doupt hard equal. looking on the iron i doupt seeing Kurokuwadani-such me personally do extinct Tadamasa lineage...(may be wrong of course-had to see this piece live) Stylism is somehow Kyo-at least for me... No Aka(neither early nor mid or latter)-Nor an Owari certainly...at least no earlier one...(agree or not,latter "Owari"-style are no real Owari for me-at least if you do hard focus)(of course an game).... Maybe an lattest Owari stylism(so to calm frontiers?)-Hitsuana do but not fitt,general execution again does show Aka(already established)influence... Don´t know?-I personally tend to range it into Edo-Shoami shelf here... too much mishmash... Nice but not special. Christian Quote
Soshin Posted April 4, 2013 Report Posted April 4, 2013 Some like to give the tsuba a 1/4 turn to clockwise to show how the tauba looks during the draw. There is a good article in a KTK catalogue on mon that refers to the rotation Hi Barry H., I do remember reading the article you are refereeing to and I highly recommend it. Having been actively practicing a Japanese sword drawing martial art for the last 7 years not all styles of Japanese sword drawing martial arts do a 1/4 turn of the koiguchi during the drawing of the sword. A few different styles do this but no all styles. Hi Mike Y., It could be a kariganeya if it is pre Edo Period. To me the tsuba just does not look that old but in regards to kariganeya school I know next to nothing about them. I completely agree true and complete kantei of a tsuba can't be done with photographs alone even if you have really great photographs. This is clearly indicated with my current run-in with Japanese customs. Hi Christian M., Dear friend while I respect your judgement and consider you a nihonto and tosogu senpai but with all due respect I disagree. Here is a example to prove my point: http://e-sword.jp/sale/2010/1010_6003syousai.htm. It is a Edo Period Owari sukashi tsuba papered as such my the NBTHK. I consider it very nice and would love to have it in may collection. Yours truly, David Stiles Quote
hxv Posted April 4, 2013 Author Report Posted April 4, 2013 Just when I think I am in the clear, the water got muddy again Attached are pictures adjusted to near life-size, as suggested in previous posts. It's pretty clear I need an expert who can examine this tuba in person. Regards, Hoanh Quote
MauroP Posted April 6, 2013 Report Posted April 6, 2013 I have a candidate for the shape at 5 o'clock: could be a paddle for hanetsuki (羽根突き), a sort of badminton. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanetsuki The following tsuba is described as 羽根突き透鍔. http://www.e-sword.jp/sale/2010/1010_6035syousai.htm Quote
Ford Hallam Posted April 6, 2013 Report Posted April 6, 2013 http://www.aoijapan.com/tsuba-mumei-unsigned-owari-karigane-sukashi Quote
hxv Posted April 6, 2013 Author Report Posted April 6, 2013 Mauro and Ford, Thank you for the hints. I am arranging to have it looked in person by a NMB member who specializes in iron tsuba and who is local in my area. I will keep you posted. Regards, Hoanh Quote
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