JamesH Posted January 22, 2013 Report Posted January 22, 2013 Hi everyone, I just wanted to get your opinions on this one : http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Japanese-Swo ... 4ac0b2dd2f I have never seen a Seki-stamped sword with kanteisho.... Regards, James P.S. Bryan if it goes against policy to discuss while auction is running, please lock thread until its over. Quote
Brian Posted January 23, 2013 Report Posted January 23, 2013 Can't make out if the stamp is really the Seki arsenal one or something else. Would need a clear close-up pic of the stamp. With the quality of the yasurime and the hamon, this one is clearly not a Showato. Brian Quote
hxv Posted January 23, 2013 Report Posted January 23, 2013 It looks to be water-quenched to me. I see lots of ashi. The hamon looks pretty lively with lots of activities. Regards, Hoanh Quote
Brian Posted January 23, 2013 Report Posted January 23, 2013 Yeah..if oil quenched, I am not sure why the smith would have gone to the trouble of such well done kesho yasurime. Complex hamon. Still not convinced that is a Seki stamp. Brian Quote
pcfarrar Posted January 23, 2013 Report Posted January 23, 2013 It looks to be water-quenched to me. I see lots of ashi. The hamon looks pretty lively with lots of activities. I can't see any activity, tight hazy indistinct nioiguchi, no nie, and those typical hard spots on the top of the gunome that you get on oil tempered blades. Aoi Art had a seki stamped showato with NTHK papers not so long ago. Quote
Bruno Posted January 23, 2013 Report Posted January 23, 2013 We need Mr Bowen on this case! It looks like a Seki stamp from what I can see, not the first time a showato received papers. As for the well done yasurime, Mantetsuto have also good ones and they are showato. Quote
Bruno Posted January 23, 2013 Report Posted January 23, 2013 I think without being sure that Chris said in the past, that in special occasions, if the showato was important for his Japanese owner then the shinsa team might be nice with him and issues the papers. It was something like that in my memory.... Also papers issued in the 70/80ies were dubious, don't know if these ones are of this period. Quote
Daniel Posted January 23, 2013 Report Posted January 23, 2013 I think I see some hard spots too. Daniel Quote
cabowen Posted January 23, 2013 Report Posted January 23, 2013 This blade looks oil quenched to me. I think it is simply a case of it getting past a shinsa team not used to seeing oil quenched blades..... Quote
runagmc Posted January 24, 2013 Report Posted January 24, 2013 If it is non-traditional, it's about the nicest non-traditional Showato I've seen. I agree that the hamon kind of looks oil quenched, but it's rare to see a "Showato" with this quality of workmanship... especially from Seki... Quote
cabowen Posted January 24, 2013 Report Posted January 24, 2013 Agreed, it is nicely done for a Seki piece. Quote
Jacques Posted January 25, 2013 Report Posted January 25, 2013 Hi, Also papers issued in the 70/80ies were dubious, don't know if these ones are of this period. Origami is dated Heisei 22, it is recent. Origami is issued by NTHK NPO. Quote
Bruno Posted January 25, 2013 Report Posted January 25, 2013 Origami is dated Heisei 22, it is recent. Origami is issued by NTHK NPO. Hi Jacques, Yes I saw it is a recent paper, I wanted to say that in general, one should not always blindly trust these papers as they in some cases have mistakes. Quote
cabowen Posted January 25, 2013 Report Posted January 25, 2013 Hi Jacques, Yes I saw it is a recent paper, I wanted to say that in general, one should not always blindly trust these papers as they in some cases have mistakes. True of all papers, NBTHK and NTHK as well....always best to double check. Quote
george trotter Posted January 28, 2013 Report Posted January 28, 2013 I was reluctant to enter this discussion in view of the heat generated in our last "papering of wartime swords" subject, but in view of the "hidden implication" here, and to help all of us who don't know much about papers "true meaning" (as we are not "must have papers" guys), I'd like to add a question. Without being provocative, can I ask just what this paper is telling us? It seems to me that the info on the paper is just giving the specific details: name, date, activity, measurements etc...all info that would already be on any collector's data-sheet. The paper does not give an "opinion" as such...in fact I find it contradictory in that it says "ko-itame"...then "mujihada" (no hada visible)...is it just that the sword was recorded (rather than thrown out) that makes this paper significant? Does "kanteisho" certificate on this occasion mean it is recorded as a nihonto? (Not to be too silly, but if it is now a "nihonto", then logically, those who slavishly follow the dictates of papers will now have to defend to the death that this sword is a nihonto (seki stamp and all)...true? ...or does it mean that seki stamps now indicate nihonto?) I'd like some feedback here as I always viewed papers as a means to verify a mei on a much loved sword or to identify a mumei or suriage blade that has a lot of promise...that is, to answer an unknown question. I never viewed papers as for putting on an official document what I already know. In this case now, I find the process perhaps a "cynical" exercise by a "well-placed" Japanese sword dealer to give a bit of "cred" to a sword that already "speaks for itself". Any helpful comments? Regards, Quote
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