Shinsa results - Bizan Yokoyama Sukahara

[bullpuppy]

I just got the sword back from the Shinsa. I found this sword on this message board shortly after I joined.

 

The sword was listed at the following link.

 

http://militaria.co.za/nihontomessagebo ... c.php?t=34

 

I could not attach the work sheet becuause of size so I posted at the following link. You will have to save it locally to read it.

 

http://bladerunnerswords.spaces.live.com/

 

 

I tried to look up the maker and the school in the Connoisseurs Book of Japanese swords but could not find the maker or the school during the koto period. If any one has additional information on the maker please let me know.

 

Now it time to wait in line for a polish.

[QuangD]

BullPuppy,

 

I think the attribution to "Bizen Yokoyama Sukesada". You need to write the period down so people in here can narrow down to which smith or generations. Great result! 75 points.

[Minister Amos]

75 Points?

 

That's pretty darn good! How long have you been submitting/buying/collecting?

 

Congrats!

[Curran]

Bullpuppy,

 

Wrong section. See page #294. Also more on pg. #299

Shinshinto.

 

I cannot see what your papers say. I am assuming "Sukesada" or "Sukehira". They worked both in Soshu style and that of Oei Bizen. I enjoy Oei Bizen very much, so I often take a look at Yokoyama swords.

 

Point scores are just a 'helpful indicator'. 75 is very good.

Assuming 50% of blades failed shinsa (probably higher in this shinsa), then it is sort of a pyramid scale from 70pts for passing kanteisho to 80pts being a possible Juyo candidate. Some blades are marginally passed with scores in the 60s. The reasons can vary.

 

Just for convenience sake, conceptualize that of the 50 that pass out of a pool of 100: You have 4.5 with scores below 70; then 9 with 70pts, 8 with 71pts, 7 with 72 pts, 6 with 73pts, 5 with 74pts, 4 with 75pts, 3 with 76pts, 2 with 77pts, 1 with 78pts, and 0.5 with 80pts (yes, we skipped 79 because I've never seen a 79 score to date) that is a Yusho (NTHK equiv of Juyo).

 

If you approach it this way, then you could feel that the NTHK felt your sword was in the top 6 to top 10% of the ones they saw at the shinsa. This is very good. Remember the point score is just there as a rough indicator.

 

My own feelings were that the quality of swords submitted was lower than I'd seen before. However, the quality of the fittings submitted was much higher than I'd seen before. Quite a few published items, and some big names- though I do not think anything was felt to be Yushu level. The judges were extremely hard- but some great collections made it to the fittings table.

 

You should be happy with your results, though maybe you were expecting Koto Bizen results. Do not sneeze at Yokoyama. It is not Bungo. We save those for Milt.

 

Curran

[Rich T]

Bizen Yokoyama Sukeharu

 

備前横山祐春

 

Is the attribution.

 

I cannot really see but I think the era is

 

康応

 

No books handy at the office so I cannot verify that year.

 

Rich

[Nobody]

The attribution on the sheet is as follows,

 

era: 慶応 (Keio, 1865-1868)

smith: 伝　備前横山祐春 (den Bizen Yokoyama Sukeharu)

[bullpuppy]

If I am interpreting the writing correctly on the work sheet it says L. keio.

 

Prior to this sword I bought 4. The first one was a Chinese fake. The second and third were Gendai which I resold for a net profit. The fourth was the one I posted http://militaria.co.za/nihontomessagebo ... c.php?t=93 and is probably a gemei but I still like it and I am still getting different opinions.

 

This one was posted on this message board. I followed the advice given on this message board also.

Actually I bought it by mistake. I set a limit on how much I would pay but I entered dollars in an pound auction and won. That's why I had to sell the 2 Gendai.

 

I am glad the point score was relatively high. Not a Koto so I will have to get one of these another day. If the sword was in good polish would it have scored even higher?

 

Any ideas on the maker or other examples of his work I would be most interested. What would a papered sword like this will be worth? I am going to invest in a koshirae and a good polish for it and plan on keeping it

 

The picture of the worksheet can be save locally and if you open it in a different viewer you should be able to read it.

 

I was hoping for a Koto but I am happy with it.

[Rich T]

and the sword is mumei, it implies that the sword is from the school of Yokoyama Sukeharu, but not necessarily made by Sukeharu. It may well be that Sukeharu made it, but it may also be a students work who worked like him.

 

I have nothing on Sukeharu in Fujishiro's. Maybe he is in Hawleys ?.

 

Rich

[Stephen]

I could of had this at a very fair price but noooo they had to drag it out...now ill have the money next week....such is life. Btw you did quit well good show!

[DavidF]

  bullpuppy said:

I am glad the point score was relatively high. Not a Koto so I will have to get one of these another day. If the sword was in good polish would it have scored even higher?

 

I was hoping for a Koto but I am happy with it.

 

Hey, there's nothing wrong with Shinto or Gendai blade. As my tastes have developed, I now actually prefer Shinto and Gendai blades over Koto. Unless you have preference for the shaping of Koto blades, there is really no reason not to like Shinto and Gendai blades.

 

Koto blades fetch more cash, but IMHO the artistry of early Shinto and post-WWII Gendai is much more attractive. :D

 

 

DaveF.

[Stephen]

Koto do have more value but you have to have one that's not been polished down to nothing to see all the great nuances of Koto...if one has one good sword representing each era id consider him a rich man.

[Brian]

Very true..and remember that late Koto mass produced is not as good as early Shinto. Once of the hard things for me to do was to get over the common thoughts that "older is better" and start looking at the workmanship in each blade individually.

I would prefer healthy Shinshinto anydays over a worn out and tired Koto.

You did good mate! You bought at a good price from a forum member..and had it pass shinsa with a good result. Nothing to regret.

 

Brian

[ironchef.]

I recall looking at this blade during Shinsa. I think what had caught my eye as well was the attribution. Never heard of the Sukeharu name. Nice looking wakazashi! Congrats on the results!

 

Ricky

[bullpuppy]

Thanks for all the feedback. All the comments are most constructive. The smith seems to be hard to track down. I will keep you all updated with the progress on this project. The sword is a katana not a wak. The cutting edge is 26 1/8. I like to know if anyone could access value on this one. I am not selling but it does make the wife feel better.

[Stephen]

which sword are you talking about with the buffing...the one i got my eye on??? LOL

[Curran]

Bullpuppy,

 

Value always depends on condition and a range of other factors. Sometimes it seems to depend on what phase the moon is in.

 

I tried to find you an example, but only found the listing for one recently sold by Moses: http://www.nihontoantiques.com/fss152.htm

 

Seeing as you recently submitted the sword to the NTHK through him, he should be willing to tell you for how much this other one sold.

 

I don't remember studying the sword too closely from the auction. Price was very fair for what looked like a nice Bizen piece. My feeling is you probably come out a few (2 or 3) thousand ahead on it, though you should figure out to which smith it is attributed. The English translation on the sheet may be wrong, because it is odd that they would give it to specific little known guy unless it is signed that way. On one instance, I took a sheet back to the translator because they'd translated a 'Mori' character as something else. So yours probably says Sukesada or Sukehira, or other fellow listed in Nagayama.

 

Curran

 

Curran

[David Flynn]

A friend of mine has a contemporary piece signed Bizen Yokoyama Suketada. It has old, 1981 NBTHK papers. He is listed in Hawley's, as is Sukeharu. Both are listed around the same: C1868.

David