Huge Katana, 77,5 cm nagasa - help please

[Jorgensen]

Hello collectors,

 

I would like to show you this large o'kissaki Katana with swastika kamon on f/k and appreciate some help and info too.

 

Blade mei I get to: Tanshu Minamoto Masashige, but I cant find anything on this smith. Info and if possible an Oshigata will be very helpful.

 

The Tsuba signature I cant read, its too hard for me to read, I am not that skilled in reading kanji. There is kanji on both sides. There is kanji on the seppas as well.

 

Any info and help will be much appreciated.

 

Link to pictures:

BLADE: http://reklamezonen.dk/katana_blade.html

KOSHIRAE: http://reklamezonen.dk/katana_koshirae.html

 

Here are the different measures:

 

BLADE:

Nagasa: 77,6 cm

Sori: 1.8 cm

Motohaba: 38 mm

Motogasane: 8,5 mm

Kissaki: 10,5 cm

Weight: 1238 grams (without habaki)

 

TSUBA:

Width: 9,5 cm

Height: 8,5 cm

Thickness: 5 mm

Weight: 256 grams

 

Koshirae total lenght: 109 cm

Koshirae + blade total weight: 1626 grams

[John A Stuart]

May I suggest shinshinto Hoki, signed 伯州原正重 Hakushu Hara? Masashige. Don't get the hara, wara kanji. I know it does seem more like 但州 Tanshu; but.... John

[cabowen]

  John A Stuart said:

May I suggest shinshinto Hoki, signed 伯州原正重 Hakushu Hara? Masashige. Don't get the hara, wara kanji. I know it does seem more like 但州 Tanshu; but.... John

 

源　minamoto

[John A Stuart]

Should have figured that out, duh. Thanks, Chris. Can't find anything on this smith using Tanshu either, which seems to be what that kanji is, more and more as I look at it. Oh well. John

[cabowen]

Soshu ju Minamoto Masashige

 

祖州住源正重

[Jorgensen]

  cabowen said:

Soshu ju Minamoto Masashige

 

祖州住源正重

 

Thanks Chris,

 

I cant find this one in any indexes or online either

 

Anybody can help with further information?

[cabowen]

Listed in the Nihon-to Meikan. If you don't have one, you should....Tenbun period.

[Jorgensen]

Hi Chris,

 

Thank you very much, I appreciate you have taken the time to help me. I do not have this book, need to go get it.

 

Is the smith listed with info and signature? -If so, would you be so kind to share it with me here on the thread or by PM?

 

Thanks again.

 

EDIT: Just see the book has no illustrations! If any have Oshigata available, I will be very interested.

[John A Stuart]

That Nihonto Meikan entry has 相州住正重 with no 源 and using 相 rather than 祖 Also signing 武州下原正重 Bushu Shitahara Masashige. Listed as Tensho 天正1573.7.28-1592.12.8 not Tenbun. I am still unsure though. John

[Jorgensen]

Thank you for your help. However this leaves me a bit more with questions than facts =)

 

I will highly appreciate if there are others, that are willing to help with the puzzle.

 

btw. Is the correct term for this blade a Nagamaki-Naoshi Katana or is it something else?

[J Reid]

I think its just an O-kissaki.

[J Reid]

P.s. I am very envious of this piece. Looks like a beast! If you ever decide to sell.. PM me first! haha

[Kai-Gunto]

  J Reid said:

P.s. I am very envious of this piece. Looks like a beast! If you ever decide to sell.. PM me first! haha

Im very pleased to have handled and compared my friends huge sword with my standard Kanekuni katana.

Its so heavy

 

[Jorgensen]

Just an update for those who are interested - facts revealed in my search about the sword so far:

 

SIGNATURE IS:

Tanshu Minamoto Masashige.

 

KAMON ON F/K:

Family crest by the HACHISUKA daimyo.

 

MENUKI STRANGE PLACEMENT:

Special order or because not to cover the 2 mekugi ana. Menuki are 8 cm long each.

 

SEPPA'S:

Kanji reads Nakayama. Has no further importance.

 

TSUBA DETAILS:

"Sone-shi” (to Mr. Sone) on the obverse side.

“Sadanobu” and “ryu-ko” (dragon and tiger) on the reverse.

Sadanobu may be the name who engraved on the tsuba, and the “ryu-ko” is a title of the engraving.

Probably the person named Sadanobu made the engraving as a present to Mr. Sone.

 

BLADE:

Blade is a Katana (and not a nagamaki-Naoshi - J Reid is correct (I will let you know as the first in case of sale )). Probably gimei and probably cut down (is believed to originally have been somewhat over 80 cm's long). It is believed so far by a highly regarding polisher the sword might could turn out to be a Tanshu Hojoji Kunimitsu (1300 cth). I am suggested it is then a very good sword to submit it to Juto Shinsa.

 

 

I will probably have the blade sent to the polisher and then if okay, submitted to Shinsa. Its going to be very interesting to see what will happen in future and what it turns out to be.

[Markus]

I am pretty sure that the mei reads "Tanshû Minamoto Masashige".

This makes him a meikan-more, a smith who didn´t make it into the meikan lists.

 

There is clearly the ninben (亻) to the left and the (旦) radical to the right.

[cabowen]

  Markus said:

I am pretty sure that the mei reads "Tanshû Minamoto Masashige".

This makes him a meikan-more, a smith who didn´t make it into the meikan lists.

 

There is clearly the ninben (亻) to the left and the (旦) radical to the right.

 

Looking at the linked photos of the mei, I completely agree and having looked in the Meikan, he is indeed Meikan-more. Or, the signature is gimei....

[LUIS22]

Impresive beautiful sword!

[Kai-Gunto]

Here a better picture with it ,compared with standard size katana.

[kusunokimasahige]

Could this be a No-Dachi of smaller size ?

 

Or is it just a large chopper ?

 

Looks magnificent !

 

KM

[Toryu2020]

I want to ask, is this not a gendai work? Are we maybe looking in the wrong place for this smith?

 

The depth of the ha-machi especially makes me wonder. 龍虎 BTW is the theme of the tsuba - dragon on one side and tiger on the other...

-t

[Kai-Gunto]

About the tsuba , yes, tiger on one side and dragon on the other.

[kunitaro]

  Toryu said:

I want to ask, is this not a gendai work? The depth of the ha-machi especially makes me wonder.

And

[Jorgensen]

Kunitaro... Could you please explain

[runagmc]

An older sword would usually show less thickness in the mune, compared to the nakago mune, due to the number of polishes it would've likely received... In other words, you can tell this sword has seen very little polishing and is probably not so old...

[drbvac]

Regardless of age it is a monster - should get it polished anyway - very impressive = love those 0-kissaki and on a blade that massive

 

I don't recall too many gendai of that size and weight nor too many others for that manner , many were 4 or 5 inches shorter than this if I recall - 26"?

[Alex A]

Huge Kissaki, great looking katana, a similar shaped sword for sale at Aoi art, dated 1596.(10307)

 

Alex.

[cabowen]

There were many swords made in this style in the Shinshinto period. WWII era blades, certainly not. Modern shinsakuto, again, many.

[drbvac]

Thank you Chris - I was pretty sure that later gendaito were never this large.

[Ruben]

just the ha- machi and mune- machi were moved, so the ha- machi is to brought i think.

But realy don´t now about era, but if it is not "very" old should be ubu, ...no?

About sugata, hmm could be shortened also

On the other side the nakago is not too bad shaped, it looks ok so far.

 

Ps.: the fuchi dont fit, hard to find some over 39mm, had this doruble as well :|

 

Greetings!

 

ruben

[Lance]

Nice looking sword, In the posts above it was mentioned that the sword could be Shinshinto it reminded me of something; Besides the revival of Nambokucho sugata with oversized blades, I remember reading that some of the late Edo/Meiji Samurai also favored this martial type of koshirae with bright colored saya. What I don't remember is if these were the loyalists who wanted to overthrow the Shogun, or members of Kabukimono gangs (variously tied to the Yakuza, disaffected ronin, or samurai version of juvenile delinquents?) Anyone familiar with this bit of history?

 

 

 

Regards,

Lance