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Uwe, maybe you can explain to Javier why this is considered to be "Haruta" I The yodare kake (throat guard) appears to be nerigawa (rawhide) as it has shiki-gane (strengthening rods) that are laced to the back of Japanese nerigawa armor items.

If you are going to clean / polish the lacquer on the helmet bowl and replace the old leather with new leather but at the same time leave the old, frayed, faded, deteriorating lacing and an uncleaned / unpolished shikoro you would in my opinion have an unbalanced look. Everyone has their own opinion as to how far to go with restoration / conservation and I am not suggesting that you strip the old lacquer off but lacing was made to be replace and it was regularly replaced. If the helmet is of a high quality the work done should have a balanced look. The shikoro lacquer also has many cracks which would have to be looked at as well.

You forgot to mention the lacing that needs replacing, also without getting more detailed images you can not rule out other unseen damage. As for expense, when done properly using materials and techniques that are of the highest quality this is never cheap. You can relate this to what it costs and the time it takes to have a Japanese sword properly restored by a highly skilled polisher and there are more highly trained Japanese sword polishers than highly trained Japanese armor restorers.

Mike, this helmet has some problems which can be quite expensive to fix if done properly. There is lacing with seems to be falling apart, the leather needs to be replaced and there is at least one crack in the lacquer of the helmet bowl. You need more images in order to see if there are any other problems, you also have to find out if the helmet is iron or rawhide, a magnet would tell this. As for price, since you said that you are "way out of your depth" I would not attempt to make an offer, the owner should come up with a price. I would not rush into buying any Japanese armor unless the price is low enough to compensate for any restoration work which as I said will be expensive. There are a LOT of nice Japanese armor items for sale that do not need any repairs so take your time and do some research.

Steve, it looks good, I have a couple of sayas that need some simple touch up work, I wouldnt mind trying to do it myself as it would not be worth the expense to have someone do it for me.

Peter, I agree with you that the work does not look to be Japanese made but the stock does not look Persian to me at all as the Persian examples I am aware of have a round butt.

Peter, while your gun may have a different story there are a lot of reasons why certain domains did not purchase modern firearms. Funds were a big problem with some domains, foreign traders wanted something of value in exchange for their guns, not an iou. By the mid 1800s many domains were broke but they could always get smiths from their domain to make guns. Some domains were either very small and it was not worth it for them to purchase modern firearms and some domains were far from major trading centers were they would have been able to purchase modern firearms. I am sure there are more reasons, such as just keeping the remaining traditional gun makers employed in the same way sword smiths were kept busy making swords. Of course this all collapsed sometime during the Meiji period, Japan could not get rid of the old style weapons fast enough.

I simply posted the wrong image, their products are used by restorers without any complaints as far as I know. Here is a link to their silk products. http://fusahimo.com/blog/mt-search.cgi?blog_id=1&tag=正絹 (Admin - Image removed, don't need the whole page copied here)

I simply posted the wrong image, of course that carry silk. If anyone had taken the time to look through their site they would have seen this.

This technique was used not only on armor, I have seen jingasa, yari saya and other objects as well. As far as armor goes I am not sure how common it was or how far back in time it was used, there are some very knowledgable forum members who may have some answers but apparently they are currently to busy to help. As for how it was done exactly I do not know what material or materials were specifically added to the raw usushi in order to make tataki usushi, I can guess that is was something like kukuso. Here are a few examples, the menpo is from Trevor Absolons book "The Watanabe Art Musuem", he describes it as being 1600s to 1700s.

If anyone else needs silk odoshi here is a link to a Japanese manufacturer. They are easy to deal with, speak excellent English and supply odoshi at around £1.10 / $1.45 a meter I believe. I think they also manufacture tsuka-Ito and sageo as well, even tassles and agimaki knots etc. .http://fusahimo.com/index.shtml

Do you mean like this example. Kuro tataki urushi momonari kabuto.

Steve, I heard that some people are immune to the effects, I have had poison ivy rash as a child a few times, poison ivy is similar to usushi rash and it is not fun at all, covered in calamine lotion for days!!! Do you have any examples of your urushi work, I would like to see it if you have any images or advice, tips etc.

Your right about the toxicity yet quite a few people who post urushi related videos on Youtube do not wear gloves....??? Here is a good video of an aikuchi tanto koshirae being lacquered, while not armor it is a similar process. 0:08 carved wooden handle and scabbard Sealing 0:12 mixing sokui, water, and ki-urushi to make nori-urushi 4:11 using nori-urushi as an adhesive for the wooden fittings (not shown: wiping the surface with ki-urushi or nori-urushi to seal it) Filling the Base 6:13 mixing tonoko (~diatomaceous earth) and ki-urushi to make sabi 8:07 filling gaps and openings with sabi Polishing the Base 9:58 leveling the surface with charcoal Building the Mid Layers 12:56 brush coating with urushi Polishing 15:48 leveling the surface with charcoal Repeat 17:20 brush coating with urushi...and repeat to build up base... 19:11 finished work

I agree, a yoroi-doshi should be noticeably thicker, length is not as important, here is an example, when you look at it there is no doubt that it is a yoroi-doshi as it is .5 inches / 12.7mm, I believe the indicator is the motogasane (blade thickness) at the hamachi (the notch at the beginning of the cutting edge)....someone correct this if I am wrong please

Eventually everyone who is interested in Japanese armor comes across Japanese armor related terms and Japanese lacquer (urushi) related terms. I will post the most common urushi terms that relate to armor along with their meanings. Here is some basic urushi information. It should be noted that not everyone uses these terms and they may use similar or completely different terms then the ones listed here. From http://www.hakuminurushi.com/ Raw usushi needs to be cured, after this process pigments are added to the cured urushi in order to create colored urushi. Black, red and rust brown are the colors you are most likely to find along with treated bare metal (tetsu sabiji). COMMON TERMS from http://www.hakuminurushi.com/urushi/glossary.html and other sources. Urushi=lacquer Nuri=Painting, layering, coating. A term used to denote a lacquer object or technique as opposed to the lacquer itself. Arami urushi=The unprocessed sap taken straight from the lacquer tree. At this point it is a milky white liquid that cannot be used as lacquer without further processing. The sap is filtered and left to sit for an extended period of time to allow partial oxidation as well as evaporation of some of the water content. Once the liquid reaches the proper water content and oxidization levels, it can be used as lacquer and is then called ki-urushi. Ki urushi=Raw lacquer(also nama urushi). Raw urushi after it has been filtered and slightly reduced in water content to make it usable as lacquer. There are different types of ki urushi depending on the origins of the tree as well as the season that the tree was tapped. Hatsugama (also hatsu urushi), collected early summer, has a high water content in the emulsion and has a high adhesive potential. It is used for adhesive mixtures and for suri-urushi. Sakari urushi, collected late summer, is used for processing into kuro urushi and suki urushi. Oso urushi is collected early fall and urame and tome urushi is collected at the end of the season in late fall prior to cutting down the tree. Eda and seshime were traditionally collected from the branches during the winter after the tree was cut down, but in modern times, low quality urushi from China or a mixture of Japanese and Chinese urushi is sold as seshime. Kuro=Black Kuro urushi=Black lacquer. Shu=Red/vermillion Shu urushi=Red lacquer. Sabi urushi=A paste made by mixing powdered burnt clay "tonoko" with seshime-urushi (sap taken from the branch of the lacquer tree). Fine wheat flour is often added. Sabi-urushi was used as a preliminary lacquer layer "kataji" on wooden statues, and often found on late Heian and Kamakura periods bugaku masks "bugakumen". It was also used to build up surfaces in raised lacquerwork takamakie. Sabiji urushi=Brown colored lacquer that imitates rusty/russet iron. Kin=Gold Kin paku=Very thin gold leaf that covers a lacquered surface. Gin=Silver Gin paku=Very thin silver leaf that covers a lacquered surface Tetsu=Iron Tetsu sabiji=Russet iron, a complicated process that allows bare metal to be exposed to the elements without being destroyed. Byakudan urushi. A rare lacquer made by covering a gold or silver lacquered surface with a transparent layer of red lacquer which lets the underneath precious metal shine through. Tetsu seishime urushi=Russet iron surface treated with a special process involving the application of raw urushi which once dried is heated for a few minutes over a charcoal brazier. The resulting deep, matt brown finish is also resistant to rust. Kokuso / kokuso urushi=A mixture of wood powder, sawdust, or plant fibers with nori urushi or mugi urushi for use as a filler or putty in both the substrate before lacquering and in repair of damaged pieces. Tataki urushi=A lacquer finish that features a raised relief rippled texture. VISUAL EXAMPLES. Sabiji urushi. Shu urushi. Tetsu sabiji. Kinpaku urushi. Kuro urushi. Tetsu seishime urushi. Gin paku urushi. Byakudan urushi. This European helmet was modified for use in Japan, the inside is an example of Byakudan urushi nuri. Tataki urushi. kokuso urushi. Used as a filler as in this example of what looks like a suji bachi kabuto but is actually built up using kokuso urushi and other elements.

There is evidence that the Japanese did have access to information on more advanced (supposedly) European firing mechanisms, why they did not catch on until the mid to late 1800s is a mystery as far as I know, there might be more information about this in Japanese gun circles but you would have to be able to speak Japanese and know the right people etc. Here are a few examples, I do not know when the Japanese first learned about flintlocks, wheellocks and percussion guns but for whatever reason they did not catch on immediately as you would expect if they were so much more advanced than the matchlock.

Peter, why would anyone be annoyed, this is a forum and people are supposed to discuss things on a forum. As for this statement... "special samurai rejection of guns in favor of sword".....we know that matchlocks were still used for hunting both by commoners and samurai. When you look at other similar cultures from the same time period such as the Ottomans and Indians, they are seen in period illustrations as carrying a wide range of weapons along with firearms. Matchlocks were not a very good personal protection weapon, they were more of a mass use weapon. Unless your opponent was quite far from you, by the time you loaded a matchlock your opponent would have cut your head off. We often expect that the Japanese should have wanted to adopt Western habits just as many other cultures have but the Japanese also felt that their ways were superior. For whatever reason they did not take to carrying firearms with them everywere they went. It is not as if they did not own them, in fact the vast majority of Japanese matchlocks that I have seen are Edo period. By the way, any pictures of your recent good luck?

I can see the pocket now, I think you made a good find.

Do you have a small pole or rod etc that you could slide into the pocket so it can be seen?

Some additional images by Tony Mcnicol that were not used in the article showing Robert at work, tools and materials. http://tonymcnicol.photoshelter.com/gallery/Robert-Soanes-armour-restorer-May-2016/G0000tVj8F7a3Aiw

Can you post a picture showing the pocket?

In my opinion there is no way to tell if the sode were originally made for this armor or added later, the kanamono (metal fittings) of the dou and sode match, the lacquer matchs, the hon kozane (armor scales) match, the odoshi matchs. Now lets suppose the dou does not have a agamaki no kan, why would this be? It would have been childs play for the armor maker to add a agamaki no kan to the dou. If in fact there is not a agamaki no kan that would not be anything unusual, it was simply not need. During the Edo period, the vast majority of armors were not worn, they were displayed. I mean were would an Edo period samurai wear one anyway, and even if worn how often? Luxurious armors, weapons etc were given as gifts, either to curry favor of superiors or as a reward or acknowledgement to subordinates. As a display in a samurai's home, the liberal splashing of family mons all over this armor would have been a show ownership, it would have been up against a wall, a large sashimono with the family mon as well jutting up the back for all to see. No real need for an agamaki no kan on an armor which would never be worn...at least that is how I see it. The dou (lt), compared to the sode (rt).

Fantastic, you should make a new thread with some more pictures.

It is possible that there is an agamaki no kan but it is hidden from view by the uked-zutsu. There are examples of dou that have both agamaki no kan and uked-zutsu. Now why would the agamaki be attached to the gattari instead the no kan if one was present? The example below shows why, on the left the agamaki is attached to the no kan and the uked-zutsu is keeping the agamaki from being seen, having the agamaki on top of the uked-zutsu is much more visually presentable in my opinion. Here is an example of a dou with both agamaki no kan (yellow arrow) and uked-zutsu (red arrow). Here you can see how a agamaki knot looks when it is under the uked-zutsu and on top of the uked-zutsu.