mike yeon

Think the exact wording was "indistinct tip". Maybe lack of boshi (would explain the price.) I've seen ko-bizen pieces with major flaws (retemper, hagire, etc.) sell for a lot more. It simply a matter of rarity. mike

Sold to Big Mo. Thanks everyone for your thoughts/help. mike

looks shinto to me. The length of nakago, the hamon and yakidashi say shinto to me. There were a ton of bizen sukesada smiths in the shinto period. One of the only bizen mon to survive the flooding. Though I have not seen any shinto sukesada that were signed with a very sue-koto "bishu osafune sukesada" mei. my 2 cents. mike

Thank you Ludolf for hunting down those blades. Much appreciated sir. Not sure how well priced those blades are but using the amount someone paid in 2003, a wakizashi by the same smith, papered and in good polish, would be anywhere from $6000-$7000 I'm guessing? I think I'd be happy to get half that at this point. PM me if you're interested. I'll most likely post it on eBay this week. If you'd like more pictures, let me know and I'll take some tonight. Thanks again. mike

PS. I don't mean for this post to sound like a soft sell. If anyone here is interested, please PM me. Although eBay will give me a wider pool of buyers I certainly prefer to sell it to a fellow forum member. Also, if this blade fails to paper, I'll issue a full refund. Thanks. mike

Hello Everyone, I'm most likely going to sell this wakizashi in the next few days. Going to stick it on eBay. I'm a little fuzzy on the the market value of the piece. I know there's the real value and then there's the value of what the current market will sustain. Thought I'd get some thoughts from members before I set a price. Any comments would be appreciated. Up for auction is a MASSIVE Osaka Shinto wakizashi from my collection that’s been one of my favorite pieces to own. Total Length: 27.5†(69.8 CM) Nagasa: 21†(53.3 CM) Nakago: 6.5†(16.5 CM) Width at Hamachi: 1.6†(4 CM)!!!! With at Monouchi: 1.4†(3.6 CM) Sori: 1.5 CM Hada: Fine ko-itame Hamon: Nioi-deki. Starts as notare-ba for 1/3 of the blade then goes into a straight suguha Kissaki: Chu-Kissaki Boshi: o’maru with a ridiculous turn-back that goes into the mune This blade is the work of Shimosaka school smith Kunitsuna and beautifully signed “Echizen Ju†on the ura and “Sagami (no) Kami Fujiwara Kunitsuna†on the reverse. One of the most nicely carved mei I’ve seen on any blade. There were 2 Echizen Kunitsuna during the early Shinto periods, the shodai and nidai. I’m certain this blade is the work of the shodai (1st generation). Which would date it to around 1648. In any case both are rated “chu-jo-saku†(superior medium made/above average) by Fujishiro in his Nihon Token Jiten. Kunitsuna is listed as “Wazamono†in the Kaihokenshaku as well. Which means he made blades of “superior sharpness.†He was part of the Shimosaka school of smiths that was founded by Tokugawa retained smith Yasutsugu. Kunitsuna worked in Echizen province and made blades in the Soshu tradition (the Soshu/Masamune tradition originated from Sagami province.) This blade must have been a special order piece as it is unusually large and wide. I’ve named it “the butcher knife†for obvious reasons. CONDITION Near perfect. This blade is in older polish with some light scratching in 2 places where a qualified togishi used finger stones to remove active rust. It is amazingly thick and healthy for its age. The hamon turn back at the boshi runs into the mune. It is large and heavy with NO FATAL FLAWS, openings, ware, etc. I believe this blade has seen very few polishes in its lifetime. It’s a thick, healthy blade. KOSHIRAE The sword comes with a black textured saya and tsuka with black same (huge nodules). Unfortunately all the fittings had long been taken from the furniture. The tsuka can easily be rewrapped and fitted. The saya though has split at the mouth. This can be fixed as well but it’s not an easy or cheap repair. Personally I’d have a new saya made. Habaki is copper with a rain pattern. The sword comes with a new shirasaya made by Moses Becerra last year. Those who know Big Mo and his work know his shirasaya are works of art in themselves. Hate to name drop but Bob Benson mentioned he's seen only 4 blades in his career made by this smith. I know another forum member mentioned he owned 2 swords by this smith. Any thoughts welcome. Sorry for the long post. Brian, if you think this should go in the auctions or sales area, please feel free to move it. I have not posted it for sale yet. Wanted to get some input from forum members first. Thanks mike

Could it be a surender tag? mike

That is not a Japanese sword. Looks like a chinese fake. Folded doesn't mean real. Some chinese fakes will look like damascus gone wrong. I would not cut anything with it. You don't know how it was made or what it's made off. It's a safety issue. Also, not sure how its going to improve your MA skills by swinging something around without a handle. If you have a sensei he will tell you the same. mike

I might have to swing by this auction if I find the time. Agree with the over pricing on some pieces (mino kanenaga for $15K-$25K?! If anyone is willing to pay that much I'll sell them mine. With NTHK papers and all.) :D But then you find a "kamakura bizen tachi" estimated to sell at $3K-$4K? (albeit with a "indistinct tip") Interseted in the yasutsugu II at the low end though no mention of papers. Also might make a play for the sukeyoshi. Anyone else planning to go in person? mike

I don't see any kunisada in fujishiro's or sato's shinto book from 1700 and up (which doesn't mean much). There are a few big name (jo-saku - sai-jo saku) shinto kunisada. Osaka line smiths. Which your blade I believe is not. $6K is a lot to spend on a cutter. martial arts swords is a korean company that makes excellent semi-production blades. I own a jingum from them that handles and cuts very well. They make Japanese style blades too. All for about $2K. Me personally, I'd be hesitant to cut with an antique. They deserve better I think. The polish looks like its in bad shape (sandpapered like guido mentioned) I'm sure you know what an unevenly sharp edge does to your cuts/sword. I'd also make a new saya as well if you're planning to practice iai. Good luck! mike

It is the sushi rice. Short grain. You can find bags upon bags in any Japanese or Korean market. Those of us who grew up Japanese or Korean were raised with the indignity of using mom made rice glue for arts and crafts projects while the other kids used elmers...

Thanks Ricky. Missed the last meeting in Jan. Try and make it this month. Will bring in my "sa yukihide". mike

Not sure if anyone submitted blades last Sept to the NY Shinsa but if you have, did you recieve your papers yet? I believe the turnaround time was 3-5 months. Submitted a few blades that papered. Still waiting on mine. Thanks. mike

Hey Carlo, Been super busy. :D I'll PM you later. mike

Thanks Carlo, It looks even better in person. I usually avoid suspect blades but this sword is a beauty. I went with my gut on this one. mike

Ubu-ha is a good indicator of gendai/showa because of the logic that more recent blades would not have been polished as many times as older ones. I've seen ubu-ha on a number of shin-shinto blades as well. Depending on the damage and polisher it takes a few polishes for he ubu-ha to completely go away. Also, Stephen is right about value as a healthier blade is certainly more desireable. mike

Just curious as to why you'd want the ubu-ha completely removed if it is not necessary? The presence of ubu-ha means the blade has seen few polishes. Almost every blade begins with one then the ubu-ha gradually disapears as more niku is taken off the blade through polish. mike

Curran, The MNYJSC meetings are great. We're lucky to have Kodama sensei and Izuka sensei. I showed Kodama san my kunitsuna wakizashi last month which had a bit of light rust on an otherwise clean polish and he offered to remove it with fingerstones for me at the next meeting. It's amazing how you can study a blade on your own, come to your conclusions and then these guys will just open your eyes to unthought of details in under 30 seconds. Same goes for many members. Are you no longer in the area that you can't attend meetings any longer? cheers. mike

I agree with John. Could be some sort of chikei or even jifu. or simply the polish. it's funny to think of it as eyes though. maybe the smith was the one who had a little too much sake... mike :D

Hey John, how's it going? I'm sure cards slip through the system now and then, just stating the process. I see sellers sometimes offering photo copies, laminated color copies and such of Japanese registration cards. Also, the registration card system is used by the government to keep track of and catalogue nihonto. It's not meant to indicate quality, or for appraisal purposes (like papers from the NBTHK or NTHK.) mike

You might have gotten a copy of the card. I believe practice is when they ship it out, customs discards the original card. I've seen swords outside of Japan with copies of cards, never the original. mike

Stephen, thank you very much for the picts sir. The yoran balde is especially helpful in that it says the hamon is nioi-deki and hada is itame. Still inbetween on the mei. Looking at these examples and the ones in fujishiro's and kanzan's it just illustrates that each signature has subtle differences but the same intent. It's like how when we sign our signatures, they all "look" the same, are written with the same purpose and technique, but no 2 examples are identical. Gotta love this part of collecting. This blade will make one more stop at the MNYJSC meeting at the end of the month, then hopefully, off to Japan. Thanks again everyone. mike

PPS. As for the mei, I saw the one in Fujishiro's (which looks tighter) maybe because of the fact it was the nakago of a naginata? The nakago on my blade is large as well. 8.75" long and wide. Also, my picts aren't the best but in hand it's easier to compare stroke direction/spacing to other oshigata (the ones in sato's shinto book) and they look "right". mike

Thank you everyone for your comments. As for the sword's provenence, it used to belong to a U.S. collector who had long stopped collecting (an older gentleman who primarily collected during the 1970s). The stories he tells me about the prices and blades that were floating around back then makes me want to build a time machine. Anyway, he sent the blade to Japan in the early 70s to who he described as an amature togishi (he ultimately was not happy with the polish). He never thought to paper the blade when it was in Japan (he mentioned the majority of western collectors were not as informed back in the day and you really had to know people to get around). Also, Curran, this guy would agree with you on papers. He once told me that when the NBTHK used to come to the U.S. back in the 80s some of the judges would reject a blade and there would be a crowd of Japanese dealers waiting to buy the "gimei" blades. I have no reason to doubt the man. I still like papers =) Ultimately he thought the hada (not the mei) did not match with the body of Yukihide's work. I tend to agree. If it's gimei, someone went through a lot of trouble to make this piece. But all in all, I bought the blade because it's simply gorgeous (although I wish the polish was sashikomi). The thing is a beast. It also came with very nice koshirae (black lacquered saya with real gold flakes, soten school tsougu.) Thanks again for the commentary! And if anyone can get me more info on Sa Yukihide, please send on over. P.S. Stephen, how about I send you the tsunagi of my "sa yukihide"?

Anyway, It's hard to see the hamon in the picts (it definitely a bit more wavy and irregular.) Any insights welcome. I'll try and take better pictures. Thanks mike