Henri

This maedate looks like it was made for a modern day parade by a hobbiest. Im not sure if People have noticed, but the characters are very out of proportion and the tools used for the making is improper…..

Hi Brian with all respect. The link did not work for my computer. I was taken to a page I think. I could barely see the photos. The page was useless for me. Perhaps if you downloaded the photos and posted here some people would be able to help.

Yes I agree on this point. I wonder if the signature was removed from an old armor and this is a replica. I did see a helmet very similar to this once that was made by one of the dealers I mentioned… but it was brass! Very strange.

This armor was made late. Gold colour armours such as this with true kozane and orange lace were made from Late Edo onward. I believe this to be maybe Meiji or after. (but incorporating good parts such as the kabuto) One of the most important things to notice is urushi shitaji which uses ash and has that light grey color. This is not a traditional technique and this method tends to fail very quickly because the Ph of the ash, causes acide which can causes the shitaji to fail, and if on iron, to ruste. MIura (Anjin) sensei was perhaps the first to write about the use of ash from the late Edo period onward. Also, the leaf that is on this armor may not be real gold. It may be a kind of leaf made with bronze that looks like gold. Finally, be careful because Mr. Morisaki (deceased) made similar armors that were also mass produced with real scale like this, which were very expensive and well made. However his did not use real urushi and had a grey paint primer such as on the mempo. Something to look our for. There were special dealers in this sort of armor into the 20th century, they were bought by rich families for coming of age ceremonies, and sold at large touriste ports such as yokohama. Thence the word for them “hamamono” (things from yokohama) I have seen several such armors with “Nobuie” signatures. I wonder if there was an artist by that name with a shop there…..

If an items is over a certain amount in value, they put it through customs differently. Items over that value can be denied expourt if the customs inspecteur thinks that it may be culturally significant. The only documentation that they accept is an export permit that is issued by Monbusho. The expourt permit basically states that the item is NOT on their list of cultural properties, and thus may be exported. If an item is stopped at customs, it will turn in to a bit of a mess. I have known examples of this happening. In some cases for import to Japan dealer documentation is acceptable for stating that an item is a real antique. For export, a dealer certificate, or even a certificate of authenticity made by the Japanese armour society, or the International Japanese arms and armour society is not sufficient because they only speak to whether or not the item is authentic. The International Japanese Arms and Armor Society mentioned above not only makes certificates of authenticity, but also files for expourt permits from Monbusho. This service is recommened for people who wish to have a good record of export from Japan. Many museums wish to do this because of the changing laws and regulations regarding antiques. Currently proxy bidding companies such as jauce, smile, etc. are breaking the law in not performing this for their expensive antiquities exports. This will likely not last long and once exposed, they will be out of business. The International organization mentioned above does this for swords, armor, etc. My recommendation if you wish to file the documentation for an expensive item and have a proper record.

This is a very good introduction video for armour beginners and amateurs because it is something that just about anybody can make. So it is a good entry project. The most important difference is that Ogawa san also known as Atsuta sensei- his artist name, uses a soft steel that has a bit of aluminum, to make it easier to fourm and not tear, also he is not using urushi. He is using paint primer in the video. I dont know if Atsuta sensei ever actually did the art of urushi, but it is a whole different technique than in the video. Atsuta sensei is a very kind man and in recent years has devoted his live to sharing his knowledge at a hobbiest level for average people who wish to try to make samurai armour. He is also very humble about saying that his works should not be compared to the real thing which uses more traditional techniques and materials. He is open to teaching just about anybody.

One interesting thing that I have noticed about these helmets, is that even though many of the parts are pressed and cast, they still must be assembled by hand. I frequently have seen re-aligned rivet holes on these items. Maybe it is because they changed their helmet style, or the worker picked up a plate for a different helmet, or they ran out? Who knows… but it is actually common. Yes, marutake is still a produced of most of the modern items. Iron mountain, parts made in China, is often used to make fakes by shady dealers…. same as paul chen was years ago. This helmet I think was made by a different place that is no longer in business but I may be mistaken. I agree here, be careful with cleaning, but a light coating of oil will probably darken the patina and preserve it as is preventing further rust. do a test area first to make sure you like the result.

My opinion would be to leave it as a relic. Many collecteurs of such antiquities like them to appear as “au jus” in the juices as they say even though it is a more recent antique it looks the part. If such an item was mine, I would make a very nice wood display stand that is special for it and display it as is. Cleaning of course, is recommended, such as dust and other particles which could damage the natural patina. Alcohol removes dirt well, and evaporates quick. If may make the surface look dry though.

I am pretty sure that this helmet is a modern replica meaning after the Edo period. I have seen similar ones throughout Japan. The fittings are a particular style that is cast for that company. The rivet heads are modern nails which are used to facilitate riveting. It seems that these were made quite a while back from Meiji until the 20th century using the same forms and molds. It is still quite a nice fun piece though. I hope this information helps.

I may be late to this conversation but yes I have seen this form called Toppai kabuto. Shiinari is usually used for higher vaulted or more pointed toppai kabuto. And I think that you are correct in both of your assumptions. that is similar to the way that they used to write the kanji for “20”. This is more likely the katakana for “sa”. I have seen army presentation maps were the different groups in formations were noted as katakana in the Japanese phonetic alphabet for their relative positions. such as batallion 1, 2, 3, 4. = battalion sa shi su se so. and so on.

One of the kindest and most helpful people I have met. Yes very busy, but will always make time with advance notice.

Samurai Art, Im sorry I dont know who you are really and have not heard of you previously, I have only seen a few of the things you have written here as I just joined. I was only trying to clarify some of your mistakes, but I am an amateur and did not mean to offend or embarrass you. I did study Japanese in my university and have done home stays, so my Japanese is pretty good. I have also been learning here in Japan for some time. I was only trying to correct some of the terrible mistakes you have made regarding Urushi, such as the names of the urushi, and the most funny was where you mistook the word furo (which means "bath tub") for the word Muro which is a temperature/humidity controlled chamber. I think you can probably do urushi in a bath tub though if you like. Though, I really regret some of the things that you have said regarding the abilities of the artists in Japan though that is insulting to them and people like me who have made the long walk to study under them. That is not fair to them, and it turns many people away from this beautiful country. People who might have the dream of coming here to learn, or hiring a traditional artiste to do work for them. I was lucky to have met some people who guided my path here. I did not mean to embarrass you by pointing out your mistakes as I am just an amateur. I of course have just begun my journey, so I do not wish to make any enemies here. One thing that I don’t understand though, You say Mister Mancabelli’s teacher, Miura Hiromichi said that you were a much better student than his own students, and that is why Andy (current Miura sensei), dislikes you? Im sure you know, because you have watched Japanese television about this, but Miura Hiromichi, named Andy as his “atotsugi” which means heir, or successor. He gave Andy permission to use his name “Miura” and when I met with him, he called Andy “Anjin” because he was not able to phonetically pronunce his name correctly. This was cute. And Miura sensei told Andy to use it as his “shu mei” or pen name. It is also the name of his registered company. If you met Miura sensei, he would have pronunced your name as “De-Bu” which in Japanese is a derogatory term for "Grossly obese". I know it is very ironic because you are probably very skinny, which is also funny. I was told that Miura Sensei was from the Miura hanto peninsula originally, which was were Miura Anjin - William Adam’s family and estate was located. It is actually possible that there is a direct connection to William Adams that you mentioned. Now Andy is “Miura sensei” I dont think many foreigners have been named successors to living treasures. I have seen his work and it is worthy and amazing. And shamefully, I am still a beginner, so I have nothing of worth to show. Maybe I can have something for you in a few years….. I hope. For now, I will only share what knowledge I have been able to learn from the kind teachers I have met.

Thank you Yojimbo for the compliment. However, I am not quite his equal. Still learning, so I am currently only book smart and trying to learn from the best.

I would try talking to somebody else on facebook. Try in Japanese. Many very helpful artists there who will not lead you in the wrong direction. If you are in Japan and need advice, Miura sensei has helped me so much in the right direction. But you would have to travel to Japan to meet him in person. There are also some workshops in Japan that teach urushi (not for armor) which offer short courses for amateurs and people who wish to have a hobby. It can help as an introduction to this art.

This statement is the most disingenuous thing I have seen written on this thread. There are indeed people to learn from in Japan. I know, thats why I traveled half way around the world to do so. Such a statement only operates to hurt the reputations of the more than qualified artists here in Japan who have devoted their lives to the betterment of traditional art. If you really wanted your son to learn from the best, I would suggest sending him to Japan. Mancabelli (Miura Anjin) only does tradional work. Nishioka is capable of traditional work and is trained, however I think some of the students are using non-traditional methods at least for their new work and harikake helmets that they make. Ogawa does not use traditional methods and many of his orders in recent times are done in aluminum. He himself has stated that his works are for cosplay and hobbiests. He is a nice man and has been very straightforward about his techniques. Most of the current traditional armourers living in Japan have come from or been influenced by the Morita Tomojiro line. The information about rawhide here is also wrong. They did not wait three years to make armours out of it in the olden days . You just have to be taught how to work with it and prepare it before lacquer. When working with rawhide, you do use steam to mould it. Of course, they applied urushi shortly afterward. Fake urushi will not work with rawhide. If you use fake urushi it will fail. The procedure for lacquering rawhide is of course different from that of iron and you must learn the techniques. Do you use real urushi? Where did you study? Who was your teacher? Its not a “furo” its a “MURO” and there is a big difference between the two! There are currently, other sellers of traditional urushi besides Watanabe. But I found them through Miura sensei’s instagram where he gives directions to their website and shop to help promote traditional art. he told me that he will continue to add more such information to the page.

Hi, This information is not actually correct. I have found that sometimes the words used in local areas, and depending on the particular profession, what the artist calls the materials can change. However, what you are calling “sabiji urushi” is absolutely wrong for Japanese armour, and I cannot see how it could be right for other professions such as box lacquering, bowl lacquering etc. Armour is the most difficult of all of the arts to do lacquer on and uses different techniques. What Samurai art is talking about is “sabi ji nuri” which means literally “rust finish coating”. It is basically a “makiji” coating covered with either one or two additional coats of seshhime, or a pigmented urushi that gives it the appearance of a “rusted finish”. For armour, the base coat that Samurai Art mentions does not use some of the ingredients, and certainly not as a combination, though it can use some of them. Also, Tonoko is not dried volcanic clay. Clay is sedimentary and it is derived from sedimentary deposits in different locations in Japan and in the olden days, leftover polishing stone powder (from stone polishers) could be used as as well for particular work such as makie etc.(uchiko) By rumour the best tonoko comes from Kyoto. However in Wajima (Ichikawa) they do use a type of jinoko (dirt) that is derived from a different process. In recent years they do not allow people outside of their artiste group to acquire it, and it is a shame. I do agree that there are few books in non-japonese language but there are many books in Japanese, and there are some good videos in Japanese and English about proper urushi. Mancabelli sensei is trying to save the traditional arts here in Japan by promoting the dealers and giving information for those trying to learn. There is a very large difference with real urushi and fake urushi such as cashew. and they do not mix. fake urushi should never be used for restoration and damages/destroys the original item. there are too many points to mention here. Real urushi does take a high level of commitment, literally a lifetime. Most would be restourers or artists do not want to take the time to learn how to work with it. But actually YES there are books, and YES there are very capable people in existence that are very qualified to help devoted, serious newcomers. Unfortunately they are currently mostly living in Japan.

Hi Trevor, I saw your post. I am studying in Japan about Japanese armour, lacquer, sword fittings, swords and related. If you wish to learn more, Andrew Mancabelli was very kind and has been helping my studie. His teacher was the most famouse armourer in the 20th century and he currently runs a traditional workshop in Japan. It is very difficult to get an intruduction but he has done a lot of work for the public including a bunch of video tutorials on traditional REAL urushi (Japanese lacquer) and lacing on his instagram page and facebook. I dont think that you would be able to find a better advisor. Actually, one of the photos that you posted is his and is currently in a museum for display.