cspage

As the sales pitch says..."It's a monter !" ...no, really "a monter!" Colin

Whew! I don't want to be overly critical, and absolutely mean no disrespect to Keith, but does anyone else have difficulty following a train of thought without punctuation? I suspect the modern age of social messaging has trained those quick young minds to immediately grasp what the message is, but for my increasingly sluggish 62 year old mind, used to reading books, not twitters, it just muddles all together. :? The real concern, of course, is that something might be misconstrued due to run-on strings of words, especially when a complex subject like nihonto really requires a certain level of clarity in order to convey information and/or instruction. Just my observation, sorry for the interruption. Colin

Higo Nishigaki? Tsuba Kansho-ki, page 152. Similarities exist. Colin

Just for the fun of it, I did a little photoshopping on this tsuba just to see what the original might have looked like. Definitely much more pleasing. The fukurin also seems a bit over the top for the wonderful simplicity of this tsuba, and a bit out of proportion. Aesthetically, the original was so much more appreciable. Could the alterations have been recent? The sekigane in the nakago ana looks pretty fresh, and while I'm very new at this, it doesn't seem to be the best craftmanship, either. Come to think of it, the open hitsu ana doesn't look proportionate to the plugged one and also seems to be a bit clunky in execution, IMHO. Maybe I'll take that out too and see how the result looks. Colin

Joe, the reason I pointed you to that site is that I just purchased a tsuba from Grey Doffins offer in the For Sale area of this site that was listed as an Ono tsuba and I imediately started searching for the characteristics of this school. I especially like the description offered by Jim's friend..."massive "like the foundation stones of a Japanese castle." What a wonderful description, and so very appropriate. Colin

Jean, oh, believe me, I've no illusions about the level capabilities here. Just trying to keep myself above the waterline as long as possible. Colin (note the one "l," a very touchy subject with all Colins throughout the universe.)

Ford, I see you caught my post before I realized I'd made the perfect Freudian slip and corrected it. Don't want the Board to think I'm trying to lower the level of discussion here. Colin

Mariuszk, excellent point. Lovely rings, however, are very seductive and one wants to believe they have nothing but positive implications for tsuba. Flicking fingernails at tsuba will no doubt carry on just for the aural gratification if nothing else. (I think this subject has probably been driven into the ground previously, so I will stop now.) Colin

Joe, you might find the description of Ono tsuba interesting on Jim Gilbert's site: http://home.earthlink.net/~jggilbert/ono.htm Colin

For what it's worth, my "Nobuiye" tsuba diagnosed as cast a couple of weeks ago has a lovely ring to it. Colin

No pic attached, Tony. Or...it's a unique tsuba none of us have ever seen before... Colin

Not to beat a dead horse, but I just came across another "Nobuiye" tsuba with similar characteristics as the one that started this string. http://tsuba.jyuluck-do.com/TU10029.html The hexagonal designs are similar, the signature and melty look to it are similar...AND there are the telltale little bubble nodules that are so similar to my tsuba. I make no conclusions about the site owners at all. Just applying new information. Colin

No warring tribes 150 years ago...in Japan (well, there may be that one instance). In the American west, however...but that's a different story. I was also tempted to introduce the treacherous postulation that animals copulating as something humerous might be related to "Western" influence, but being beheaded is not in my life plan. Colin

I'm not in any way an expert in Japanese art, but I don't get that there's a particular sense of humor in this painting. Procreation is an art subject that is as old as the hills and there are several aspects of this particular painting that seem to impart a fairly direct hommage to the act of making life. One is the expressions on the animals' faces, definitely not humorous but rather an intensity of purpose. The overall composition, the weight and impact of the joined bodies against the lightly rendered plantlife and negative space surrounding the positive object, the obvious coloration differentiating the two animals, points to a considertion of the subject matter that has substance. I rather like this piece and might hang it in my living room if someone gave it to me, not that I see it as a spetacular piece of artwork. I do see the message as a pretty positive one. Of course, trying to evaluate the intent of any given human being by just observation of their artwork is always fraught with pitfalls and I may be totally off base. Why someone would think this is "funny" is a whole subject in itself and I don't think we want to go there...or do we? Colin

...and Mark, the next question for you will inevitably be...if you are willing, could you please post photos of the sword? I'm sure any member of this Board will be itching to see what accompanies this piece of calligraphy. Colin

I apologize for putting off my thanks for Morita san’s post and for Ford’s post, it was just to keep Ford’s name out there on the index, hoping it would attract some further discussion (which it did), kind of like putting the word “manufacture” in my subject to lure him to the post in the first place. Ford and all, this is exactly what I was looking for. I don't consider Ford a "bad cop," just a straight up teacher. Now I have spent a little money (and I mean little) to learn a valuable lesson that will feed me a lifetime (is that a mixed metaphor?). Even if there's dispute over Ford's "incontrovertible proof," I will always be looking for those little bubble granules if there's a similar question about a tsuba and will take mention of yaki-shitate as a process with a grain of salt. How else does one learn this stuff without actually getting into metalworking? Again, thank you all, you guys are the best. Now, if this is a cast tsuba, and therefore less than desirable, why the attention to the shakudo sekigane in the kozuka ana and the silver in the nakago ana? Ploys to attract a healthy purchase price? Or was someone back in the 19th century really enamored of this tsuba none-the-less and felt it had merit? Or something else? Speculation welcome. Colin

Never pass up a chance to show stuff. This is the only kashira I have, but, while somewhat run-of-the-mill, is just dandy on a sword. Fuchi matches, but I don't have a photo at hand at the moment. There is a string some time ago on the folk tale depicted. Colin

Thank you, Pete! That was extremely helpful and exactly the kind of information that makes all this so damn interesting. Just imagining the tsuba maker bringing all that into play in fabricating the tsuba. Very impressive. Thanks for the explanations and definitions, these are so helpful when source material is not as handy as one would desire on these subjects. And thanks to Steve also, as I have just done a quickie run around the internet on Yamakichibei - the Museum of Fine Arts, Boston had a few and the treatment on a couple did have some similarities to the area around the turtle sukashi. The amount of info in this string is enough to keep me very happy for some time. ...but don't let that stop anyone from adding to it! I'm very appreciative. Colin

Mariusz, I apologize if I sounded miffed, it was certainly not intentional. It’s always hard to gauge tone from text and I want to assure you that I am not at all vexed or otherwise out of sorts. I should probably use the smilies more. I certainly appreciate all comments and observations. That’s why I’m here. Pete, here is a close-up of the mei. Also pics of the sukashi turtle and indications of the areas that had me puzzled. Steve probably addressed all these issues, but since I’m so young in learning, all that terminology is lost on me…”yakite-shitate,” “ga-mei,” ‘futoji-mei.” And I guess I’m going to have to research the Yamakichibei. In any case, here are more pics and any elicitation on what’s there is welcome. Thank you all for your interest. Colin

Mark, everything actually could be just fine. I'd considered the turtle may be sitting in a mud puddle or some such, but I just thought I'd put it out there to see if anyone has anything to say. The sukashi just seems a bit alien to the rest of the tsuba and that is mostly a point of the feel of it in hand, unfortunately. Can't adequately convey that in posts. The visual design is dandy, no doubt about it. I will post some closeups tomorrow and maybe there will be something in them, maybe not. Colin

Sounds pretty harsh, Mariusck. I'm not sure if there's irony in your comment or not. Not that I'm complaining. I'm just learning and any new info is helpful. As I said, I have no expectations of this tsuba. I do know the signature is not really clear and powerful, but closeup pics will be helpful and will probably be definitive, one way or the other. I did not buy the tsuba because of the signature, anyway, and I didn't pay much. I am considering this as just paying tuition for a class in the subject, a very specific subject. I'm happy, no matter the verdict. Colin

Pete, will put more pics up tomorrow morning (PDT). Thanks. Colin

Mariusz, thank you for taking a look. I will take some closer pics of the area around the turtle tonight. In my limited experinece with tsuba I've not had the pleasure of handling one with this rich waxy patina. Good to know it's normal. In handling the tsuba, the turtle sukashi area even feels to be minutely thicker than the rest of the tsuba. It is puzzling to me. I also forgot to mention there is a nifty shaduko sekigane in the kozuka ana. I also like the tsuba, and I am always interested in learning the processes by which things are made, so these little oddities intrigue me. Colin

First of all, I would like to say that I have absolutely no expectations of this tsuba. I got it purely for its oddities (at least from my brief experience) and hope there will be comments and observations from which I can learn. I changed the title of this post to elicite attention from some metal workers. Firstly, the surface of the tsuba has a waxy kinda of feel to it, almost like someone had taken shoe polish to it. Secondly, the sekigane at the mune end of the nakago ana looks like someone took a chisel to it on the omote side, very bright and freshly cut. The inside surface, however, shows the a consistent aged patina as the rest of the inner side of all hitsuana. The ha end sekigane of the nakago ana appears to be silver (?). Not lead, very silvery. Thirdly, the turtle sukashi looks and even feels like it was removed from another tsuba or made separately and somehow added to this one. The working of the surface surrounding the sukashi has an alien appearance from the way the rest of the surface is treated, with even the edges of the work area visible and some surface smoothing/chiseling(?) around the tail of the turtle. And finally, the hexagonal pattern of the surface is carried over onto the mimi (which is cool). Width: 6.4cm Hight: 6.75cm Thickness at mimi: 5mm Weight: 100.9g Thanks for any observations. Colin

Boris, thank you so much. I was hoping you were still watching the Board. I was wondering about the Saotome aspect of the tsuba, and was just looking for some relationships that may occur to those out there much more versed in all this than I. I'm not so much interested in classifying the tsuba, just trying to reconcile all the references that are made and illustrated in the books and other resources available...just trying to learn more. I really like this tsuba. Thank you. Colin