George KN

Thanks for the continued advice! In the end, using the mixed pictures I had available from the auction, I put bids on all of them, at levels I felt comfortable given the different amounts of risk involved with each one. So not quite a gut feeling, nor really waiting for one to speak to me, more like throwing spaghetti at the wall and seeing what stuck The other people in the auction must have been bigger fans of shin gunto, or perhaps there's something terribly wrong with it I can't see in the pictures, but the only one I successfully bought was the Kai Gunto, at considerably less than I'd bid on the Yoshimitsu! Although it's going to take me a week or two to get the blade home, I've also already ordered some ashi from ebay, at about 1/4 of the price I paid for the entire thing. Parts aren't cheap are they? I can live without a sarute, as I understand these were sometimes cloth/rope, but I'm not so sure about the chuso clip. Is there a navy specific one I should be trying to find as a replacement, or are they the same as the standard shin gunto ones? And got to love small auction houses though. When I asked if there were any cracks or damage to the blade, they replied in an email that there was a "Small nibble to blade" - which is not something I've heard before whilst collecting lol. They also sent this wonderfully detailed photo of said nibble: I'm just hoping there isn't a hagire hiding somewhere :S

@Bruce Pennington Unfortunately the auction house never gave me a clear picture of the full nakago, and I didn't end up winning it either, but here are the pics I have from them, hopefully they are enough for your data:

Thanks Sam for that list, that's a big help! Unfortunately doesn't have any of the smiths I've identified on, which probably isn't a great sign. And that's a really nice blade John! I'm surprised nobody has snatched it up yet. Genuinely looks in really nice mint condition. The only problem is I'm UK based, and I don't really want to run the risk of our ridiculous customs. I'm also not talking about a lot of money here 😅 - you guys should know by now I prefer liberating blades at bargain prices. Well, that's the idea at least...

Unfortunately still waiting on decent photos... But will share when I get them And interesting - your point about condition and the cost of polish and repair is definitely one I'm going to think over! What about the other factors though, if they were all in an equally good condition? Would you rather a gunto in civilian fittings with a tassel to one in military one without a tassel? Would you rather a kaigunto over a shingunto?

Thanks for the warning Marzio! Looks like a nice blade though Given the terrible pictures I have, I am thinking the Yoshimitsu I'm considering has a high chance of having a stamp somewhere I can't see. Not even sure if he ever made gendaito, and I don't actually know where to check (I have limited books) The thing is, I'm fine with buying a showato if that's what happens - I actually don't have one yet - I just don't know how I should choose between different showato smiths if everything else is equal?

Thanks guys, your replies were much appreciated! I was hoping to reply again with better pictures from the seller/s, but they are being very slow about it... (I won't forget Bruce!)

Hi all, against all odds the tax man has actually reimbursed me some funds instead of take them away, and I'm now on the hunt for a new blade. I have my eye on some, but it's hard to choose between them! I know that signed gendai or older nihonto in military fittings are the dream, but I'm not sure how other things rank in rarity/value. In what order of value (not necessary monetary) would you consider the following (currently not in any particular order)?: 1. Mumei gunto, possibly gendaito, not older, no stamps, silvered habaki, with field grade tassel, in army fittings 2. HIDENOBU gunto, tachi mei + date, small "Na" Nagoya arsenal stamp (unsure if this 100% makes it a showato?), silvered habaki, in army fittings 3. YOSHIMITSU gunto, tachi mei + date, possibly no stamps, with company grade tassel, silvered habaki, in army fittings 4. Signed Kaigunto, tachi mei + date, seki stamp, in kaigunto fittings (but missing any ashi on the saya) 5. KAZUNORI civilian gunto, katana mei + date, seki stamp, in civilian fittings, but with civilian brown tassel Known smith details (not sure any of them made gendaito or not though - kind of assuming all three blades must be non traditional?): HIDENOBU (秀宣), Shōwa (昭和, 1926-1989), Gifu – “Hidenobu” (秀宣), real name Noguchi Satarō (野口佐太郎), born October 16th 1910, he worked as a guntō smith KAZUNORI (一則), Shōwa (昭和, 1926-1989), Gifu – “Kazunori” (一則), real name Kanematsu Kazuichi (兼松一市), born June 10th 1894, he worked as guntō smith and died December 9th 1944, posthumous Buddhist name Zendō Myōtoku (善導妙徳) YOSHIMITSU (義光), Shōwa (昭和, 1926-1989), Gifu – “Yoshimitsu” (義光), real name Yabushita Fujio (藪下不二夫), he was a Seki-based guntō smith Pretty sure I've got these three translations right as I confirmed them here: https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/51632-confirming-my-translations-i Personally I'm currently thinking: 1. YOSHIMITSU gunto - without a stamp it could be a gendaito, and has a tassel. Complete package, limited risk 2. Signed Kaigunto - seki stamp means it isn't a gendaito, but kaigunto are fairly rare and I don't own one yet 3. HIDENOBU gunto - Assuming the na stamp means it is showato, I'm torn between this one and the mumei being next, but I feel the mumei is more of a risk 4. Mumei gunto - rarer field grade tassel. Could be a gendaito, but unsure how I could prove it 5. KAZUNORI civilian gunto - unsure of the rarity of civilian tassels, but it does have the seki stamp, so definitely not gendaito I am working on getting better pictures, especially of the kaigunto so I can make a better decision - but just assume I won't get them So just as a thought experiment more than anything else, which order would you choose? Thanks, and hope you're having a good day, George

Unfortunately I agree with Chris and Lewis - the acid treatment is a big giveaway that it isn't genuine (you can even see it on the tang). Don't be disheartened though, quite a few of us began collecting properly after first buying a fake (including me!). You can't know what you don't yet know, and it's hard to find info on nihonto. Best of luck learning more, and never be afraid of asking us questions about a sword before buying Also, thank you for your service - while I'm nice and safe in the UK so it's easy for me to say, but what's happening in Ukraine both saddens and angers me deeply. Stay strong.

Dude, I've made my fair share of mistakes when trying to treat rust, but what on earth possessed you to clean the copper 😅... Do you just really not like patina? Fair play with the leather work though - as Bruce has said the same sorts of rules that apply to the metals don't to this, because it degrades so quickly. Similarly replacing the wooden mekugi peg if needed is also fine. And as for the steel, people have mentioned that what you've done is bad, but haven't explained why too well beyond you halving the value. I now have at least three blades which have been mucked about with, and learnt the hard way about it all. 1. Japanese swords last hundreds of years. They get past from owner to owner, generation to generation. If someone in that chain doesn't look after it well, and rust builds up, it will need to be polished. Polishing is a destructive action - it always removes steel from the blade, never adds it. Yes, you have removed the rust, but in doing so have likely removed more material than a traditional polish would, shortening the swords lifespan. The nakago (tang) is never traditionally polished, or else the mei (signature) would quickly disappear. As others have mentioned, removing the rust from the nakago also removes one of the easiest ways to help date a blade. 2. The other problem with using sandpaper and stones without knowing enough about Japanese swords is you'll likely have changed the geometry of the blade, rounding edges and divisions that shouldn't be. For example most nihonto aren't shaped like a knife with a razor edge, and instead have a rounded niku/profile like the below (A.) example (https://japaneseswordindex.com/niku.htm): This profile can be easily altered unknowingly with stones and belt sanders. Similarly, the yokote (the vertical dividing line between the kissaki (tip of the blade)) and the rest of it should be a sharp transition, as should the shinogi (ridge line) - these again will likely have been rounded more than normal (https://www.Japanese...dex.com/glossary.htm). They are possible for a professional to fix if there is enough meat on the blade, but doing so will mean even more of the steel will need to be removed than in a normal polish to do so, shortening the blades life further. 3. Using the wrong tools (sandpaper / non-traditional stones) can cause issues in the polish, even when it looks half decent. With the help of others on this forum, it turns out these white lines on my blade are likely from this: Similarly, an uneven polish can cause other issues, like possibly exposing darker core steel (which is what I think maybe happening in other places on this sword): So hopefully that explains a bit more? I'm hoping to explain not just to you @2FixandRepair but also all the people that may come and find this post on the forum through the in-built search or through Google in the future. I genuinely don't mean to come down hard on you, as I've done a whole bunch of mistakes on my journey, and information on the topic is genuinely quite hard to find outside this forum. You are now the guardian of that sword, and while the recent changes aren't ideal, I hope you'll look after it so it can continue its journey and keep writing its history. In the meantime, if you have the slightest interest in learning more, please stick around! There's so much to learn and if you've got the right mindset, it's really rewarding!

Always had good interactions with both @Scogg and @Bruce Pennington - two of the very few people I've actually directly messaged for help, and never seen a bad word from either - great recommendations

Thanks Jean and John, and I'm happy with even 2/3 right, that's awesome! Unfortunately I don't have better photos yet, hopefully the seller will get back to me with some.

Finally got around to trying my hand at translating some mei using Sesko's Swordsmiths on some gunto. It's safe to say I now have a much greater appreciation of the mastery some of you guys have, it takes so long to do!! Any chance you could check my best guesses are correct please? 秀 Hide, Shu 宣 Nobu, Nori HIDENOBU (秀宣) Found a similar mei here: https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/4562-hidenobu/#comment-40614 (義) Yoshi (光) Mitsu, Hikari YOSHIMITSU (義光) Found a similar mei here: https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/50162-please-help-translate-this-one-got-me-stumped/#comment-522414 (一) Ichi (則) Nori - this took me *ages* to work out! Feels like its missing far too many vertical lines KAZUNORI (一則) Found another example here which helped confirm it: https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/47434-my-introduction-help-with-an-officer-sword-please/#comment-492709 Bonus question if anyone happens to know - I noticed the last sword, the Kazunori, is signed with a katana mei, but has a large seki stamp on it. It is also fitted in traditional nihonto (non-military) fittings but has a brown tassel which I read somewhere was for civilians, and a leather covered saya. Are these showato signed with a katana mei rarer? Thanks, George

Ok, ignoring the way you just treated the administrator of the forum - Mustafa, yes, the idea of using electroforming to make a sword with the most efficient and or best combination of layers is pretty cool, and probably quite possible. But as Brian said, being a good cutter or an indestructible blade isn't what make nihonto special. It's not like we regularly use the swords for combat or regularly test them to destruction to see how well they perform. I think almost everyone here appreciates them for their art and/or for their history. Making the perfect sword, with the perfect hamon, in a way that can be repeated hundreds of thousands of times using an automated process goes against the whole point of artistic intent...

Wow - it's rare I see a comment on here that is just so offensive it becomes hilarious, but I think I've seen one today!

I think you've probably hit the nail on the head Sam with them seemingly being easier pieces to collect. Still, commercially it seems odd - like I can see a future where as Gendaito/Shinsakuto are increasingly using modern tools and methods that WW2 Showato are once again accepted into Japan on mass, increasing their global value, but I can never see that happening with the type 95's due to their factory construction... Because of that too, it seems to be much harder to spot good fakes, and they do seem fairly prevalent. Don't get me wrong, the genuine articles are really cool pieces of history, and I want one for my own collection, it's just interesting that the market is developing in this way. Makes me wonder if some of the type 95 collectors will begin branching out into Nihonto more in the near future. That all being said, I do like Ray's example in the OP of this thread