Matsunoki

Please excuse possible dumb question from beginner….. but is this definitely Edo or perhaps later…Showa?

Hmmm, can’t help you there. As part of the EU your regs will be different but probably still very dodgy. Good luck. Be careful. Best. Colin.

I’m guessing it varies depending on NI vs Southern Ireland. The regulations will be very different. Where are you? In the UK we can’t ship any bladed item. It’s a nightmare.

Hello. why have you posted this on the end of an old topic? Much better if you start a new topic. I doubt you will get any replies doing it this way.

Thanks to our ignorant law……congrats are due elsewhere. Wonderful buy at that price. Ought to have been £10k+ and had it been 18thC maybe double that. I don’t think I’ll ever get rid of my inner seething regarding this “issue”☹️ ….and nor have I ever seen a Bizen yaki Kirin. I love Bizen yaki…..such a strong understated ceramic. It is also surprisingly affordable…..it’s a bit too wabi-sabi maybe for many?

The wonderful ivory Kirin above just sold for €4400+30%ish premium….and it was not expensive.

Well I’ll join in now. Based just on Piers’ images these are all fakes imo including any wood ones. None appear carved with any Japanese skill or sensitivity. The subjects are clumsily and crudely depicted. The major UK auctions and even the large antique fairs are crammed with thousands of them. Probably carved in China, India et al. Just put “netsuke” into eBay ……and prepare to be very depressed. Compare……(a 19thC carving in 18thC Kyoto style)….a wonderful subject superbly carved and coming up for sale in Europe soon. …oh the pain, can’t buy it☹️😡

Annoyingly 99% of Mei on kogatana blades are “tribute” and thus need to disregarded. It’s just another Japanese interesting peculiarity.

Hi Piers, I I can’t remember what I had for lunch yesterday nor can I remember peoples names…..not even for 5 minutes but yes I do have an almost photographic memory for images and objects…..where I’ve seen them/similar before, if/where I bought them, who I sold them to, if they were in auctions, even if I simply liked something without handling it….the image will still “stick”. It’s a very strange thing to experience and I have no idea how or why it happens.

Hi Piers, This reminds me very much of the work produced in Ise Yamada by the Masanao school….mid 19thC ish? or perhaps….. https://www.bonhams.com/auction/24456/lot/166/a-boxwood-netsuke-of-mushrooms-by-juko-toshimitsu-19th-century/

Hello again Majus Have a look at this link…… https://www.bonhams.com/search/?chronology=past&query=Jizai All the best. Colin

Very common motif found on many tsuba and fuchi kashira from many different schools and in many different metals. In its many subtle variations it’s a subject that well reflects the Japanese love of nature and tranquillity .

Here’s an example with a bit more work….the geese are on the reverse. I’m not sure what the man is actually doing! ….suggestions?

It’s not wreckage🙂 The subject of a boat moored (or lurking)amidst foliage or reeds is common. On better quality pieces you can often see a man in the boat, most usually a hunter or cormorant fisherman.Sometimes it will show a hunter in his boat hiding in the reeds with a flight of geese heading his way. If the man isn’t there you are being asked to imagine him…..because the maker didn’t want to put any more effort into the piece. Im guessing much of this has already been said above🙂

Probably…….

Absolutely not! It’s complicated globally and I can only comment on the UK. Until the latest stupid UK ban, all antique ivory netsuke and okimono were exempt from CITIES regulations due to their age. They could be bought and sold with no paperwork necessary. Perfect and sensible. No elephants were being killed by poachers to supply the antique market. Then along comes the UK blanket ban and it completely overrides and ignores the sensible old CITIES regulations in that ANYTHING made from ivory or predominantly from ivory IRRESPECTIVE OF AGE can no longer be bought, sold, imported or exported. They can be owned but the result has been to kill the market overnight. There are some minor exemptions which require submissions and paperwork but none will apply to netsuke or okimono or shibayama etc. or wonderful French and German carvings be they medieval or whatever. Regulations in Europe and the rest of the world are different and generally a bit more relaxed…..but I don’t know the detail. This legislation is an example of politicians doing “something” about elephants being slaughtered. The trouble is they have achieved nothing except to cost law abiding citizens a huge amount of money and deny law abiding citizens from taking part in a historically important preservationist “hobby”. Elephants continue to be slaughtered by poachers often with cooperation from the local “officials” who all stand to gain a lot by supplying the predominantly Chinese market where it is used to make “tat”. Sorry….I was ranting again😡

Some nice things….,. https://www.kunstauktionen-duesseldorf.auction/148-asiatika-antiken-schmuck-uhren--search-1-block-41-browse.html

The position of the round hole is so close to the nakago ana that anything that passed all the way through it from the tsuka to the saya would would most likely emerge straight into the habaki thus maybe suggesting it is nothing to do with a locking or securing device? It also looks maybe later machined or drilled with that raised lip??? Could it be something for securing/stabilising the tsuba to the tsuka, maybe a peg to prevent rattling. Maybe a peg on the fuchi for something? Dont know, just trying to visualise the practical possibilities.

It’s not mine Piers. It’s an example of what I once had. 18thC Tomotada….one of the greatest Kyoto masters. When I sold the collection I deleted all photos. I was very very angry and upset. I sold the library as well which was pretty dumb! Lots of rare books and catalogues of old collection auctions. Yes I could have kept them (the netsuke) and watch them become valueless and unsaleable but that would have been ££crazy.

Hi Piers, I’ve copied it into the new thread. I’d replied here before I saw the new topic. My collection was centered around tigers, monkeys, wolves/wild dogs, rats and similar. They gave me such pleasure. Am seriously considering re-entering the fray but obviously not Ivory examples. I love the Ise Yamada school works in assorted woods (masanao et al) …..monkeys, tigers, rats etc (what a surprise!)…..but since the Ivory ban their prices are skyrocketing. Some lovely netsuke coming up in a couple of European auctions but then we must run the gauntlet of importing things without them getting “mislaid” etc Nothing is easy anymore!

Netsuke for me is a very bitter sweet subject. Over many years I’d built a half decent collection and had a massive library on the subject. But the along comes our woke vote grabbing government with its unjustified and ill considered ban on ivory thus was I really forced to sell the lot before their value evaporated to zero in this country. Of all the things I’ve been interested in Netsuke were (are?) probably my favourite…..even more than the guns and swords and tsuba! I really miss them more than anything else. Bloody Michael Gove…..what a weasel…..now he’s a Baron and a Lord 🤬🤬 Sorry for rant….netsuke always hit this painful nerve. Wonderful things like this …….banned from selling, importing etc

Netsuke for me is a very bitter sweet subject. Over many years I’d built a half decent collection and had a massive library on the subject. But the along comes our woke vote grabbing government with its unjustified and ill considered ban on ivory thus was I really forced to sell the lot before their value evaporated to zero in this country. Of all the things I’ve been interested in Netsuke were (are?) probably my favourite…..even more than the guns and swords and tsuba! I really miss them more than anything else. Bloody Michael Gove…..what a weasel…..now he’s a Baron and a Lord 🤬🤬 Sorry for rant….netsuke always hit this painful nerve. Wonderful things like this …….banned from selling, importing etc

Yes. Can’t see any problem with that Piers.

🙂😉🫢

Shakudo is an alloy which before patination looks like copper in colour. It is not a solid block of black metal. When patinated it will form an oxide on the surface that basically looks black. If the patina is then worn, scratched or in any other way damaged the base colour of “copper” will show through including within the nakago-ana or on highlight areas etc Copper on the other hand does not patinated to black, in fact it is the most difficult metal to get a good solid patina on and any patina on copper is easily abraded. This tsuba simply looks to have nice quality copper sekigane perfectly and carefully fitted into a tsuba with a plate made of a shakudo type alloy. The actual tsuba itself is of modest quality. Personally I can’t see any mystery here.