Curran

My thought was like John's. I see what I thought was a Tembo tsuba decorated with Shinto religious elements (the flaming jewels and rope with paper

Mark, --Wah! My wife likes that tsuba. Who is the artist? Reinhard, Your skills at photography are better than mine. Thank you for sharing. I was just wondering if there was any point along the false seppa shadow where the dark paint or patina of the false shadow gave evidence it was not correct. It would probably take an expanded photo to show this. I thought maybe the plug in the kozuka ana is lower or higher than the plate and it might explain how the shadow skips a bit from the plug to the plate. The seppa shadow seems to be off at the bottom of the eliptical shape. It is just "thinking aloud" on how this was done and how it is detected. If I looked under a microscope, maybe I could forensically tell. Maybe not.

Reinhard, It is nice to see this Myoju tsuba. Two days ago I had to look over one of the many gimei tsuba claiming to be in his name. Very precise little tsuba, but not this feel. It is interesting this topic of a Nara tsuba with the "fake" print of the seppa-dai. Is there anything in micro detail that helps empirically illustrate it better? Maybe the way the seppa dai print shifts on the kozuka plug? A nice gent sent me images of a daisho tsuba set the other day and asked me if I thought they were correct. There were a few things about them that made me pause slightly. Some odd detail hammering in the soft metal that might be more 20th century and the tsuba were incredibly "flawless", however many things seemed correct about the execution of the two tsuba. Both tsuba showed seppa dai usage, but were otherwise very perfect for anything that had seen usage to leave such strong seppa dai marks. I do not mean to sideline the discussion of aesthetics, but would like to hear more about the seppa dai marks.

Guido- His name is Robert Hunt. He is classic gentleman, an excellent writer, and very interesting person to know. He served in law enforcement for many years and has published several books.

Better pictures. Thank you. With a bit of ivory clean up, some pocket time (or occasional TLC with undyed felt or denim), it should make the tsuba all that much nicer. Definitely a large one. I had considered relating it to tea wares, but my grasp of 'wabi' or 'sabi' is not very academic. Be careful/cautious of rubbing the shakudo in any work on the tsuba.

Looks like a nice massive tsuba to me. 4mm at the plate. How large at the mimi? Great looking mimi with gnarly iron nodules going on. Hard to tell from the flash how bad the surface rust might be, but looks nice. ______________________________________________________________________ Incidentally, regarding your red copper tsuba used as your avatar, Try: http://www.nihonto.us/HOHOSHI%20YOSHITOSHI%20KOZUKA.htm I'm not sure it is this guy, but it is an example of early 20th century work where that bright earthy (Georgia red clay) copper patina is seen. Curran

Please give a lighter weight to what I say, as my sword kantei knowledge is not strong. I call myself a fittings collector that still occasionally wanders into the sword chat. As the others have said, it is hard to tell much about the sword. While decent photos, they don't or can't (due to state of polish) highlight some of the things that are helpful. Using non technical terms: Going from the shape of the sword, the even thickness up through the fore part of the blade... I would say Shinto or shinshinto. From what little I can see of the jigane and the rather pilar like formations in the hamon, plus some scattering of snowy nie inbetween- my first thought is that it is a mino school derivative from perhaps some time in the shinto period? Not my favorite area of study. Perhaps something more related to this: http://www.nihonto.us/UJIFUSA%20KATANA.htm Most of the Unifusa were of Mino origins. I am not saying it is Ujifusa school. My impression is that it is from a derivative Mino school like the Ujifusa school. Let me stress this is just my 2cents. I don't know what to make of the nakago (tang) shape and marks. That might point away from a Mino derivative school. Just trying to help a bit.

Lorenzo, The Kamiyoshi were ordered to take up the Hayashi tradition in the late 1700s. From photos, I think it is sometimes hard to distinguish their work from other Higo work. The one *quirk* many people remember about the school is that generations (2nd and 3rd?) did not sign their works, but rather marked them with distinct square (or rectangle) punch patterns (certain number up top and down below). It should be very easy to read up on them. Whenever a later Higo tsuba shows those punch mark patterns, it often gets called Kamiyoshi. There are many tsuba where the punch mark patterns are 'not right', and it is interesting that the NBTHK does not necessarily regard these as gimei- but doesn't paper them as Kamiyoshi. Good Kamiyoshi are desirable: http://www.nihonto.us/KAMIYOSHI%20RAKUJU%20TSUBA.htm It is not uncommon to see that something late Higo gets called "Kamiyoshi" if unpapered.

In the big horimono book there is a fair bit of discussion (beyond my reading skills) about the particular shape, depth, and detail of ken horimono and how to take that to work backwards with an attribution to certain smiths. This is the book's opinion- but I enjoyed the idea and found myself agreeing with it. Ray.... my spotty recall says to me that the sharp point ken which is deepest at the tip (and a few other things) is closer to the Oei Nobukuni guys, but the presence of ken horimono on both sides is something I don't recall in the Oei Nobukuni guys as much as I think I have seen it in maybe two or three 1st or 2nd generation works. From the horimono point of view, I can understand the Tanobe logic. I know my viewpoint is a bit ass-backwards to work from the 3rd (or 4th Gen) Oei Nobukuni- but it was what I got to see a number of at one point and made the deepest mental impression. I think the long since defunct Philadelphia group put out a decent publication on the Nobukuni group. I wish I had been able to see more 1st and 2nd Gen Nobukuni. Someone had a very beautiful Juyo (or T. Juyo????, I think just Juyo) as part of the San Francisco display in 2003. I would have liked to had a long study session with that blade, but it was not possible at the time. I've always wondered who owned it. Had things gone a bit differently the past few years, it is one I would have liked to track down and purchase. Alas, not meant to be.

Unique looking blade, even for Nobukuni school. My understanding is that usually the 3 brothers or smiths that signed Nobukuni starting around Oei are usually considered the 3rd generation, but one or two things I have read state that there was a very short lived "third" generation in there between the 2nd generation and the Oei period guys. Is the implication that it is 2nd generation, or too hard to tell but the work predates the Oei Nobukuni? I've seen now at least 2 times that the NTBHK can give pinpoint specific attributions on unsigned Oei Nobukuni blades: one was T.Hozon to one of the 3 guys, and the other was Juyo to one of the 3 Oei guys. Interesting that they could not give it to a generation. The Nobukuni were such early horimono experts. Ken were so common in their work, I'd think the ken original to the blade. Curran

Mike, Thank you for the interesting post. Attached is a modern I enjoyed owning for a while. It is a copy of a Tokubetsu Juyo Nobuiye. I value these gentlemen expressing themselves in new forms, but in my particular case just wanted to own a very well done copy of something where I doubt I will ever see the original. Curran

Heinjo tsuba adapted to gunto. (echo...) Some loss of inlay.

Worm trailed 2 gourds. Broken spiderwebs. I do not know to what this is an allusion. I usually think of the gourd (or golden gourds at least) as a symbol of victory. I can only hazard a guess of "old victories" or "victories past", but then maybe it is just 2 gourds forgotten in the cellar.... a seasonal theme. Could be late Higo, though also tempting to just say Shoami. Unfortunately, they don't whisper the answer late at night.

Rich, Thanks for posting an image of that tsuba. I thought to ask others to post for "1st period" Kamakura tsuba examples. I'm not sure I agree with the dating by Jim Gilbert of the first one on his site, but then I doubt he'd care a hill of beans. Just my feeling on the matter. Barry, Knee-jerk reflex is to look at the carving (clouds and general dragon) and point more towards shoami work. I know it is a sin to just say that and not back it up with better explanation. Armchair opinion is that it doesn't have the sukashi associated with later Kamakura bori and the design isn't so much as framed as the ones like Dave's where the elements look like they were lifted off Korean or Chinese celadon / porcerlain. Peter or Rich can probably state a better argument. Any pictures of the tsuba on the koshirae the way you received/found it? Curran

Everybody keep a cool head? I didn't like Kamakura tsuba that much when I started collecting, but have seen quite a number now from the "different periods" and say I have come across some nice ones here and there. I think the one I owned was rather simplistic and wonder how it would have looked on the koshirae of the time. ~Functionalist~ collectors always like that one, but a time came when I had to sell. Oh well. I've seen later koshirae with Kamakura tsuba closer to the one that started this thread. Sometimes they work quite nicely with the koshirae for an overall aesthetic. Curran

I have not seen too many what I would call "1st period" Kamakura. Here is an NBTHK papered one that I sold cheaply a while back. I believe it to be 1st period. Extremely dense and heavy. Felt like 1/4 inch of armor plate. Lacquered with the lacquer having worn off in places and either partially removed or not lacquered in the chrysanthemum petals. Curran

It is "Kamakura" style, which is a school of tsuba that used a sort of design related to Kamakura (wood engraving) style in their design work. The tsuba are therefore called 'Kamakura', but it is not from the Kamakura period. The school went through several revivals over the time (just like birkenstocks and other whatnot of fashion). Nice example, with papers. I believe there was one like this on Aoi Arts at one point. Hope that helps.

Dear Steve, I am afraid I cannot add to your excellent write-up. I enjoyed reading it and it contained about everything I know about Hogen. The prints illustrating the theme were perfect. I have seen a few pieces with his signature and never felt 100% confident on the signatures, leaving me to wonder how much variation his signature involved over his lifetime, or if they were all gimei. I hope someone else can comment on your kozuka.

The tsuba he uses as an avatar belonged to me a few years ago. I think it is the 3rd one in on the show. He purchased it from a dealer and posted it here to the NMB. I corresponded with him briefly, but don't know if he is still around. It was a nice slideshow w/ music. I found it calming during another hell day at work. Thank you. Sure, his collection is a little uneven compared to the advanced aesthetic of some here, but he has a few nice ones in there. The one that formerly belonged to me was an S folded piece with the forging visible and the extremely dense tsuba rang beautifully like a bell. The blossom inlay seemed a later addition. If circumstances were a bit different and I able to keep a larger collection, I wouldn't mind owning that one again. Nice to see an old friend.

Tomoe tsuba: First thoughts- I am mentally searching for the name of the artisan. Andy Quirt's website had a set of menuki by him. Early 20th century work. Often a little flat in appearance, but guy worked with copper and developed what to my eyes is a rather distinct earthen red patina. Probably one of the bigger brains like Ford or Peter Klein will come up with the name.... The menuki seem to have long sold from Andy's site. I suspect your tsuba might be more of his time/place of production. Early 20th century, and relatively sought after by some collectors. These are just my impressions. It kills me I cannot remember the artisan's name, and I don't know if I have him on file. Curran

I think it is a nice selection with aesthetic. I wish I could tell you more about the Tomoe tsuba. It is interesting to me. If you have more photos of it, throw them up.

FYI: Example page of Kunishige work http://www.choshuya.co.jp/tsuba/21_40/30namban.htm See the fuchi/kashira towards the end.

Without even going to the books, I was thinking almost exactly what Lorenzo said. The design reminded me of Hirado Kunishige work. Kuniyoshi a student? Curran

Tanto koshirae. The menuki were signed on the bottom(?) sides and mounted on the same. No wrap. As stated, they were gold with a fairly high profile (thickness) to them. Signature was clearly visible, though small. All the fittings were very good. The menuki were exceptionally good- perhaps "plush" is a better word; but I don't know if I have seen Mitsuoki menuki before. I had no reason to doubt the veracity of the package. Just curious when there are that many signatures.

Ted and Grey, Thanks for the replies. My reason for asking: The menuki were solid gold and signed Mitsuoki (the big guy of the Otsuki school) The fuchi and kojiri were also biggish names. I forget the other signatures. I was studying it at hand with no reference books to verify the signatures. Nice elegant but not overly flashy koshirae. With a pantheon of decent names on it, I wondered if papers where just that it was an original en-suite late edo koshirae or was _verifying_ all those signatures. If so, then the koshirae was worth a fair more than the nice healthy c. 1500 Mino blade. My memory isn't good enough to recall the details of the description on the papers, so I do not recall if it mentioned the Mitsuoki menuki at all. I confess I liked the whole package. I just wish I'd gotten the chance to verify some of the signatures for my own mental satisfaction and WoW!