Curran

Stephen- Saw that yesterday. Also was thinking to check in on you and Mr. Stuart, not having heard from either of you recently. The Tampa show moved back 1 week from Valentine's Day, which means better fro those of us with spouses. Especially with spouses who have b-day two days before v-day. I expect to be there the whole show, though not sure if I will take a table or not. I suspect the show will be better advertised and open to a greater percentage of the public in Florida (locals never seem to know about the show), but it won't have the advantage of a shinsa team as it did last year. ~~~ It was a near stealth shinsa. Would have been better if the Yoshikawa NTHK or their USA caretakers had managed to integrate them more into the show. Seemed quite the ships passing in the night with neither benefiting from the other. Many in the show room didn't know where the shinsa was, nor did the shinsa have any signage to make it easier for walkins. In previous years I've had to represent for individuals visiting from Sarasota in order that they be permitted into the show. That sort of invite-only is logical from a security point of view, but not wise in terms of attracting new collectors. Hope to see you there. Curran

Mike, I wish it were as easy as to say a particular school. The best I can do is say it tends to fall along enjoyment of very simple nature or religious designs. This has unintentionally led to a concentration of Owari works, but ranges from Haguro tsuba, to Umetada hon zogan (correct term?), and Ezo menuki. The Hirata's Matsukawa mon pine bark element was perfect for my tastes. Among Higo, sometimes the Hirata and Shimizu designs. I envy some of Dr. Dorfman's pieces. Hayashi hasn't been my cup of tea, but the last tsuba I ever purchased was one of the Citrus tree ones. I have no idea what generation. Probably late, if even mainschool. I've been on hiatus from buying while dealing with summer house repair-renovation bills.... and awaiting the return of the project Lorenzo and I discussed. I've been recently studying the aforementioned Nambokuchu tachi tsuba. The weight of it at near 12 ounces for a kinko tsuba, which surprised me. The waves design and 12 of the 16 are various flowers. Boris has a smaller yet similar one: http://www.yamabushiantiques.com/BM%20N ... 0Tsuba.htm Yes Lorenzo, I remember discussing it with you. That will be a milestone when that project is finally finished. Last I heard, it was in round 3 or 4 of lacquerwork. I would like to learn a lot more about traditional Japanese lacquerwork. Maybe the koshirae comes back next month. Maybe next year. or 2014.... I hope late this year or early next year and have been preparing for the bill. We have the long move back to the FL house once the work-repairs are done, so trying to keep it simple and trim down what we must transport at the end of Fall.

Oh dear. The X chromosome runs strong in that family. Wonder what the finally tally will be. He once fired a disparaging comment about women and their expensive handbags. The karma payback seems to be enormous. It would be rather evil if he was put on the Hermes mailing list. Cyrus have any interest in collecting shotguns? I seem to be inheriting a few vintage ones, though Cyrus might prefer a sawed off K-Town special.

Quote, "We have 3 NBTHK papered Hirata tsuba: 2 Hizokos (I'm guessing the one Mike posted is his and papered Hizoko), and mine which I presume to be a nidai work." Juyo, Tokubetsu Hozon, and Hozon respectively. Lorenzo: I've had a Higo koshirae build stop&starting for nearly 10 years. Largely dealt with Cary Condell, JOhn Tirado, and Brian T on it. We used Higo Kinko taikan, Visual Glossary 2Vol set, and the Uchigatana book for a small catalog of Higo koshirae. The Edo tanto & wakizashi koshiare books also added some value. Also, a few examples culled off the web over years. A New York area collector has a nice Higo koshirae example with only minor restoration, and I also had the chance to study in person the Juyo one Bob Benson had posted. I've had a fair bit of correspondence with the owner of the Juyo koshirae and other Higo collectors. My Hirata came from the owner of that Juyo koshirae, and was sort of a Japanese-style gift that surprised me. My interests in kodogu are primarily not Higo. If you find a single book with a good catalog of Higo koshirae, please let me know. Another New York collector has made the Kowalski library available to us and provided tons of photocopies. The irogane Hirata tsuba - lacquer information isn't really new. Just in Japanese, which I haven't been able to read-translate until recently.

4? Wakarimashita. Cyrus has 3? No kids on this end, but largely due to me being eldest surviving son caring for a bunch of family. Never the less, elderly children not nearly the same as younglings. Raymond joined the papa crowd this year, and perhaps we will next year or two.

Mike, you have PMs. Well, 20 minutes with a few Higo texts and I had an answer: --Those irogane Hirata with the concentric punch marks often have the ~red under black~ lacquer in or around the concentric punch marks surrounding the nakago ana. Not always. We have 3 NBTHK papered Hirata tsuba: 2 Hizokos (I'm guessing the one Mike posted is his and papered Hizoko), and mine which I presume to be a nidai work. Upon getting the nidai tsuba out and looking at it, mine *does* have the red under black lacquer traces in the concentric punch marks around the nakago ana. I'd only previously remembered Jim Gilbert pointing it out in the sukashi walls. All three have the concentric punch marks around the nakago ana. Two of them have the red under black lacquer in the concentric punch marks around the nakago ana. Peter claims his does not, putting it in the "not always" camp. Nor (if mine is a nidai work as I believe), does it seem that this is particular to the first gen. Conclusion: Presence of the red and black lacquer in association with presence of concentric punch marks on an irogane tsuba, seemingly Hirata, - is a vote in favor of authenticity, though not absolute. Could stand some stat testing, but don't know if we can pull that many papered punch mark Hirata this side of Japan.

Of course. Christian- No. Don't have that book or much experience in that area. Just raising a topic Brian T. and John Tirado have introduced to me before. Other explanation most welcome. ____________________________ In addition to certain tsuba, seem to share a shellbriar habit. These are the only two I have. Call it a daisho. Petersons' also good for winter. Colonel Dean Hartley was also fond of them too.

Red lacquer is not in the seppa dai. Red lacquer is under black lacquer in the sukashi. This is nidai, not shodai. Peter says there is none in his, but reviewing photos from your website- I see what I take to be traces of it in 3 or 4 places, mostly near the nakago ana. Don't ask me to illustrate. I can barely take photos. Darcy and I have both had photos lifted from here, so I need to get a modern photo program to mark them in some way.

Hirata: Question to Mike and Peter. On the Hirata tsuba Mike displayed, the classic Hirata cup marks around the nakago have some loss of the black lacquer revealing what looks like red lacquer underneath. On my Hirata, there is the same black lacquer in the sukashi with some loss revealing what appears to be red lacquer underneath. On Peter's the black lacquer seems to not have suffered much loss, so: Peter: (Q1) Do you see any signs of red lacquer underneath the black in the Hirata cup marks around the nakago ana on yours? Mike and Peter: (Q2) Is the use of red lacquer frequent in the works of the first and/or second generation Hirata? Or is it a trait of a specific generation? Or just something seen once in a while?

Christian, Ah I may hit heavy in the Owari camps, but I am a "light-middleweight" when it comes to Higo. Mike just knocked my Higo arse out of the ring. Makes me want to work harder so I can afford the bigger toys, but Ben Bernanke betrayed us today and a future children's college fund may trump me ever getting to own one of these topline Hirata.

To me that is absolutely lovely. I would trade my Kanshiro, 2 Hayashi, and Jingo for it- but don't think I have enough cash for the difference. Kill me softly, why don't you.... Brian, sorry for the profanity- but gotta say Hot Damn.

My breakdown will be the US stock market. Our Fed just turned on the printing presses again, so our US$ is going to hell. It was nice collecting foreign art while I could afford it.... *sigh* USA for sale. USA for sale. We're going cheap on a global currency scale.

Yes... I agree with Mariusz. Is that the man's real head, or the head of Fredricke Neitchze on a paunchy yet limber fellow?

Geez- Chill a bit gentlemen. David is usually one of the cooler heads on NMB. Lorenzo is very high fluent to fully bilingual. I wish my Italian was half as fluent as his English. He just happens to disagree with you David. Higo ranges from some incredible work to lots of derivative crap that is more Chinatown knockoff "Prado" than actual Prada. My friend and others specialize in Higo tsuba in what is already a very specialized area of collecting. I don't want to follow the herd and have actively resisted liking Higo, but some of the softmetal work and Jingo iron pieces are just too seductive. ____________________________ Yahoo!Japan: as shill bidding is not prohibited and time extends when there is a new bid, many/most auctions are shilled now. Sellers like Fuji_5005 or Fuji_505 are notoriously blatant. Expect to usually pay more for an item on Yahoo!Japan than you will in the US. Also, the number of fakes or moderns have risen significantly. Other sellers do some ridiculous things. However, some rare items do make their way onto Yahoo!Japan. They are worth watching for, and sometimes can be had at a fair price. They can be fuzzy photo gambles or things so rare that the average collector doesn't recognize them. A large shibuichi Nambokuchu tachi tsuba with 8 medallions per side in very good condition recently sold there. Beautiful to see and I wonder if it will materialize on Boris' site at some future date.

Lorenzo- Thanks for the comment. I know little of Satsuma tsuba, distinct kantei points, and how they are papered. I seem to recall that Tanobe-san was fond of them? Mike's tsuba is spot on for the discussion. It is pretty much the twin of the "Nishigaki" I sold, except that it has the important difference of the Satsuma mon sukashi.

David, Ouch. Harsh. You're definitely not a Higo lover. It is a decent piece that I would say falls to the Nishigaki if it didn't have that signature/attribution to Jingo on it.

The smartest Higo collector I know (only know Ito-san through proxy, and never seem to agree with Jim G opinions anymore) says the kinzogan Jingo isn't correct and isn't interested in buying it. I'm not buying diddly until I get out from under a wave of house expenses & my buying of Higo pieces is sideline, being more interested in other schools. So here have a go: http://page13.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/r93523018 Satsuma mon. This tsuba has probably had more discussion than it is worth, in my understanding of it. Opinions welcome as to whether or not this one would paper at shinsa.

Kinzogan to: Yatsuhiro ju Jingo + Kao or appraisor's mark. (Jingo: using the 五 character, sans "box" underneath) Signature or attribution? _______________________________________________________ "Mr. Mike", what's with the "Mr. Curran" ? We've dealt, or not dealt, with each other for at least ten years. At least since the front of the room Kariganeya Hikobei rant in San Fran. You're knowledge is appreciated in this matter. Yes, the kinzogan Hayashi where the mei matches the work is a classic. Rakuju seems to have been fond of the kinzogan mei. Several others about too. Have any kinzogan Shimizu-Jingo ones? I don't recall any off hand.

David: The boxes go out soon. Thanks, as it helps pay the bills. Glad to have 2008-2009 in the rear view mirror, but housing bills like to crop up randomly. This year it is roofing and deck repairs. Whatever induced me to buy such a large old house. Should have waited until we had kids. Tom: I have NO interest in buying the tsuba. I haven't heard back if one of my friends might be. More his thing, but no opinion yet. No photos till then. Jean: With swords, I thought it was as David said. Wrong inlaid mei = rejected for papers. However, as thin kinzogan for a signature- the tsuba mei would be easy to remove. I have also seen a tsuba where I forget what the hitch was, but it had punch marks to indicate a particular Kamiyoshi smith. It obviously wasn't. The NBTHK papers decided to say "Higo" in classical Japanese vagueness. BUT... not sure how the NBTHK would handle this mistaken (my opinion) mei. Would they simply paper it to "Higo" or not paper it at all?

Jean, She = NBTHK ? (a) Ignore the kinzogan to a Jingo smith, and paper to Nishigaki (b) Ignore the tsuba, ie. not paper it

I have recently seen a tsuba up for sale that screams to me work of a Nishigaki school artisan. I owned a near identical one years ago, papered to "Nishigaki" The one up for sale is unpapered. It has a kin zogan signature that I interpret to be an attribution. But the "signature" is to a Jingo artist. Does the NBTHK kill this one as gimei? ____Please, no debate about whether the mei is right or wrong____ To simplify the question: How does the NBTHK regard incorrect kin zogan attributions on tsuba ?

Move to sword discussion group.

The Craig Bird article is worth the price of a copy of the Art & Sword Vol 1. The illustrations are helpful. The Yasumitsu in the article: A monster at just over 36", with 3 types of hamon (basically Grandfather's, father's, and his own) and 3 types of utsuri. Change is even. Every 12 inches, smooth transition to a different hamon and utsuri. Sort of a mad master performance in 1 sword.

Rather fond of these yoroi doshi myself. That gold 2 foil 2 piece habaki alone will cost about 50% of your purchase price to have made these days. For the record, nakago on mine also looked old. Fair number of people tried to argue it was late Muromachi.

Trauma surgeon point of view: It goes in, and it doesn't come out. Rather large for that in a human sense, when smaller arrowhead can be nearly as traumatic in this regard. Necessary to expand the wound to withdraw it. Or push it through. Yet rather too high quality for the needs of a whale harpoon or dolphin hunting. Could this be used for larger game of some sort? Wild boar? (Yum-) Presume some sort of strong line through the ana, tied to a secure point such as a tree or whatnot/