parfaitelumiere

this is fake, I give 10$ for the set, address in private!

the same type of cast stuff as I described, the second exemple is similar to what I saw, I remember a thread here with a rooster tsuba, people thought about real work, but it was a cast piece, I spotted it as I saw a similar one on yahoo.

I saw several cast Soten tsuba, actually well cast and having electronic gold or silver plating, on iron or bronze base, but same as you are pointing, cast massive sekigane, added to weaker design and more blurry finish, it's a good way to recognize things which are becoming more and more common... It would be interesting to see other pictures of that tsuba, here all seems made from same material, are there copper silver or gold color accents?

Hard to tell for now, wait to get in hand and share a better picture, then you will get replies.

Here is another, almost identical design, also on ebay. You can see the nunome ground is also coarse and badly finished, and both birds have a bit different inlays, gold and silver.

the visible detail on ura side, and some other details visible on other pictures makes me think about soldering blister or rust inside weaker, creating delamination. On link second picture is showing similar detail on side, and on third picture it seems there is a bit of delamination in nakago ana visisible.

Yes, sorry, I used wrong name! I was thinking "shishi-botan" was with chrysanthemus, but just to get sure, I checked, and the right name was actually kiku, so I edited the title! Thanks for pointing the mistake!

Hello, I saw that set, which I really like and would like to purchase, but I wish to know more about it. I asked additional pictures and all relied carvings seem to be zogan, as inside both parts, it's flat. I am thinking about maybe collecting fuchi and kashira sets, as things I want to keep now are two sets of fuchi and kashira. I was also asking myself how people used ot do the goild foil plating on such cmplex shapes, I saw the process on several fittings I own, and many gold zogan are foil on copper, I am really curious to know the process. I watched the Ford Hallam utsushi tiger tsuba and he used gold butter, but it seems some used gold foil, so the process was probably very difficult! I hope someone would be able to provide more informations!

I suggest people here to watch videos showing the processes, and if they can, experience it by themselves, it's very interesting to try it, as I did. It can be useful to evaluate some works, know more about technic and appreciate the level, but also to possibly imagine the possibility of repair, or utsushi if required. Here, the technic is wire gold nunome zogan, one quite coarse weave pattern, not the highest level indeed.

That's just average Nunome zogan,with typical cross pattern on iron. There also are silver zogan on top and bottom, which has sulphurized and colonized the iron, it means that tsuba is probablu late edo. But I don't understand why it should be a cast tsuba?! On side picture you can see there are slight wear inside nakago ana, it has been mounted, but I think the owner has cleaned a bit to raise the gold color and also cleaned seppa dai. That is part of large collection, I missed another tsuba with a dragon from same seller, some are fake, but some are good stuff, that one with dragon was a very good one.

Thanks, I think original menuki have been lost, also original tsuba and seppa, that will be hard to know exact menuki design, maybe some dragons?!

I found back the other exemple I was thinking about, made with same process. I have a very old iron mold, to shape case lid, by stamping I use it as a anvil. The process is the same, negative engraving for serial stamping or casting, both technics could be possible, wax cast in metal or stamping.

This may be late edo work, it would be interesting to see other pictures, including menuki and all the fittings, sadly I saw only 3 or 4 pictures in your album. I purchased a silver handachi koshirae some years ago, late edo koshirae with muromachi era blade. I made some searches about it and found several result, as my tsukamaki was bad, and tsuba was missing. I found high end work from silver or shibuichi. I remember also about jabara maki and mokko shaped tsuba on all exemples. They all had fuchi, kashira, tsuba, koi guchi, habaki and complex parts on saya, all with same theme. In my case, all the mount is made from silver with ishimeiji finish, seppa are ginkise, and same as yours the lacquer is aventurine lacquer, using fine abalone shell dust inside dark glossy lacquer. The menuki are goto school, "crows and waves" the most probable attribution should be Goto Eijo. This has been decided after studying similar attributed mekuki and talks with several people. The feather, waves, gilding and zogan are identical, same as finish on the backside. No, the eye is not some paint, as some member told once here. Same as you, my original tsuba was missing, replaced for a non matching tsuba, made from shakudo, that's the reason why I made some searches, to know what exact tsuba was supposed to be there. The original seppa (ginkise) were present on my koshirae. I went for standart maki, as jabara was really too high in price. Sadly original tsuba are almost always missing, as blades were stored in a place, koshirae in another place, and tsuba innother different place. I have been lucky to find the blade with matching koshirae, shirasaya, tsunagi and seppa, but not original tsuba. I also found a daisho with matching koshirae and shirasaya, but that time, tsuba were not original, nor the seppa, the kogatana was also missing. In your case, if base metal is shibuichi, it means the tsuba is also made from shibuichi, with silver and gilded copper on kind of ishimeiji finish, that will be impossible to find. I have no idea about the seppa. It would also be possible the tsuba and seppa to be different, but from what I saw until now, I have serious doubts about it.

Please don't call this pattern "nanako", it's not. This is designed by engraving on a mold, then the plate is stamped.

It won't be shakudo, high gold shakudo won't have such a color when not patinated, it lools like copper, just not as red, but won't look that yellow. Following some comments here, the more logical choice will be brass, the patina with warm tones is really nice, exactly what I was thinking about! I am looking forward to move to new appartment and get workshop, so I can try rokusho patination, I never tried yet, but I have a set of fuchi-kashira and tsuba to finish.

I don't think so, the material is too thick to get this result just by reverse punching, as done on old san mai tsuba. The details are too neat, that type of engraving is typically negative engraving, thzn stamping or casting will bring positive result, same used in coin and medal making. The mei is even worse now, and nakago ana also wrong, seppa dai is also awful. I remember having worked on Japanese iaito parts, and that double color on copper based replicas is visible, when you start grinding the material, I did this on menuki and fuchi kashira, it looks like heavily plated, maybe filled, and having a kind of brass core, I remember the reddish outside layer got more yellow once you grind deep enough, maybe that tsuba has been made from 3 pieces of metal, then stamped to obtain de relief carving, and then the holes are punched and core metal would become visible. Some modern fittings process are cast from original, modern made or antique, so the apparent carving is similar to real tosogu carving process, but some other kind definitely show negative carving, which appears as positive carving, that type of result can't be obtained using direct carving process. It would be interesting to see the whole tsuba, and start searching for similar references on the market, that should bring some clues, but I remember having seen such similar result, kind of copper based tsuba, with 2 dragons, round shape, and same making process, stamped, like a coin or medal.

You are right, without analyser, no way to know for sure.

The mei and ground pattern are a bit odd. It reminds me some weird shibuichi tsuba I bought in UK, depincting peas, but the ground and technics were very strange, definitely not Japanese (my plate) Maybe some utsushi?!

The hitsu ana seem to show some san mai structure. I saw stamped sides san mai, where side material is a foil, rim and hitsu ana generally filled with material, or gold foiled or gilded, I also saw thicker type of san mai, to mimic plain shakudo formal tsuba style. I owned such a daisho in the past, plain shakudo design, those probably also existed with some katakiri bori. But yours seem to have quite thick plates, and the design looks like either cast or stamped, we can see from engraving, that would have been negative on matrix or metal plate, then stamped to get the positive result?! The signature also looks suspicious, the way it's "stamped" It would need more pictures.

It would need much better quality pictures to know which exact alloy it is. It looks yellowish, but not that much yellowish of the brass material, any material will look yellow, compared to pure copper sekigane. It's's definitely not shibuichi, as shibuichi is quite easy to recognize, even unpatinated, but it can be various copper based alloy, including shakudo. I have the materials for rokusho patina, which I didn't not intend yet, if you want, after I successfully make a patina of pieces I made, I can do same on your tsuba, it will be a way to know what exact material it's made from. I don't recommend ammonia fumes, especially if not used to do patination, that can bring terrible results and some damages, I experimented this a bit much farther than common patination, in another domain ( fictive universe antiques, star wars and stargate "historical" artifacts).

Thanks a lot, I was thinking about Higo because of large mimi with nunome, which I saw on several higo on the web, but if some people think it can be a different school, thanks a lot for your help.

first one is stamped tsuba easy to see the rounded edges on one side but not on other side. This is very common on Japanese iaito tsuba, but not on chinese ones, as those are more probably laser cut. The second one is one of the worst things I have been able to see.

I had that set, with original shirasaya and koshirae.

Yes I put it on sale, I want to purchase other fittings, sadly I have to make choices, so I put some items for sale.

I would say to train your eyes and your feelings and collect what will bring you joy. My approach is based on aesthetical and technical details, is it well made, hard to make, well preserved, signatures or certificates have no real importance to me, the way it's made is much more important. For now, I got a few pieces in collection, the good prices I obtained when I sold them, quite easily, seems to be a proof of a not-too-bad taste and method I applied for my purchases. I think as many here said, browse, look at close up pictures, you can also watch videos of utsushi tsuba, to learn about the technics, and understand how it can be hard to master them, making the items a first class, second class or low grade item, just by looking at how it's made.