Bruce Pennington

Stu W over at Warrelics wrote a very educational post about the Type 95 NCO you would enjoy reading: http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/Japanese-militaria/ija-type-95-nco-sword-info-228172/ The gunto in the picture above are NCO swords, not officer swords. Only officer gunto used real silk wrapping (ito). NCO gunto handles (tsuka) were metal except for the late '44-'45 versions that had wooden tsuka. The actual date of production of your sword is difficult to pinpoint, but could have been anywhere between 1938 and 1943.

There are a number of posts showing good pics of soldiers carrying civilian swords at war. I found these 2 going back through Ohmura's fabulous website. In the first shows a tsuba that is clearly non-military. The second has a flat-topped kabuto-gane.

Greg, This style was predominantly made by the Nagoya Aresenal, though I just recently saw one with a Tokyo 1st stamp. If you look by the serial number, there should be an inspector stamp and it will be either a Seki or a Nagoya. If you don't know what those are, post a good closeup and we'll tell you. As to "why" they did it - who knows - but personally I like the feel better of the side latch. When pulling a top-latch gunto out of the saya, your thumb is on top and your grip is a bit open until you can move your thumb back into position. With the side-latch your grip fully incircles the handle while unlatching and you never have to move it once the gunto is unsheathed. But I've never read their actual reasoning on the different style.

Phillip, I've never heard how the dating system originated, wish I knew, but you do have to subtract 1 from the numbers after the emperor date. Ha, before the Showa era, previous emperor eras often used zodiacal kanji that added to the emperor era! You really need a decoder-ring to translate those! Well, even that isn't hard and fast. The Mantetsu factory used zodiacal dating on the Koa Issin blades, in the Showa era; while I've seen some old blades from earlier eras that had numberical dating too. So, you get a mix sometimes. Link with Zodiacal date chart: https://www.japaneseswordindex.com/kanji/zodiac.htm

Steve, Long but educational discussion about this here: http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/4764-sword-markings/ Answer is still the same - Could be either! In that discussion the claim was made about the Seki stamp that only 1 of 100 Seki stamped blades will be gendaito. Examination is the only way to find out.

Joe, Nick was quoting a Japanese polisher from a Japanese site. I didn't paste his entire discussion, and the previous paragraph discussed the non-traditional forging issue. What I found very interesting was the timeline - Seki-area smiths using Seki stamps on showato until "an arsenal" (Nagoya?) starts using the Seki too, so the smiths turned to using the Showa stamp. I have recently seen a 1944 Seki-smithed blade with a Nagoya stamp, dated Jan '44. I'm trying to get my head around the inspectors. I wonder if an inspector, say for Nagoya Arsenal, carried more than one stamp, say a Seki, a Nagoya, and a Showa? Or were there various levels of inspectors, some at Arsenal level, some at a Defense Ministry level (showa and star stamp) that worked all the arsenals? My questions came from reading one of Ohmura-san's pages where he shows a Showa stamp and the label underneath says "Department of Interior, ministry of ordinance stamp". Link to Warrelics discussion with Nick: http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/Japanese-militaria/showa-dept-interior-stamp-662590/ Link to Ohmura page: http://ohmura-study.net/211.html

An interesting update on some of the history of the Showa stamp, with a tad bit on anchor stamps from Nick Komiya on the Warrelics forum: "As to the origins for the mark, I understood that there were many cases of such mass produced blades snapping in the freezing cold weather of Manchuria. So the people in Seki decided to do voluntary impact testing on their products to ensure quality on blades for use by the military. They stamped blades that passed this test initially with the Kanji for Seki 関, signifying the guild. But later, one of the army arsenal factories happened to adopt the same kanji for marking, so the Seki people deferred and changed their impact test mark to the 昭 in cherry blossom mark for army orders and an anchor mark for navy orders. Anyway, that was what I took out from other sites."

兼宗 (Kanemune) You're probably right on that! Peter, that one had me stumped but I think you're right: 名 Kanemune was a Seki smith, but Nagoya was the aresenal overseeing Seki production. Just never saw a Nagoya stamp on the nakago. Seeing new stuff (new to me!) all the time!

兼房 (Kanefusa) is my guess, but I wouldn't put much weight on that!

The date is January, 1944. Hopefully someone will translate the smith name. I'll see what I can do, but I'm new at the names.

Phillip, You have a Japanese Army Officer Type 3 Shingunto. You can read about them here: http://ohmura-study.net/952.html. Don't be afraid to take the handle off, it's made to come off easily, simply push the bamboo peg out from the others side. The handle will slip right off. If it's on tight I like to grab both sides of the hand guard and wiggle side to side, which scoots the handle back a bit and loosens it. Once you do, most likely there will be a swordsmith name on one side and a date on the other, all in Japanese of course. Take pics, blade pointed up, and post here for translation. This are usually dated from 1943 - 1945, but we'll see when you take it apart.

Neil, you've got quite an excellent collection, don't you! There are a couple of guys on these forums who are real NCO experts and collectors. One showed a pic of some of his that included a late model painted all white for winter ops! I'm about to reach the point in saving my fun-money that I'm ready to buy my last NCO that I need to complete the set I've been building. All I need is the version 3, the Nagoya with side latch. I'll have to figure out what I'm going to do after that. I don't have all the late-war variants. Since they're getting more expensive it's probably time for me to go in that direction, since I seem to be unable to buy gunto at cheap prices! Your post challenged me to question what it is about WWII gunto that has my interest over nihonto in general. Partly it is because of a general fascination I have with WWII, but another part is that they feel more compartmentalized, more attainable that swords made over 1,000 years. That's just too vast for me. For the same reason, I like the NCO gunto. They are more specific and definable than officer gunto, which can vary considerably with custom fittings and ancient blades. Of course, after collecting for a couple of years, I was amazed to start realizing the seemingly endless variations of the NCO gunto! Ahhh!! Is nothing precise anymore???? Some of us need order!

Neil, Never seen that before either! The habaki is a higher quality, and with the little view we have of the fuchi, it appears pretty high quality too. It's possible this was a custom job with higher quality work which would account for the specialized koiguchi. Can't address the saya without more pics. There were uncovered wooden saya, but they were painted/laquered. Saya intended for leather covers usually had different ashi than uncovered ones. Pics will help. Looks like you've got another beauty.

You know, this subject is interesting enough, I wonder if we couldn't get it "stickied" or "pinned", as it's worth more investigation and discovery?

Ha! Good reminder Dave! Never say never or always with WWII gunto! Good observation though, Shamsy! I wonder if the labels were something unique to Seki operations, or something initiated late in the war to try to keep quality from dropping too far?

From the Japaneseswordindex, here is an example I was talking about. There are more like this, each with a different logo inside the Seki circle: Seki Hyaku Tan Sha Token Sei Saku Jo This company was located in Seki city. They offered a complete line of services, including old blades, newly made gunto, polishing, and koshirae. They also made gunto.

Both these labels have the same circular Seki manufacturer logo. The circle is actually a stylistic "Se" over the top and "Ki" around the bottom, with the factory's logo in the middle. I am on the road and don't have my books so I don't know if this One is known. But the Seki area had quite a number of factories working and each one might have had their own logo. The label appears to be an inspection/approval and is called "rare" in the F&G book. http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?651898-Have-you-ever-seen-this-before-on-a-wwii-Japanese-sword Here are two others recently posted:

That's the third one I've seen in the last couple of weeks! Fuller & Gregory has a picture of one.

Well, gentlemen, this discussion, like all collecting "preferences" are just that - personal preferences. We are individuals with differing likes and philosophies. While David's points are perfectly true, there is more to it for some of us (like the difference on nihonto lovers vs gunto lovers; between never clean or restore vs restore to original condition). It all depends upon one's heart and reason for collecting. I will probably do what Neil proposes. If my daughter isn't interested (or her husband) I will find someone who will honor what my collection represents and pass it over.

Good one Piers! You got me! Neil, good topic for discussion. The last of the WWII generation are gone, almost completely, and these swords and what they represent are coming to us from their grown children. We are bearers of thousands of legacies. As a hobby, it is fun and something we enjoy, but we all know that it represents something more, don't we.

Obviously family and/or friends deserve to benefit from our collections when we pass on, but if anyone lacks an appropriate affictionado --- PM ME!!!!!

Neil, Shamsy (Steve) and Stegel are the real pros on NCO gunto! I just addictively prowl the forums more frequently! Steve answered your numbering question. On the overstriking, that seems pretty normal on the late-war 95s. All the Type 95s have been going up in price this year, but the late war versions are really going up.

Neil, I can barely make out the Tokyo inspection stamp on one blade, but can't see the other one clearly enough. Do you know what stamp it bears? Usually the larger drag is from the Nagoya Arsenal and the smaller from the Tokyo Arsenal.

Sure, Steve, here's both sides and one after I cleaned it (please don't hate me! I clean all my gunto, but keep pics for proof of condition when I get them).

Craig, I got mine on Amazon for about $11 USD. Got yourself a gorgeous gunto there my boy! Do yourself a favor and take some pics of the blade, without the fittings and repost. Looks like an older blade than WWII to me - 2 mekugi holes, worn or reshaped blade tip, squared-off nakago (tang end). The tsuba (hand guard) is a more expensive upgrade, and the fact that it came with the rank tassel is a bonus!