Peter Bleed

Curran wrote: Dirk: -I always forget that website. Good start, but that is only 2. [surprised the Kyo Sukashi is TH]. Rest are sold. Nice family behind that site. They were top floor at the DTI. I almost bought that flower Jingo. So Curran, why didn"t you buy that Jingo Sunflower? It is terrific. Peter

Curran, Thank you for a wonderful thread. Indeed, my personal approach to collecting (andmebbe my budget) is very different from your. I'm an archaeologist - I like to discover things and figure them out myself. Your thread has shown me another way of exploring swords. Indeed, I think you have illustrated a wonderful way of embracing our interest, exploring the topic, and using the resource at our command! Thanks Peter

Hey, stumped is fine, and in the real world "hipshots" are okay. A two body cut by a tester name Murai. People give me these all the time. Peter

Boy, it looks like a Masahiro to me - not that it matters a lot Peter

Dear Friends, The discussion on “when collecting will be over” has been wonderful. It may have run its course. Still, since Arnold has invited a bit of discussion on the future of museums – especially as repositories of Nippon-to -I would like to discuss museums as collection repositories. In my earlier post, I suggested that the future of “museums” might not be completely rosy. In fact, I think that the future of museum is pretty near dire. I also feel that there are very few museums that might make good long term homes for Japanese swords, and further, that very few of “our” swords are likely to fit in those museums. I am certainly not anti-museum. I love’em and like to visit them as places to learn, relax, and refine standards, but… Museums are rarely good places to enjoy and observe the details of many collectible objects, including Japanese swords. Placing an artifact in a fixed position behind glass with fixed lighting, so that it is visible by one or two people, without detailed treatment will not provide adequate information. Next time you try to look at a piece of bronze sculpture, try to look at the BACK, try to assess the armature it is mounted on, or how it was made. In the view of lots of young folks, instead of museums, books and the web provide far richer possibilities for inspection. It seems that museums are fixtures of “old people.” They are still – as they always have been - institutions supported by rich people – most of whom are “old.” Engaging “new collectors” is a residual point of discussion among sword collectors and in a whole lot of museums and other collectors’ communities. The tastes, interests, and resources of the emerging generation seem not to comport with the traditions of museums – stable, authoritative, top-down, and passive. They seem to show toys that you can’t play with. In this situation, it is easy to predict that support for museum will fade. It has become clear that maintaining collections is an expensive undertaking. As the cost of maintaining collections grows, political leaders will have to make hard decisions. Detroit seems to have decided to keep its art, but I expect that the City Fathers will find other options when retired teachers, garbage men, and police officers see their pensions in active reduction. Sic transit Gloria. Intellectual and academic interest in many categories of “museum objects” is fading. Description and classification of “material culture” is NOT what it used to be. Publishing on the “Baskets of Bongo-bongo” used to have serious scholarly potential. Maybe it has all been done, but academics are not identifying questions of material culture that have broad scholarly audiences and/or the potential grant funding. Support for these interests is OUTSIDE museums. It is fair to point out that as scholarship on museum stuff has waned, the power of “Collections Managers” has risen. Today, many museums are run by people who know nothing about their stuff, but absolutely insist that they are trained in how to handle their treasures in “curatorially appropriate ways” – Tut-tut, white gloves, thank you and of course you can’t take that handle off. . . . Oh, and pleased noted that I’ve waxed the blade to preserve it. “Museum Quality” has become a very nebulous category. It turns out that very little is really and truly “rare” since Goggle will show you more of anything you might see at a museum. And beyond that, the world seems to be full of neat stuff. Thus, to add to the challenges of museum professionals they are continually presented with new kinds of collectibles. In this situation, I think the future of Japanese sword appreciation will come down to a couple of well-run and richly endowed museums. We have to support them, but they are rare and exceptional. The major effort of preserving and appreciating the mass of Japanese swords will have to come from a cadre of individuals who find them interesting. Peter

Isn't this an old Inami Hakusui origami? Peter

Having spent my porfessional career thinking about how people treat their "things" and my personal life acquiring stuff. I find this thread very interesting. Thnak you Mick. Recenttly, Arnold reminded us of the insights of Alsop's laws of collecting and they are relevant here once again. I will add only the comments of Larry McMurty's Cadillac Jack who said, , "Collections are as numerous as clouds and like clouds they form, break up, disappear, and form again." I take this to mean that letting collections go is part of the the collecting process. Sword collecting seems to be entering a deflationary phase so getting rid of collections will unfortunately involve both emotional and financial loss. I hate it when that happens! I have to agree that museums are NOT likely to be good homes for Japanese sword collections. As Grey pointed out they rarely have the knowledge or interest to care for/about Nippon-to. They also rarely have the resouces to take care of sword collections. If you want to "donate" your swords, you had better be ready to give them substantial cash as well! And beyond all that, museums themselves are becoimg very fragile institutions. I predict that the next phase of world history will see museums collapse at a remarkable rate. Rather than being places that preserve swords, museums are more likely to be places that are getting rid of them (and lots of other stuff) Peter

The high end of jizai stuff is really wonderful, which means, of course, that the common stuff isnot very interesting at all. It also seems that this market has just gone wild in the past couple of years. I would enjoy a dedicated list, butI think the market has moved way beyond folks like me! Peter

November of 1943 was a VERY good moment (for some of us) but I can't see the maker's name Peter (Don't call me a Baby Boomer!

A friend forwarded me this link about “collectibles” that have suddenly become totally worthless. http://www.thestreet.com/story/13162897/1/15-collectibles-that-are-completely-worthless.html?puc=yahoo&cm_ven=YAHOO I find it annoying that my friend equates Japanese swords with Hummel figurines, but looking at this list of now worthless stuff convinces me that there is a future to our hobby, especially after the recent and wonderful discussion we just had about the potential “crash” of Nippon-to. I doubt that the objects of our interest will drop like Franklin Mint thimbles or Beanie Babies. We must expect changes and we can’t ignore market events. Appreciation of objects, -- call it “collecting” – is subject to changing taste so interest in Japanese swords may well fade. Japanese swords have a good history of interest, but they have seen collapse. In the late 19th century, loads of them were sold into Louisiana and the Caribbean as cane knives. And then there is the reality that the world of Japanese swords is very well organized. There is lots of good information on swords and there is pretty clear agreement on what is “good” or at least “desirable”. Given all of this, collectors can recognize categories of swords and related gear that will have: steady, and generally high, value. decreasing value and little long term interest to collectors. decreasing value altho they remain worthy collectibles. We should aspire to the first category – if we can afford it and wish to pay for - or develop our own - expert advice. This category includes papered, pedigreed stuff. No surprises, no risk, few bargains, but great satisfaction. Obvious losers consist of stuff nobody wants –unpolished mumei shoto, short kazu-uchi mono even with a signature, military swords in rough condition, and swords that have visible flaws. The list could be nuanced and made longer, but even a new collector can easily acquire the skill to recognize this stuff – and avoid it. I think the next generation of sword collector should be directed to this third category. These are swords that have history and researchable pedigree, although they are NOT recognized by the taste makers as serious stuff. Training your eyes to appreciate the differences between a jyo-saku and jyo-jyosaku is tough, but looking closely at a “mere” jyo-saku can reveal the wonder and artistry of the Japanese sword. Likewise, there are schools and categories that don’t get much respect – most Mino, Takada, Nio etc. – although they are interesting in historical and artistic terms. Peter

Peter, Soma is right on/near the southern boundary of the Sendai han, but Masayuki is not listed as a Sendai smith. I assume he operated in Aizu territory..The presence of foreign steel up there is interesting but not completely surprising. In my opinion, the signatature certainly looks very good and the the sword seems very interesting. I'd bet that it is completely genuine. Neat swrord! Peter

Wow! This has been a very intereting thread. I have learned a great deal and thought deeply about this thing we call "sword collecting." In fact, I think there are several levels and kinds of acrivities that make up "sword collecting." These levels are loosely inter-connected altho they may seem almost invisible to one another. At the upper end are serious collectors who know the field and trust the services of experts. This level goes thru the kinds of ups and downs described by Darcy, Curran and others have described. Basically, tho, I think it is doing rather well. I think what is actually the low end of the hobby is in deep and serious decline. Across the US - and the world - there are fellows who have been "lateral collectors" of "samurai swords." These collectors helped dealers and collector's group. They bought some books and loved their swords and formed pools of "nice" stuff. As those collections are dispersed prices for plane janes and ho-hum swords will have to fall. Maybe the middle will fall out of the market. The bottom of the field will be turned into scrap. In that case, the price of swords will look like the emerging distribution of incomes. Where is Eugene V. Debs when we need him? Peter

Geraint, Eureka! Yes, indeed, that is the quote I was looking for! Thank you thank you. Once again the NMB has worked Peter

Yes, it is certainly one of th myriad Kunihiro disks. They are plane and generally artless. Oftent the signatures are simply crude, so I suppose they could be "working fittings" for impoverished samurai of the Edo period. At the last Tampa show I made so bold as to ask Bob Haynes about these things. It was a chatted conversation and so hardly repeatable, but Bob thought that this was a group or a work shop that produced blank plates for other artists. That stuck me as at least an interesting vision of how tsuba were created. We shouldn't be surprised that the process was complex and well organized. And finally, 'cause this exhaused my knowledge, I was wih a friend at the a Sendai flea market once where we saw a classic Kunihiro round iron tsuba. My friend said there was a tsuba maker named Kunihiro in Sendai. Niether of us bought that tsuba altho it was very cheap. I have never seen a listin for that guy and the guard we looked at t was a crude hockey puck sort of item. Peter

Thank you Big-Rokujuro! These are interesting links. As i punched the "post" button for my initial message, I also recalled seeing - at chicago some years back - a russian sword that had been tricked out in Japan - apparently it was a Russo-Japanese bring-back.. The sword I am addressing at the moment is (I think) a later example of the Rampeki-/Namban craze. In general, I think it is becoming clear that the world of Japanese swords was always somewhat permiable, with foreign materials and ideas drifting in but always as exotic oddities. Again, thanks Peter

Dear Friends. Please allow me to beg help from the collected wisdom the NMB. I am preparing a small article on a “Japanese” sword that incorporates what I believe is a model of 1796 English cavalry blade and scabbard. Interestingly, the blade seems to have be “polished” in Japan and given a kessho suguha hamon. I recall reading in - I think one of George Sansom’s books - about a Japanese official who acquired a European blade and had it polished. But, even with some serious searching, I can’t find the reference I recall. Does anyone else recall ever having seen reference to Japanese polished “foreign” blades? Peter

Not bales, I think, more likely spools of thread ready tp be put on weaving shuttles. Peter

I'd like to hear more about this tsuba. In the spirit of open, friendly discussion, and with no intention of being negative or arguementative, I have to say that I find this tsuba rather thick, heavy and blocky. It was certainly fairly priced. And whose to argue with the origami? Stiil, I find this guard flat and massive and not very graceful. Please tell me what I'm missing. Peter

Eric was in Chicago, buying rather actively. Peter

I agree with Rokujuro. Something ginned up in the spirit of a Dha. Peter

Not buying swords, anymore? What does THAT mean? Truth to tell I am NOT buying like I used to, 'cause there just ain't swords out there like there used to be. But my plan is to to have all the kin and kids around my bed, weeping, when the phone rings and and the family hears me say, "Well, sure, I'll take it. Bring it around this weekend." Peter

This is sad news!. Thanks for sharing, Grey. Craig was an interesting guy who moved collecting forward with his book business and with his generally interesting insights. He had a very good eye and encouraged serious interest in nippon-to. Peter

I agree with Curran. This is beautiful stuff and also a very amazing historical document! Thanks for sharing. Peter

Yeah, and I'm told that in Viet Nam the CIA guys all worn blue jeans. Banana Republic and L. L. Bean have outlets in Baghdad. If somebody want so display these with their armor, they sure can. If you want to buy some go to any to the better mingei-ya stores..I used to buy wari-zori at a fly fishing shop. I never saw an mon-zukuiri mino, tho. Peter

The last item is a not - I think - a jingasa. It is a straw rain hat related to a "mino" and typical premodern peasant dress. Nice, but not military gear,. Peter