jensen6865

Hi guys, Thank you all for the information on facts, ideas, and even the humanity of art forms! I don't know about you all that are way more experienced, but I learned an enormous amount! I had a great time. Thanks to all, Dan

I want to learn to cheat!!! Dan

Okay, Here goes, I really think Jean is just making me look like the amateur I really am!!! Not really, I think this way of learning is way, way better than just looking, looking and reading! At least I have learned more! Sugata-looks more Tori-zori than Koshi-zori-at least with some smiths later in Kamakura or on, Not huge, wide or thin and no long Kissiki of Nambokucho. Sori-almost an inch- early blade. Motohaba is only 2.8cm, pretty narrow for Nambokucho, some narrowing up the blade, Suraige- at least from meks are quite a ways apart- first position one handed of Muromachi? Don't think so to me- doesn't feel heavy or thick enough. Nagasa still 70 cm. Pretty long. Bohi- down from some I've seen, made when need some space/length to sharpen kissiki. Later kamakura at least? Hamon-continues nicely all the way up and around the kissiki, boshi-not late when some midari-komi? Nie- early, nice even suguha hamon. Hada- looks very even and well forged, no Chikei listed, steel doesn't look bright and shiny as late more modern steels. Period- Late Kamakura? School-I was more bold at first- kind of felt like Enju-now... it doesn't seem to all fit.... Smith- I don't have a clue. Feeling like I need to look and read and engage in this a lot, lot more, Dan Please be hard and bluntly direct so I may learn!

Hi, Beginners first guess- Enju. Since Hi ends lower perhaps after Kamakura or late? Don't have a real solid idea yet of what hotsure looks like. Please don't laugh, haven't been at this long, but I really like it, Dan

Hi, So Nie that makes up Chikei is dark in a line, and Nie can be in the Hamon as well. Is Nie always the same color? Dark/light/white? Man, do pictures take the place of lots of words, but only if you have the words to know what to see!!! Thanks, Dan

Hi, This may help some? Dan

Hi all, Thank you both! I read some of these things in descriptions of blades for sale and even after looking at some glossaries was still at a loss for a way to actually decide. If it is "cobwebbed" with Nie would it be evenly distributed or would it tend to follow the lines of the hada/grain of the steel? I can't really tell, with my inexperience, but it looks sometimes and some lighting angles as if the edges of the grain is all nie, or would it just be "standing out"? So the actual Nioi line of the hamon against the rest of the hada is always nioi, with or without Nie. In you debt, Dan

Paulb, Thanks for the input and thoughts. I took very careful measurements with a depth gauge and straightedge and it has slightly more sori directly above machi than the rest of the blade. I will try and look at some of the smiths/schools you mentioned and see if I can gain some insight. The shinoji is low, as in almost exactly parallel. Polishing? "Tight nioi guchi" how is that defined? The bright white line of the hamon is obvious Nie, In some lighting and angles it almost appears that the hada has Nie woven throughout, but I don't know if that is just what grain/hada looks like when it really "stands up"? I will try and get more info up. thank you very much, Dan

Hi Jean, I love this interchange of ideas, but hate my ignorance of so much of the computer/file and kantei. I will try to figure out how to make it work for everyone's system. Sorry to anyone else who had a problem! Thank you for the form. I actually thought, "I am not stupid, I read fast, I will have this blade figured out in a few days". How unbelievably ignorant!! Then I got a few hints and didn't even know what it meant, still don't about some.... for instance, "hamachi- lots of info there". I am afraid I still don't know all that is meant. Thanks to all, Dan

Hi everyone, Here is Jean's posted form filled out best I can know and see. No laughing please! thanks, Dan bladeinfoform.pdf

Dear Jean, Thanks so much, I will certainly do it! Dan

HI guys, When you have a chance could some of you check this blade out and give me some of your thoughts. I only have two books now and they have helped me a little bit, but even when the period is no so easy to tell with some smiths/schools when Toriizori and Zoshizori are involved.... first impressions gave me a possible Nambokucho era, but then some thought because of sori, more like even late Muromachi, but it seems awfully long for it and so many other things... Any help would be great! Even just hints would be a help!---have: chikei, Itame, ko-maru, o-suraige, bo-hi, mumei, nakago sori, polishes, seriously Nie I am pretty sure lots of Ji-nie. Thanks to all, Love this site! Dan PS- It is all your guys' fault I want more blades!!!

Hey Guys, Nice typing!! Yes the oa on blade is 88 cm. Sorry about that! It would be a strange new folded blade to get all that right. Don't make me laugh so early in the morning- at least here! Ken, thanks for the look and experience. A few have thought/suggested even late Muromachi, but I can't find any that size/hada/hamon and with old polishes, which no one seems to disagree about, it just doesn't seem to fit, but I am realizing more and more how much is involved here. Thanks guys, any other help would be really appreciated, Dan

Hi all, Still trying to narrow down this blade. Been reading all I can and looking at lots of good blades. I am beginning to understand why it takes years to be an expert! This came back with my dad from Occupation with Bushmasters. I have posted a number of ideas and pictures of it before. Hopefully I know a little more now. Any help and guidance would be very much appreciated. Overall blade length- 38cm. Nagasa-68cm. Nakago-20.3cm. Sori-16mm. Motohaba-32mm. Ji-20mm, shinoji-12mm Sakihaba-25mm. Munimachi-1.5mm. Hamachi-1mm. Kissiki-40mm (Chu?) O-suriage probably about 8.1cm( from rust line and polishing thinning). Nakago sori-1.5mm. Motokasane-8mm. Sakikasane-6mm. Hamon:at hamachi-8mm, at yakote-9mm. Suguha, w/small choji/gnome? sometimes, looks like ashi. Nie along the hamon. Cloudy white to ha. Ji- Itame/mokume, strongly standing? really shows up like grain. Chekei or maybe just jinie some places. Lots of Jinie. Boshi: sugu hamon continues around kissiki same width. Even curve with edge. Ko-maru. Short kaeri. Fits kissiki perfectly. Picture of Boshi doesn't show that it goes further up and tight Komaru-flash hides it. Thanks for helping, Dan

Just when I think I am starting to have, "aha" moments I feel like the little kid in class again! Thanks guys. I will find out how to accurately locate deepest point of sori. Am I getting some of this correct? The machi used to be down about 8 cm more, the blade polish goes down to far below machi now. You can just see the hamon going almost down as far until it disappears into suriage? work on nakago? There is the old rust pit line across blade where used to end maybe. But how the mekugiana are placed? Am I totally missing something about them? Obviously...! A hint maybe... I really want to figure this out, but WOW is there a lot of info....! Am I safe in assuming that the overall length has been shortened if the nakago would only be about 4 1/2" long if it wasn't? Thanks especially Ken and Barry, Dan

Hi, Thank you, I see what you mean! Dan

Thank you. I will give it a go! Appreciate it, Dan

Hi all, I am struggling with suguta and sori for period. The blade I am trying to figure out myself before I cheat and send it in has a very regular curve. If I take extremely precise measurements it is very slightly Koshi sori. Polished and suriage also involved. I read the overall changes over time in the periods and watch the sift of sori as time goes on. Here is my problem. This blade only ends up fitting (in my feeble understanding) as yamashiro, but nothing fits with them except well before Late Muromachi. If it is "normal" Kamakura or Nambokucho it should be Koshi sori, but then I find that Torii Sori is actually sometimes called Kyo sori because Yamashiro wasn't always like the other schools. In such a case I have tryed to work somewhat backwards to try and figure. I realize that the low shinoji can be created by a lot of work over time and polishes, but even without it I am afraid I am stuck. Any thoughts or direction would be very much appreciated. Thank you all, Dan

Hi Chris, Appreciate your input and time. I thought it was later as well, but then I couldn't find anything with low shinogi that fit and when I overlay the blade outline onto even a Kuniyuki of Yamashiro Rai from Shoshin it matched perfectly. So i went back to a initial thought/guess Marius had about slightly earlier.I wonder if the nakago angle was changed slightly at suriage, there is a spot on it that the bohi is bent down like it was hit to reshape curve. Do you know if they ever did that? Anything else you see I have totally missed please do not hesitate to say, "hey dumby that can't be" ... Thank you, Dan

Hi all, I posted a few months ago a blade my Dad brought back from Japan. Since then I have asked questions, looked unbelievably stupid, viewed thousands of pictures, read everything I could find etc. May I first list dimensions etc and then short version of conclusions and see how far off I am. I am beginning to understand decades needed to really know...... Overall blade length- 38cm. Nagasa-68cm. Nakago-20.3cm. Sori-16mm. Motohaba-32mm. Ji-20mm, shinoji-12mm Sakihaba-25mm. Munimachi-1.5mm. Hamachi-1mm. Kissiki-40mm (Chu?) O-suriage probably about 8.1cm( from rust line and polishing thinning). Nakago sori-1.5mm. Motokasane-8mm. Sakikasane-6mm. Hamon:at hamachi-8mm, at yakote-9mm. Suguha, w/small choji/gnome? sometimes, looks like ashi. Nie along the hamon. Cloudy white to ha. Ji- Itame/mokume, strongly standing? really shows up like grain. Chekei or maybe just jinie some places. Lots of Jinie. Boshi: sugu hamon continues around kissiki same width. Even curve with edge. Ko-maru. Short kaeri. Fits kissiki perfectly. Maybe- Bravely- Here goes: Suguta with suriage and polishing taken into account late Kamakura/Nambokucho period. Yamashiro almost parallel low shinoji planes. Nagasa without suriage probably about 76cm. Thick kasane-8mm which does not taper to almost half like in Muromachi period. Itame/mokume hada really with jinie. Hamon small curved choji/gnome with ashi. Place along side of blade that looks like a Rai steel patch. Deep breath-O-suriage tachi and not katana? Kunimitsu? the ones on Sho-Shin Koto schools look just like it. No Ryokai looked right. Nobukuni hada looked possible especially with chekei, but nothing else looked right. Haba/kasane so different than most others of Yamashiro. Hasebe looks good in a lot of ways especially hada and nie along hamon, but masame along ha makes us move on. Kunimitsu's blades that I have looked at look really close. Color of blade-blueish? Please let me know what you think and what I have missed. Really have learned a lot, but I realize now how little I know. Thank you all, Dan

Thank you very much for the insight and advice! I will try it! Dan

Thanks. The polish is well, bad, but it is neat to see so much going on in the steel. Slowly learning about chikei and Nie and things. Pretty awesome! Dan

Hi all, Had a few minutes with some light left and took some shots to try and get hamon visible in photo. They are bad I know, but from what you can see can you point me a little with what you see? The slowly learning one, Dan PS- kind of excited, bought the new book out for sale on this site. had to tell some one!!!

Hi all, Thanks so much for the push forward!!! Dan

Is that more in 1189 and 1189 as well? I feel like a explorer even though I didn't even know to look for it! Thanks Hoanh, Dan