Alex A

The first thing that crossed my mind when i read your statement Jacques was what about an exceptional works by a lower ranking smith, is that not art?

You raise an interesting point about folk referring to "all" Japanese swords being "art" swords. I suppose even kazu-uchimono could be described as "art", as it obviously took skill to make them. As you know, there are many schools known not for "artistic" merit but for their non-aesthetic no nonsense approach, schools like Dotanuki (I'm also a fan). However, whilst they are known for being utilitarian, a lot do have "artistic" merit, but compared to the example at the beginning of the thread, then how much "artistic" value?. Hard to put into terms so il try a percentage, 20%?. What artistic value could you put on a kazu-uchimono?, 5%?. Think I'm looking too much into this Again, back the sword I presented at the beginning of the thread, for me an "art" sword. The hamon runs high, I doubt any Samurai Dotanuki owners back in the day would swap before a battle for something this "artistic". Beautiful sword though, I get the impression that the smith went all out to create "art". Everything on that sword is INTENTIONAL, there is even some spots of what looks to be tobiyaki on identical distances along the blade. For me "intentional" is a key word, if I put this sword as a percentage, id go with 70%. . Its difficult to be precise on this subject and as Ken mentioned above "beauty is in the eye of the beholder"

You could say that they are "worthy of preservation and study on the basis of cultural history, craftsmanship and form " without the word "art", but as antiques. but I suppose your right in stating that "art" lends an hand. Interesting point.

Someone could get a Chinese knock off and add horimono etc etc etc Maybe add a cheap tsuba and fuchi (legit ones) Then sell at a profit. Steel looks wrong in the close ups, horimono looks weird, as though the metal crumbled as they were doing it and it looks like it was done yesterday. Then there is everything else previously mentioned above. Chromed did you say?, a museum discussing a "chromed" sword, unusual. I see enough to run a mile. £3000, oh dear, difficult judging from photos though, lets hope I'm wrong.

I read it occasionally. Subjective i suppose. I stumbled across a sword at Aoi earlier, made me think of the term. https://www.aoijapan.com/wakizashi-taikei-naotanebunka-1nen-2-gatsu-hi-february-1804 Ps, just noticed its on consignment, not mine and not sales pitch, nice sword though.

Me too.

Hi Andrew. Il have be brief, boss has come up with a new clocking in phone app Seems the biggest issue is actually getting to accept swords over the counter, have a read of this, not Europe, US, but still applies. http://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topic/23294-mailing-swords-to-the-usa-from-the-uk/ You have not stated what exactly you are shipping?, tanto, wak, katana, value ?. I have always used Parcelforce, once accepted then no problems. You might want to try booking in online. Has someone bought the sword?. Sometimes they want the cheap service, if so, then make it clear that the risk is their risk, either by way of lack of tracking or insurance (can be expensive) Best

I will find the thread, cheers Ken.

Thanks for sharing, nightmare that Grev. As well as damp, I was concerned about temperature fluctuations, especially in winter. Can cause problems with saya too, warping, leading to scuffed blades.

Cheers Gents. Richard, you may have a point, probably me In hindsight, an odd question, I suppose. You know how it is though, you see something you don't like and you go through the WTH stage. Ive bought a few boxes off Ebay, will need some adjustment. Some of those tsuba bags too. Going to put them in another drawer too. The drawer they are in at the moment is up against an outside wall. Ive never put swords there for that reason, same now with the tsuba. Cheers.

I noticed a tiny spot of Verdigris on a copper tsuba earlier, managed to sort it out ok. It may have been there when I bought it some time ago and only just noticed, not sure. I always handle soft metal tsuba with those jewellery gloves I'm now wondering how they are stored, I keep them with the iron tsuba in a wooden drawer covered up. Only a few of my tsuba came with wooden boxes. Ive read online that some coin collectors use Renaissance wax, but I'm thinking that's not a good idea, not sure. Considering putting them in plastic food containers with a few silica gel sachets, but is that going too far?, maybe just buy some wooden tsuba boxes. Any thoughts welcome.

Just wanted to add, yes, there are great deals around, but if you become obsessed with getting great deals then you narrow your field. Would be fantastic if every item I was after had been sat here on the board or at an arms fair at a bargain price. The truth is, they are a few and far between, sat in collectors/dealers websites or sat in private collections (and they don't give them up easily or at bargain prices). I suppose it all depends on what your looking for and whats available. Sometimes you have to pay over the odds to get what you want, sometimes takes years to find that item. Happy hunting!. Ps, the only sword I have sold from a dealer for the same price was a corker, appealed to a lot of people, tokubetsu hozen, and above all, a great price from that dealer. Most of the rest from dealers has been sold at a loss, usually lose 15-20%, but hey ho, there are worse things to spend cash on. I suppose when I look back when I'm old and grey (not to far off ), its the stuff ive owned that I will remember and be glad to have owned, not what ive spent.

Gary, you will probably find out that you cannot avoid this pitfall, having more knowledge does not stop you wanting stuff you cant afford. Only way around it it is to let the misses know when you see something you like Look at prices at dealers, Aoi for example, you think you can get the same price?. good luck with that.

Good tactics

You could always put an advert in the wanted section, with your budget.

I see. Now that's the king of amateur polish

Not as I imagined Jamie, seen an awful lot worse attacked by wire wool

Forgot say, the Northern Token society hold meetings in Manchester.

What can you tell us about it Richard, i see Mon, but what of the design?. When i look at designs like this i see everything, from war fans to butterflies, and generally miss the point, should there be one, that is. Lovely tsuba.

Hi James, from one Nr Manc to another, don't waste your money on this sword, better to buy a sword already in decent polish. Especially if someone has gone over the blade with wire wool, could be hiding a crack (fatal). You see various quality in polishing around the UK at shows and online, some dealers just wanting a basic clean up for a sale. I hear Tony Norman down south does good work but very busy, expect to wait a long time, that's should he get the time wish to take it on. There are various arms shows around the UK, the main one being Birmingham, google northern arms fairs and go take a look, just to get an idea. Don't buy swords online unless you know what your doing, plenty of great sellers but sadly sellers out there waiting for unaware eager buyers, Ebay and the like being the worst, always ask if your unsure. Read some books, plenty of advice on here, do a search. You could speak to Bill at Liverpool Militaria, he might have something or know someone who does, he does the shows. Finally, always be SURE about what you buy, otherwise its a one way ticket to buyers REMORSE, so no rush.

Well worth buying Ians book, Arms and armour of the Samurai. Battle axes (Masakari) get a mention as being used by some Samurai, but rare.

Looks fake to me, when I zoom in, I think I see holes from casting.

Ive learned just to say "its an old antique sword in wooden scabbard", I don't mention Japan apart from on the description that you need to fill in (country of origin). On the description i will write "old antique sword in wooden scabbard, 300 years old (or whatever age)", along with the customs tariff reference. I don't mention Japan to the staff member because I don't want them thinking "Samurai sword", which may raise an eyebrow. The biggest issue I encountered was an impolite staff member behind the counter, she just took one look at the long box and said "you cant post that". Really annoying as I had already checked online. We got there in the end, although I no longer go to that post office, I prefer to drive 5 miles to the guy that does not create hassles. I think in future I will do the online thing, was unaware, but sounds a great idea.

Cheers Jean, for a a while I was thinking folk might think I'm being serious

Lots of bids already, obviously some folk think its a little cracker.