Alex A

Taking in all of what has been said above, hammers home this thought that keeps reoccurring over and over again. Ruling out a lot, i know, but no longer interested in unsigned swords and swords which are not definitive in type of work for the smith, oddballs. Would not want to end up with Sayagaki to this and papered to that, hate it. You own it but your not sure what is, a massive minus, especially when you need to ask a shinsa panel.

That's a tough one, dont want to end up with junk. For the money, this is by far the best deal for anyone on a budget, ive seen lately. Sadly, its over budget but i think it would be a great gift. Actually, with its dimensions it may well be a gift sword for the birth of a child. Reminds me of Yokoyama, the hamon. Blade has 2 different sides and 2 types of hada which is interesting/eductational. Koshirae has issues but ok, blade has a small flaw. Sometimes you got to push the budget for something decent, i don't consider this a killer https://www.toukenkomachi.com/index_ja_tachi&katanaA031219.html PS, i saw a cheap wak in koshirae at an arms fair and thought that would be a nice gift for my lad, i brings it home, gives it to him and he turns around and says "its rubbish" He was the same age, even at that age they can just know!

If you send really clear pictures of hada, hamon, nakago, kissaki and sugata and full dimensions, then you might get a better idea, should it be a definitive example.

Tend to disagree a bit there Jean. Wont add any value but with some blades its pretty straight forward working out whether they are genuine or not.. Some blades don't need authentication papers. Steve, you wont do this just looking at the mei or from bad images, compare the blade to that of existing examples and literature. You can send blades to Shinsa and not be any wiser, they might not be able to narrow it down to one smith.

Jake, don't put yourself out, was just curious. Can be surprisingly heavy, such swords, the kind that don't brake in battle Cheers

Good spot Okan, uncanny Ps Jake, would you know the weight of this sword?. Someone should buy this before someone else does, great opportunity!

Now that's a war sword!, very nice.

I remember looking at the works of Enomoto Sadayoshi and Son. Habaki were the same on many swords though think these were later swords. Whilst i don't have a clue whether they made their own or not (wouldn't be surprised if they did), smiths do get into habits of using the same version. Some here from both smiths. So, in a way, Habaki and smith can be linked. http://www.ricecracker.com/japanese_swords/tanto/st2.htm http://sanmei.com/contents/media/A72895_S8890_PUP_E.htm https://www.samuraimuseum.jp/shop/product/modern-Japanese-sword-shirasaya-katana-gendaitosigned-by-yusuishin-sadayoshi/

Hate the way you have to declare the value on a package going overseas, think in this day and age that would be information only available to customs, its not rocket science. Open invitation to attract thieves.

Such a worry lately is shipping. Not talking about anyone in this thread but when it comes to shipping an expensive antique, will avoid like the plague sending it to anyone i do not know. If that means getting an antiques dealer/trusted person involved as a middle man, at cost, i will do it. Seems crazy in this day and age putting items worth £1000s in cardboard boxes and hoping for the best, without insurance. Payment also!, if buyers/sellers don't agree terms, you got to wonder why.

Looks good Grey, glad to see you have kept your sold pages.

Should these have a nengo Jacques, do you think ? https://www.samuraimuseum.jp/shop/product/antique-Japanese-sword-katana-signed-by-osafune-kiyomitsu-nbthk-kicho-certificate/ https://www.aoijapan.net/katana-bizen-osafune-norimitsu/ https://www.samuraimuseum.jp/shop/product/antique-Japanese-sword-katana-signed-by-bishu-osafune-sukesadanbthk-hozon-certificate/

Lots and lots of swords out there made by obscure/low level smiths where there is very little references. (for us) Not just Koto, Edo too. References that only the likes of a shinsa panel may have a hold of. No doubt they come across swords now and again where even they scratch their heads.

John, as Johnny pointed out, maybe one for Shinsa to sort this. Just having a look through Takada swords, surprising variation. See some smiths at a certain time producing running itame with masame in the shinogi-ji whilst others a Ko-mokume etc etc etc.. As said earlier, known for copying other schools. The hada did not shout Shinshinto to me, but who knows. Its a tough one, without seeing it in hand and using the available images. Cheers.

Sometimes, a horse can be so high it puts the riders head in the clouds. Another line.. "Sorry, but when I see that someone declaring a nakago machi-okuri on a simple photo (without having had the sword in hand) it is the proof that he doesn't know much." Yet Jacques does not have the sword in hand either and come to the conclusion it is less than 150 years old and gimei. Nothing of certainty can be said about this sword yet, as not enough good photos and we do not have it in hand. Jeez, first time i saw the picture of the hada i thought Sue Mino Looked at the hamon and thought Bizen.

Not wanting to jump in but feel this point has to be made for the sake of any newbies being sucked in by Jacques “everything in boxes” way of thinkng. Seen some swords with NBTHK, dated to the late Muromachi where the mei looked nothing like other examples, you would just look and assume gi-mei. NBTHK have more resources and Knowledge than Jacques, and are obviously a lot more open minded. The mei is the last thing you look at! This has gone way of mark, would advise owner to study hamon and hada closer, look for a school. Anyways, leave you to it

Jacques, i was making a point, i stated gift tanto. Done my best to be polite and friendly with you, but your intolerable You really are making this an awkward place to be, and I'm the troll No wonder some REAL educated GENTS don't post so much lately, i guess they are all tired and bored of your constant desire to be confrontational Anyways, I'm out of this thread too, before i say something that gets me kicked out.

Jacques, again, not spending all afternoon on the internet to please you. From memory, have a look at Eds sold page or the other, cant remember off the top of my head but the name Moses comes to memory. Dealers are not as pedantic as you on such matters as these type of swords are not so desirable and sell for low prices, so they dont want to spend money and time on them getting them papered. Spoke to Tsuruta San the other day, he confirmed what i just said. An example, see any papers for this gift tanto ?, even made by the guy that started Yokoyama Bizen. https://www.aoijapan.com/tantoyokoyama-ise-kami-sukehira/

Pretty sure i saw one on a US sold page not so long ago, 45cm Another same size. 44.3cm http://nihonto.us/BOYS DAY SWORD CHI 17.htm

On a bit of a side note, often found the biggest "headache" swords come from those of the late Edo. Was only looking at a sword the other day where the hamon absolutely screamed Yokoyama chogi with yakidashi but the hada was itame/masame, not the usual ko-itame. It can be a mystery minefield. Even the seller cant say who made it. Funnily enough, that looked to be a boys day sword, or birth/gift sword. small dimensions.

Jimmy, i have an issue with the hada Its not refined enough for examples i have. Though maybe with a more thorough search, who knows.

Takada worked in so many styles that it is hard to keep a track of. Sure ive seen a book somewhere that is purely based on their swords fooling folk as Bizen, may of been for sale at Touken Komachi if i remember correctly, mentioned it in an old Takada sold page

Yes, agree, and that has been my thought for a long time in this thread As said, i was just considering other possibilities. Its the dimensions and hamachi throwing in a curve ball

As said earlier, when i see a slender blade it always gives me concerns This blade is only approx 2.5cm width at the hamachi with an healthy lot left on at the hamachi, Its a possibility this is a late Edo tourist piece. Ive seen them, where smiths want to save material and just put together something that a tourist will go home with. In fact, i bought one at an arms fair, puzzled me for a while. Not certain and don't want to start going on about hamachi again, but you have to try and see the full picture. With all the details addeds, makes a difference. That had a nakago that looked like it had been messed with too, bit of an odd shape. Something about the hamon too which reminds me of late Edo Bizen type. Come across boys days/chigosahi swords that look similar, they were made by late Edo Bizen schools. Mumei, with a ji- mei added.. Slender nakago too. Though, just a thought and not sure yet.

Jimmy, as funny as it is arguing sometimes. Often seen those that treat folk with disrespect fall, karma My philosophy(if spelt right) , treat folk with respect and you shall receive respect. In my experience of 50 years, ive seen Karma put more things right than i can care to imagine be nice or meet karma