ROKUJURO

This TSUBA is not really a treasure, it is corroded and has a crack. I purchased it just for the KUCHINASHI no HANA design which I find pleasing. There seem to be remains of black lacquer on it, the other side is still more corroded. I hope it fits into this thread of early (= pre EDO) iron TOSOGU. To avoid the usual defining categories as suggested in the other thread, I see this design possibly as (early?) OWARI province style, but the TSUBA measures 82,5 mm with a thickness of only 4,8 mm (SEPPA-DAI). What do you think?

Piers, the KOZUKA is probably very special and rare. While the gold dot just fills in the NAKAGO-ANA, the gold dot on the TSUBA might represent sun or moon, I believe. Looks indeed close!

Stefano, please show the NAKAGO vertically (tip upwards) so we can try to read it. It is probably KIN ZÔGAN MEI, but parts have fallen out, so photos will need good lighting and a dark background for better contrast. Please post it in the translation section so the experts can see it!

This whole thread has nothing to do with TSUBA. It is Kindergarten, and I am out, too.

The short text may seem interesting to some, but as far as sword forging in Japan is concerned, it is not correct in parts. I read: .....Once you had joined, then you had access to oral and practical instruction and ultimately to the manuscript texts which embodied the “secret” knowledge. All this came at a financial cost, of course: the knowledge had not been privatised and professionalised for nothing...... Well, as an interested apprentice, you could not choose a school or a master, but you had to apply for apprenticeship, hoping to be accepted. Additionally, as a young lad, you certainly had no knowledge about sword making schools or differences in techniques. And learning did not contain manuscript texts or whatever instruction, oral or practical. In the beginning, you were allowed to watch the master and to learn by copying movements and techniques. This has only changed with some smiths in modern times where real teaching is practiced. Apprentices did not have to pay (as was usual in Europe at that time), but only as an UCHI DESHI they could sleep in the house and were fed by the smith's family. For everything else, they had to rely on support from their own family. The only process that was kept secret for outsiders was the temperature of the quenching water in the trough. So no, this text part is not well researched and mostly fantasized.

We should not try to read a MEI in case it is presented in such a way. There are ways to find out how a MEI is read, even for a newbie.

Brian, if I'm allowed to correct you: This is only partly true. Some oils with special properties* (not low-viscosity sewing-machine oil!) can produce a "closed" layer, keeping oxygen away for a while and thus stopping the corrosion build-up. This works as long a the oil layer is kept thick enough and stable. Dust gathering on an openly displayed blade is not helpful. Wiping the oil off for re-sheathing the blade will lead to a very thin layer of oil which mainly remains in the microscopic crevices of the HADA. This means, a polished blade can be kept clean from rust if looked after regularly. Environmental factors like humidity play an important role. However, rust build-up on a blade is much more difficult to treat as it kind of absorbs part of the oil. In many cases, you will not achieve a "closed" layer of oil. Stopping the corrosion completely will rarely be possible, and the best result will often be just slowing it down. So there is a very good reason to have a blade competently polished and keeping it clean. * A high-viscosity oil will produce a relatively thick layer on the steel and provide good protection, while a low-viscosity oil has better "creeping" properties and will go into the HADA. But the layer thickness will be low, and it may run off the blade easily. So you want the best of both worlds for your sword oil, and often enough, natural oils are not 100% suitable and have to be removed and renewed regularly. Modern protective oils can have better properties, beading and running-off can be eliminated and desirable characteristics exactly as needed. On the other hand, they could be sticky and difficult to remove. Everything has to be tested!

As has been said before, it all comes down to knowledge. When I read that someone wants to get rid "only" of the rust on a blade without grinding/polishing, it is apparent to me that this person has absolutely no understanding that rust is not a layer on top of the steel like a paint, but the steel itself which has turned into iron oxide. Of course there is superficial and deep rust, but to prevent further corrosion, you have always to grind down to the bare metal. Without basic knowledge, you should keep your pinkies off any metal object.

Stephen, that is an interesting one with an obviously added (= fire-welded) HITSU-ANA! Cool!

Kurt, good idea! We would only need $ 12.000.-- or so, depending on the smith. Some ask more, but perhaps there are cheaper ones. Who of the ca. 60 (or 120 noted in other sources) starving sword-smiths do you plan to support? And would that change their situation?

Thomas, you are correct, the mirror-makers used also bronze. With "cast in a raw shape" I meant exactly the casting of copper ingots for TSUBA making in water. YAMAGANE is also likely to produce voids if cast in a mold.

HAMACHI and MUNEMACHI do not align, but in the opposite way than seen in Chinese copies. Not familiar to me.

As far as I know, bronze (a copper-tin alloy) was not used for TSUBA-making. Bronze is always a cast metal, and copper has to be cast as well in a raw shape. Infos by Ford Hallam

Hi John, in the EDO period, the Japanese had iron casting technology, and it was mastered in very good quality. They had furnaces to heat up iron to its melting point (1.538°C), and of course they would have been able to cast small objects like TSUBA! They used the "lost mold" (not 'lost wax') technology learned from the Chinese, and it was not the same as our modern 'sand-casting', but for the molds they used a mixture of clay and sand to produce a fine surface. The problem in the discussion here about this subject is the lack of knowledge about iron casting and annealing, but also about Japanese history. Making a mold for casting is a lot of work. You have to make a 'master object' first, considering the shrinkage of the desired final object. Using this, a two-piece mold was made that had to be heated up for casting so the molten iron could run freely into the finer structures. After cooling, the mold had to be destroyed to 'free' the cast object. Cleaning and cutting-off sprues and air-ducts had to follow, together with careful filing-off casting seams. Annealing to make the objects less fragile was an additional process, necessitating fuel (charcoal) and furnaces, adding to the production costs. This single-item process was labour-intensive, not resulting in cheap mass-production! Only when industrial steel production came up in the late 19th century, chill-casting was invented which allowed mass-production and low item prices. In EDO JIDAI, there was no demand for cast iron TSUBA that could be substantiated. "Normal" people (so-called 'commons) had no use for TSUBA, and wealthy people could afford traditionally made ones. Generally in the Japanese culture, hand-made objects were (and are) highly appreciated. Mass-produced small 'art' items are still considered trinkets or giveaways today. The other side should also be looked at: Forging was a well established craft in Japan, as we all know. Forging a TSUBA blank is really easy and not time consuming, and they used simple iron for it which had good toughness as opposed to cast iron. We know that not all TSUBA were made by a single workshop, but some traditions/schools used ready-made blanks and decorated them in a more artistic way. Coming to your post, we have to differentiate between "smelting" and "melting". You can feed an OROSHIGANE kiln with old iron objects that were originally made from TAMAHAGANE. The result would then be a kind of bloom looking very close to a TAMAHAGANE bloon (= KERA), differing possibly only in the carbon content. There is no melting intended in this process! Of course you can also use scrap iron of any alloy type in an OROSHIGANE kiln, but the resulting bloom would not have the properties of TAMAHAGANE and could not be treated the same way. The main purpose of this special process besides the recycling is to control the carbon content. With this short abstract, I have only scratched the surface of these technologies, but I wanted to show that throwing assumptions and guesses around is never a basis for true research. Often, the reality is not what we want it to be.

That's the problem.

To me, the leaves look like those of chrysanthemum: which would correspond with the shape of the HITSU-ANA

Hi Alex, it is a sword, and probably an authentic one, and older than WWII; that much can be stated. But the photos are not good enough to comment much. The TSUBA seems to be by BUSHU no JU MASAKATA, and the blade was probably shortened at one time. Have a look into your PM for more information.

Ken, the first MEI character is perhaps MUNE, but the rest is difficult to read. Maybe it would be easier to identify if we had good photos of the whole TSUBA.

Infos on HANKEI: https://www.samuraimuseum.jp/shop/hankei-繁慶/?srsltid=AfmBOoqRnUAVVM7X1aUT4IErO36bCUF2ZxVhUu2ZXHaBZJlsmCET8pcG

A SUN NOBI TANTO is usually a tiny bit longer than 1 SHAKU, and in past warfare, it was used as a TANTO, not as a WAKIZASHI. This is why collectors like to stay with the TANTO designation. But the NBTHK had to draw a "technical" line, so in the papers, 303 mm is the limit for TANTO.

Stefano, you certainly meant MENUKI?

Stephen, to me, this one looks like a wheel motif, one of later type, not Buddhist or HEIAN JIDAI cart-wheel. A FUKURIN is always a nice addition!

Well, we have an IZAKAYA.

Jacques, all the best for the soonest healing possible! May your New Year start better than the old ended!

...to a blind person.