Ford Hallam

Hi John, Franco, thanks for the heads up on that one. I'm more interested in the other families and looking for the connection. What is an interesting possibility is the adoption of this Portuguese badge and it evolving to the form you've shown. The fact that it was Christian is useful to know too. thanks again, ford

Gentlemen, some of you may have been following the recent discussion on some motif's on a particular Yoshino style tsuba, over on The Tosogu Forum; here's the link to the thread I thought we might be able to learn a little more about this tsuba if we were able to identify the mon in question and see if there appears to be any sort of association suggested by this group. The "mon" in the red square is the "odd one out" in my opinion, but if someone does find it listed as a kamon, before say 1575, It would help resolve part of the puzzle. any and all assistance will be appreciated. Thanks and regards, Ford

near photographic memory ...I wish, it was just luck. I was looking for something else and it caught my eye

you mean Tsuchiya Yasuchika I. it does look like the kanji for rain. I think the 3rd one looks like a shell...anyone know of a kanji that derives from a shell?

Still not sure what these mean but I stumbled on this Kozuka in the Baur collection ( D1667 ). It's by Otsuki Hideoki. the fact that they appear to the same, and in the same order might mean that they have some significance...hmm regards, Ford

Hi Remzy, take a look on my blog, towards the bottom of the first page, you'll find a very good example of MOP inlay on a tsuba by the man credited with starting the concept. regards, Ford

These look like archaic ( about 4000 years old ) Chinese ideo, or pictograms, the sort of thing that preceded the development of what we now call; Kanji. I can't read the stuff though :lol:

oops! sorry John, my befuddled mind...Ito Jakuchu...Murakami Jochiku...it's all a blur I'm speaking of the Murakami Jochiku school. Take a peek at my blog for a recent, brief comment on him. I've always thought Jakuchu's paintings would make magnificent designs for metalwork, both his detailed stuff and the more expressive ink paintings style. regards, Ford

The fuchi looks to be Jakuchu school though

just a thought...Stan, do you have the name of the Auction house where this tsuba can be viewed?, their address and the lot number would be handy too. thanks, Ford

Another example of what one would expect in terms of quality. Incidentally, the eyes are inlaid in mother of pearl, something more usually associated with Murakami Jochiku.

That's a great example of what we're discussing, Reinhard. I am familiar with these, I once owned an example myself, but my contention is that the example that started this thread is not actually real at all. The image you've posted is completely "believable" because we can see the expected shadows etc, where the lacquer lies on the iron. The composition appears to have been more carefully arranged too. There's a bit of damage that actually shows the iron underneath and the way the lacquer appears to have a sort of raised edge, or cushion, where it meets the nakago and hitsu ana, these aspects are absent on the first example. As are any really convincing reflections and shadows around the lacquer. As I said at the outset, It just looks like a poor photo-shop job to me. I'm happy to admit I'm mistaken if I could see an image of it taken from an angle that would show the decoration in a realistic way though. and for what it's worth...it's spawned a good discussion regards, Ford

Excellent :D thanks Guido I knew it was out there. and I hadn't heard the term " Shino yasuri" before, thanks. regards, Ford

so even if I consider this to be real...just for the sake of argument, why not fill the nakago ana too and be done with it? No need to constrict the design at all then. In addition, there is no reason either why the butterfly should impinge on the seppa dai, it can so easily be moved. Unless of course it is part of a lacquer design off something else and it's relationship is only to the rest of the lacquer and not the tsuba underneath. :? Perhaps it's just my monitor but all I see is a lacquer design floating above an iron tsuba...it simply doesn't convince me that they are one.

Actually I'm still of the opinion that this so called lacquer design of an iron tsuba only exists in a jpeg format. I don't believe for a minute that this image is anything more than a composite of two separate images. One of the giveaways, to my mind, is the rather odd, white "highlights" in the two areas that are worn, on the main flower. This looks just like a photoshop, cut and paste artifact. The definition of the lacquer itself is less clear than the iron tsuba is is supposed to be lying on. The odd interruption of shadows on the iron when it reaches the lacquer,the vague fading where the lacquer meets the iron, the totally unconvincing brown stem of the flower...etc I may be wrong ...but going by these images I am happy to stick to my opinion. As for the idea that this is a random bit of Meiji decoration meant for an undiscerning export market, I believe this "composition" is far too inept too have been created by a real artist/artisan. I wait to see more evidence... provocatively yours, Ford ps, and now that it's the right way up we still need to flip it side to side, ie; hitsu-ana to the left and the flower on the right...

Hi Stan looks to me as though someone has photo-shopped a lacquer design onto a perfectly legitimate iron tsuba. The lacquer design seems to have been placed there with no real understanding of how a tsuba functions, it's also upside down. The speckled, grey infill looks like an addition to me as well. So; in answer to your questions; 1) No...and the basic tsuba is iron. 2) I'll be amazed if you get to handle it because I don't think it exists :D 3) see answer 2. 4) what can you tell us about it....? 5) no idea.. have fun, regards, Ford

Hi Jean, perhaps the best attitude to this is; c'est la vie

Thanks for that info John, I've not seen any in hand so it's good to know that this is the case. Nick, I didn't post that example to suggest it was a copy of yours, nor did the sex of the dragon occur to me , it was merely to suggest some similarity in general appearance of the metal. The cast sekigane being part of that. The seam, or casting lines, you refer to are of course the easiest tell-tale clue of casting to remove. It would be the first thing a reasonably competent craftsman would attend to. Their absence is not a certain indicator that a piece is not cast at all. Incidentally, one of your close ups, showing the bottom of the nakago ana, seems to reveal a pretty sharp, and newish, bit of filing...have you reworked this area? In any case, I think we will just have to "agree to disagree" on this one. You asked for opinions, I offered mine...for what it's worth, to you, or anyone else reading this. I can't do any more, or be any fairer than that. Regards, Ford

Hi Jean, maybe "pastiche" is a close match for "bidouillage"...but that's French too... and the French complain about English words entering their language

here you go Stephen; the meaning of 08/15 and Nick, here's an image of a cast steel repro tsuba from the ubiquitous Mr Lohman for comparison with yours. I'm sure you can see why I have the opinion I do. The enlargements you've posted don't show any copper seki-gane, as you say. That's my point; although you can clearly see the shape of the sekigane ( as they appear on the original ) in this casting they have been reproduced as part of the tsuba and thus are of the same material. As an aside, it might be worthwhile checking these repro sites from time to time. I was quite shocked to see the array of copies available. Any of which might fool the uninitiated. It's a pity these are not in some way marked to show them up for what they are.

my apologies...it seemed to me that the engraved lines for instance, had odd irregularities in them which would be indicative of a repro casting. Also, the "seki-gane" at the top of the nakago-ana ( and the bottom actually ) seems to be part of the plate and not copper as one would expect. there is also a suspicious ( to my eyes ) seam or mould line down the left hand side of the nakago-ana. I might be worth bearing in mind though, that if the original had bones visible then it would stand to reason that a mould taken from it would replicate them too. But, that's only my opinion, based on what I can make out from a, slightly out of focus, photo.

Hi Max, the tsuba is an "unknown" to me...the rectangular hitsu-ana may be a clue, some of the Jingo works have this feature so it may well be from Higo province too. There are a few different influences in it though. I'll keep my eyes open though in case I see anything like it, you never know. I'm sure someone will have some idea. I think the fuchi, and the kashira if it matches, are Higo, only later than the ishi-tsuke ( the chape ) . It looks to be nunome-zogan to me and the style of curving dragon feels Higo not Kaga. That only my impression though. Incidentally, the fact that it is an ishi-tsuke rather than a kojiri may mean this was originally mounted as a han-dachi.

Hi Nick, the first one looks like a cast copy to my eyes. It lacks any real definition and seems far too homogeneous in terms of texture. The second one is, as Reinhard suggests, fairly generic, both in terms of design and workmanship. Judging by the nunome and the basic nature of the carving I'd place it at right at the end of the Edo period. Perhaps a bit of Choshu influence still in evidence. regards, Ford

Hi Max, I think you are absolutely right with your call on it being essentially a Higo koshirae. the tsuba though doesn't look anything like Akasaka though. I've not seen anything like it before either, I have no doubt that it is a genuine old tsuba though. The overall quality is, in my opinion, not terribly good. They are also a bit worn. the fuchi seems in reasonable condition but I suspect the gold foil nunome is quite thin and therefore rather late. The kozuka appear to have been gilded, rather than inlaid, and this is quite worn. The bashin ( thanks Moriyama San ) also looks as though it's been a bit "overworked". The wrap is relatively new, and is not particularly well done either. The kurikata ( the horn knob on the saya ) looks like a replacement to me. The rest of the saya looks to be of reasonable quality but the fuchi is obviously not original to this work, I cant tell what the kashira looks like. The menuki look to be very late Edo, or even Meiji, stamping type fittings. My guess is that the saya is matched to the blade but that the original tsuba, fuchi/kashira and menuki were sold off a long time ago. These present bits don't fit in the way I'd expect, judging by the saya metalwork. That's my cheap opinion, if you're prepared to pay...I can give you an entirely different one regards, Ford

Hi Max, this most certainly is not junk. For $300 I reckon you've got a very good example of the Ito ( Odaware-Bushu) school. This looks to be in quite good condition and I'd suggest a bit better quality than the usual. As you may know, the Ito school is easily recognised by their use of extremely fine "thread" piercing but by the mid Edo period we begin to see a number of different style, this being one of them. I used to own a signed example by Ito Masakatsu ( 1650~1680 ) which exhibited exactly the same style of carving of the flowers, leaves and grasses as on your piece. Yours is, in my opinion, a finer example. The inlay work is a delicate touch and the various texture. such as the rush roof of the tea hut, the woven panel on the wall and the gnarled wooden posts are all very well rendered. I haven't seen enough work in this style by other members of the school to state categorically that this is also by Masakatsu but it is certainly a very fine example of their work. Very well done, Ford