christianmalterre

Dear Andrey, does this box really belong to this Tsuba? The Mei(if really a Mei) or better sayd actually the Signature on your´s plate does make me a bit distancing as it seems me on first sight to "clumpsy" or lavish for an Tsubashi of this caliber. I am not a Hoan collector but i do think just from sight of execution of your´s Tsubas Kanji you should be cautious. Katchushi and Tosho are generally not signed-also this style was out of order/vogue in those times this Tsubashi did work. General execution of Kozuka-Ana equally is not appropriate to it´s in box(declared)time i would say. But perhaps i am completely wrong here? Sorry-??? Christian

Thank you John, this is quite good remark-i do think so meanwhile-better sayd formerly had in mind this possibility already-too much similarities and All in same expressional (westernised)taste. Ukio-E also were not as high apperciated by the Japanese as nowtimes is generally thought.-the companies did on the other side. In mine eyes not per se a reputable Tsubashi-school-(in regard of the iron of all those pictured Tsuba)rather a country work like you find in later Tsuba-workmanship. Did you compare the Silversmiths work with Silversmiths work on decorative objects like vases,pipe-heads ect. you can see on same time-period products produced in Kyushu? I don´t know but if you have compare with the publications by Joly for example....??? Christian

Dear Ludolf, i do think that neither John nor Ford was willing to argue about any authenticity question or personal attribution-i think this is not the interest lying here in this treat. I do understand your´s feelings but also the distinct mentioned critisism. Perhaps it will help you in evaluation that i once 5 to 6 years ago had an NBTHK papered Kaneie Second generation Tsuba which i sold to an german NBTHK member/so eventually you know it?-This one had completely different characteristics in stylism(so not relevant at all) but also in iron-forge and iron appearence(relevant here)than the your´s topic-object but also the other mentioned one in an former treat on this forum. So i do understand the distancing. As already mentioned-this in mine eyes is a nice Tsuba but unfortunately not in mine focus as me i am a metallurgic-man. O.K.-This point i do hope does get clearer? Also to help in language-distincts: "Deckungsgleich" can be translatet as "similar". There are as far as i am apparent two possibilities to interprete/translate "Similar". One "Similar" can fairly be interpreted as "same",The second "Similar" can fairly be interpreted as "a sami kind of"..... The word "Deckungsgleich" is an old german word or prononciation which nowtimes only or mostly is used in academical language like you do find in some older art books or references. Antique Art Dealers,Scientists and Auction Houses for example like to use this expression as it lets space to not been fixed by law§. Deckungsgleich does not mean or can not be translated as Equal! Like in German:Das "Selbe" ist Nicht Das "Gleiche"! Also Deckungsgleich is a reference to specific points within one question on a similar or equal thematics on one specific treat or object. (This just in short for our´s non-german language knowledge(and mentality?) members :D What i do think is much more interesting is to find out better information on the question of metal-treatment involved and for which reason similarities appear striking in an very specific time-period of Japanese history. This is in mine eyes much more interesting and with your´s nice Tsuba we could perhaps find a way to get better insights? Christian

Dear John, i just think on the two East India companies influence-but here definitely i am shure you already did evaluate as this thematics is your´s personal-focus(reference on your´s excellent publication). All those Tsuba are in mine eyes not to be seen as a typical work of art or better said art-interpreted feeling in traditional Japanese art-understandment nor rather influenced by the mainstream of traditional Japanese thought or main-school. Rater conglomerates in stylism and intended expression due former late Edo understandment and foreign influence and resulting market-interest and trade. Also i do find it striking that this kind of Tsuba-Art mainly does seem to hit the foreign art taste-not the typical Japanese one. Maybe i am wrong here but in kind of metallurgical treatment this idea could touch the surface-think on Indian/Korean metallurgical treatments which begun much earlier than the Japanese you mention....? Christian

Hallo Ludolf, well,hard to say as this kind of Tsuba is not in mine focus-but it looks like as you mention. Either way-very nice! Did you compare the silver-workmanship with this schools normal or if used typical workmanship? On colour you can´t fix it but on the line-drawing..... Christian

Hi Steve, well-yes of course-you are definitely right here in citing Mr.Kremers written words and Mr.Sasanos in one similar point/quite normal as Mr.Kremers did longtime study and was an good friend of Mr.Sasano. In written words and explanation they both have the equal-same standpoint. What is striking on the other way is if talking personally Mr.Kremers does point out points which are not yet as strict to be followed as if you just read written words-where there´s no possibility to hear and discuss the prononciations "between the lines". The written is a sceletton like the beton-base of a new built house-project. What is important is but here the rest of material to evaluate so to later get appropriate character. (also please do never forget-that what is written is an momentanum standpoint of view and experience-but this also will eventually change with forthcomming study and increasing knowledge)(i am not shure if both of them would/had written the same now-and in 10 Years?) I personally would not take just one or two personal points of view as an entire fact but also hear from those which are equally experienced in "rust-prevention" like those both mentioned persons but do not take part in the mob of book-writing or www-forums. No question-the best prewared Tsuba are still in private possession and not in museum but this is an quite other thematics to think on-but here perhaps you do find an better answer. A very little bit of red-rust prevention is great/just and only take natural plant oil-that is quite enough-rub it with a fine and soft cloth and you will see-in time and after several applications this red rust will get automatically involved in an very attractive patina/and new red-rust is automatically prevented. Never use Brushes,Wax,Heat or Cold treatments and all those other nice ideas you fell over when you read all those "amateur-restaurator-conservator" posts. You will need much time and passion-but Hey-you do have it and those before us had it,too. We both do not have the need to hurry up There are so many former good preserved pieces destroid now-at least let´s keep those good ones we can get in their´s former and original preservation. My son is already getting very fascinated-let us see if he will follow-up? Chris

Hello, i just would like to join this post as i have seen quite much collections of Tsuba till yet and also do know several of those Tsuba which are mentioned here. in mine eyes-and this may seem very strict at first hand sight-nobody should do "anything" concerning playing/modeling on patina or eventually rust prevention. Everybody experienced will immediately see the difference. On Iron Tsuba there is definitely no need at all to clean-i don´t call up here for those bargain-or rubbish material you do find in hundreds in a certain two to three hundred-bucks level but those which are real collectors pieces. I am very certain that if you do have the possibility to buy a Nobuie or Shodai Kaneie with old and naturally patina and the same with artificially "rebuilt or prewared" patina you all would spent 1000$ more(at least) for the old untouched one. Not? Why else collectors are ready to pay a certain level if not collecting history for themself and the further generation of our´s childs? Christian By the way-did anybody of you-and here i am certain as all of you are very experienced collectors-play with different light circumstances(there are plenty different artificial lights and natural light you can play with)-when you do Kantei you will sometimes see a very variant spectrum of colours-here good iron and good old and natural patina(and rust)just beginns in showing it´s beauty. Unfortunately there are so much former very good pieces which had gone the "ebay-way" and have been cleaned(better said destroid and took off their´s charme in the last 20 to 30 years due good meant posts from experienced collectors but unfortunately destroid due the simple fact of good-meaning and making aware those all beginners about rust. Sometimes it would be better to be calm-like Kremers did mention so nice in his book-he had a certain reason behind.

Thank you Morita-San, so this means(in eventuallity that the treat-beginning firsts post Nakago A should be a faked one?) that i once owned a fake But O.K.-just keep :D Either way-great post! Christian

Dear Ken, you already did ask me on this sword-do you remember? I just told you to be cautious with this one and first had to verify yourself on those plenty pictures in the books i did recomment you to purchase first-Before you finally buy this blade. I had a certain reason why telling you this and also writing you that i´ve seen and studied the original smith-group or sub-school(who may bee seen in this sword perhaps) It does not make much sense in asking first-later getting an answer but to not verifying for oneself-I do know it is hard to keep a certain distance to all those different occuring interpretations but at least for such purpose books are published by very professional experts in their´s each propper field. I really hope you did not pay too much...... Sorry for those hard words but i know others would tell you the same. Christian

Dear gents, O.k.-i see-this is eventually mine mistake in judging just from the Oshigata-i just can´t see why such an new sword shall get an "Suri-Age-styled" Nakago with additional Mekugi-Ana-when i see such execution in Shinsaku-To i do get cautious. After seeing the photo now i think this execution of Nakago is intended due special reason the smith had. I would like to see the Boshi/Kissaki now-so to have a better chance to evaluate..... With the signature i still am very cautious..... Let me know(By the way-thank you for this post Ted-excellent comment! ) Christian

A is genuine and unaltered. B is(may be)genuine Japanese Sword but Suri-Age and Shin-Mei. (Have a close look-Identifiable on the execution of the Bo-Hi and distance to Mekugi-Ana to distance to Kanji) By the way-the Signature of B is also a correct one,-just not as usual expected by him.So-? Christian

Dear Ford, thank you for this better info! Yes,now i see in which direction you are heading-you wrote:The appreciation of these objects as real art. I'll note the schools and artists but mainly as a way of creating some context. As i think you will due the fact you did and still do research on the "Kinko direction"-will mainly focus on this sort of metalwork,material,technique,stylism and influence-Not? I can imagine-as this is your´s focus also seen in your´s art works. In this case this idea you have is definitely formidable as so far as i can consider your´s intention would be in every point of view an augmention. This is very good. In point of appreciation of "these objects" as real art i have to disagree a bit with your´s definition per se as as far as i do see mine very personal enthousiasm and also the "way" and "intersts" of collections from other collectors i think this is already fact and very well known since at least the beginnings of last century already. I do know Tosogu which is definitely in very same if not higher esteem in comparence to Nihon-To for art enthousiasts all over the world(not forcefully only Nihonto-and-related)but also art collectors in paintings,porcelain or furniture for example. Simply fact is that those "expressions" can be seen elsewhere,too-and so it´s very easy to appreciate even for "foreign art"-collectors. For creating an context you will have to go very deeply in each of the traditions first and later have to show the influences and effects they did create in their´s each proper time and intension. Here you will forcefully enter in an Sozio-Cultural-Aspect which(i just do allow me to say this)will definitely be very if not extremely hard to grap. You will have an enormous work in progress if you intend to stay and show neutral viewpoint. Very interesting at all! Let me know..... Very sincerely Christian

Dear Ford, so do i understand you right that you plan an similar blog like the one (for example) from Richard? Me personally I do not see much sense for this idea as those certain enthousiasts for Tosogo do already know where to meet and those seriously interested in Tosogu will certainly have best chances to get required information. So what shall an additional blog have for intention than the already known blogs which exist? (Please take this question as an simple question i do have-any critisism is definitely not intended and in sum i have nothing at all against any quality-blogs increasing collectors knowledge and open contacts to other collectors. Christian

Dear Marc, this is an Namban Tsuba with strong Nagasaki artists expression. The characters you speak and which are shown in "latinised" letters come from the Japanese prononciation of certain Kuden in traditional Ryu. This Tsuba was intended for someone not native Japanese but member or at least knowing some facts of the called Ryu. This was partially common and this tradition is also depicted in certain literature. If you do need further info please feel to contact me directly. Either way-not typical and quite uncommon but not totally strange. Christian Malterre