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I can see why so many were impressed by the Norishige tanto. Thanks once again to Mr Shiotsuna

I don't want to be that guy, and please correct me if I'm wrong but the wavy shinogi line in the nakago makes me a tad suspicious of this blades origin. There's also something off about the patina on the nakago, looks a little like it's been artificially aged. I hope I'm wrong and will defer to more experienced people but I can't shake the gut feeling that this is a modern reproduction.

Constructive criticism or comments are always welcome, no offense it taken. Just to address a few points above. Way back when we moved to this hosting, we already had well over 250K attachments. Now that number is likely far more than double. No mean feat to try and move hosting. It's not something you can quickly FTP across. I also want to host here in South Africa, so when I have an issue I can pick up a phone and actually call someone. Don't want to be tens of thousands of miles away speaking to a bot. Also, the cost of hosting overseas is more than we can bear, given the funds that come in. This attach has been inconvenient, but we will get through it, and things will get back to normal. If they don't, I'll look at other options. But again, everything comes down to money. The site is well known. Everywhere. Just type into any AI chat "What is the largest Japanese sword forum in the world" The problem is that many collectors are not young anymore. They prefer to collect in person, and many are old school. Even in Japan, it is hard to change that mindset. We would love more interaction, but people prefer what they know. The younger generation prefers Facebook...instant gratification even if the data is disposable and far less reliable. We have a good membership here, that ebbs and flows, but there is still more info stored here than anywhere else. I prefer to keep this mostly on topic. I don't want to cross over to the martial arts much. There are places for that, and they deal with it better than we can. We are about the study and preservation, not so much the use. Image uploading is more than sufficient. Really it is. We can't be expected to accommodate everyone who wants to take a 50MP photo on their phone and upload it directly. We don't need billboard size photos and people need to learn to crop and edit before they upload. Currently regular members can upload 3 megs per post. Since pics can easily be brought down to under 500kb, you are able to upload enough provided you aren't trying to upload pics that are several megs each. PLUS you can then reply and do more pics, with the same limit in that thread, adding more pics. If people want more per post then they can upgrade to Gold membership. There you are allowed 7.5MB per post. More than enough. Pic max sizing is ample to view only. We don't need to scroll several pages across to see everything. I think the post limits are more than enough if people learn free image resizing and learn a little about DPI and what is sufficient. As for the customizable feed, see my post above. This is easy and worth playing with. We will be going to new software by the end of the year and there will be many more features and changes, and I think everyone will benefit.

At the end of the day, the only thing that really matters is if you personally like the sword. As long as you are not going through this process expecting financial gain or a certain level of NBTHK papers, then you won't be disappointed.

Greetings everyone! Please see the attachments for a sword I have that was made in 1993 by sword smith Yamamura Takeshi (Soushu Tsunahiro: 24th generation Masamune). Sadly, Yamamura Tsunahiro passed away on Dec. 9 in 2023 at the age of 80. Best Regards, Robert

Without seeing the blade, there is at least one sign that "points" to it being fake. Look closely at the mei. You'll notice all of the characters have rounded ends on the strokes. This is clearly made by a rotary tool. If you see that, you know immediately it is fake. John C.

Has Jimmy seen the sword? Does he think it is Shinsa worthy? I would go with Jimmy’s assessment…

Hi again! I'm sorry if my first reply seemed impolite. I only compared your sword to other more easily accessible online sources, like Osaka Shinto Zufu, then came to my initial response. I should have explained my guess with more concrete evidence. Here are some examples from my copy of Shinkai Daikan. I'm not sure if this is against NMB's policy on intellectual property, and I would remove these if so : ( Notice that none of these signatures has this kind of chisel strokes sticking out on the top of the 井 character, a Tekuse (手癖, an act of habit, in this case, when chiseling signatures), no doubt, by the counterfeiter. It's always just two lines from top to bottom in the 井 character with genuine Shinkai's work. So yes, I would agree this is not a Gimei (fake signature) of maximum effort, unfortunately. (The wavy shinogi line and off-looking patina are also telltale signs, as said above.) Edits: Anyway, let's not get hung up on this Mei (signature). This still could be a nice sword in many other aspects. To tell the quality of the work, however, requires much better photos of the sword. I think there are many guidelines on how to take pictures of a Japanese sword on this forum, it's just I can't find any now orz

Unfortunately what you appear to have is a relatively recent sword (late 19th century to early 20th century) where fairly poor pieces (by Japanese standards) were made for export to foreigners. They often feature elaborate (but simple) Koshirae that would appeal to the foreign buyers with little knowledge who bought up all sorts of Samurai wares to decorate rooms or whatnot.

SASANO-SENSEI used pointed tools made of antler, bone, ivory or bamboo to scrape off red rust on iron TSUBA (see below). He also exposed TSUBA to humid air by hanging them out on a string. After some time, he rubbed them with clean cotton and carried them for a long while in the pockets of his trousers. He said the moisture evaporating from the body and the very light rubbing of the fabric resulted in a good and natural patina. On the other hand, Mrs. SASANO was angry with him about that method as she had to mend his worn-through pockets ever and ever again! He also recommended to handle iron TSUBA with bare hands while soft metal TSUBA should be handled with cotton gloves.

I'll admit that I was confused by your original post and reply too, as so much ground was covered historically and geographically that it was not easy for me to formulate any kind of consistent reply. At the propect of all or nothing, I kind of gave up. By the same token, this was a subject that I had not really thought about. Some self-defense requires use of the pommel, and it was also pushed with the left (armo(u)red) hand on occasion. It makes sense that the kashira pommel in particular would have taken repeated knocks when either worn, in action or in transit, and anything truly artistic could have been spoiled or ruined. Horn and iron would show less damage at first glance than soft, delicate (precious) metals, and scratched or chipped horn could be rounded off and buffed out.

Hello Khalid, it is really difficult to judge a sword for shinsa without having it in hand. There is no such thing as a papering advantage because this has the mei of two smiths. As this practice was not uncommon in the Shinto period. First the signature needs to be authentic, and then the overall quality has to be of a certain level for it to receive papers. It is best to have it seen in person by an experienced collector or dealer, who either has submitted to shinsa themselves or knows people personally who do so. I am assuming that you are talking about this sword previously discussed: I will not comment on the signature as I do not have as much experience with Shinto pieces. But I can say that achieving anything above Tokubetsu Hozon will be very unlikely. Again, I think this sword should be seen in hand, this can even be done before polishing. This will ensure you get a proper idea of it will pass shinsa or not. Greetings, Lex

Update. I've decided to just go ahead and ship the swords to me. It would have been nice to have the wood work done, but it looks like the craftsmen they usually work with are old, unwell, and taking time off for health reasons, so I'd be looking at another year minimum. And the people saying don't... were mostly correct about their reasons. But I'm used to having things made and (mostly) don't mind the expense too much. I swore I'd never buy another sword in shirasaya... and then I bought another sword in shirasaya. I've had a lot of scabbards made in my life though. I got used to having them made while collecting modern European swords. I have two Albion sword scabbards from Christian Fletcher (if any of you know that name) I have a Angus Trim sword scabbard from Valiant arms, and really need another one for another of his swords... Having a Tsuka made I've only done once though... but I'm sure I will have more made in the future. It will be when I have all my fittings ready though.

I visited the exhibition second time this morning, as I will head out to other parts of Japan. Some additional thoughts. Unfortunately that is wrong Norishige Lewis. That is displayed as it has been donated by Nara Iwao to the museum recently. It is Jūyō Bijutsuhin and nice sword. However in my personal opinion the one passing Tokubetsu Jūyō is far better tantō, just a personal judgement. Nara Iwao donated spectacular items to NBTHK. In my personal opinion the hira-zukuri wakizashi by Yosōzaemon Sukesada he donated was every bit as good as TJ swords on display. Also I really liked the Fujiwara Nagasada katana that was dated 1868 that he donated. In my eyes it was very good sword, now it would never be "high ranked" but I dont care about that at all. *edit* forgot to add that the Tsunahiro wakizashi he donated was amazing. The Yasumitsu is one of my favorite items on the display. Even though it is slim and slender in form while I usually prefer the big monster swords. I am not sure if there will be photos of it as photography isnt allowed for TJ items. It is very recent Jūyō, passing in 71, so when they release the book there will be bit more info on the sword. I really don't like the extreme closeups as to me they are not something I personally see when looking at item, and I am not one seeking extremely fine details. Of course I understand that some people love these extreme details. I saw few Japanese with big cameras shooting closeup shots of the few reference items that were allowed to photography. When I am at home next month I should be able to match the majority of the swords to Jūyō level sessions. For the few mumei items I might need to wait until TJ book is released so I can match the item side by side. *edit* While I understand the multiple tier process I am not a fan of it. All of the items that passed the TJ shinsa are incredible items and display characteristic traits and experts would most likely identify them easily. If you would see any of these items with Hozon papers for example you wouldn't think about the paper level but how incredible the actual item is. I think it can be sometimes bit misleading as we talk a lot about these tier levels while I think the actual item would be more important focus point.

Further reading shows that 俦 can be read in names as either 'tomo', 'toshi', or 'hisa'. (光俦 can also apparently be read as 'Kōzaki', but probably not relevant here.) In the listing below, going by alphabetical order, ‘Mitsutomo’ (9th from right) seems to be the suggested reading. 古今金工全集 by 清水澄

No doubt about the subject matter in this instance! Though the description of "Carp" might be questioned? [that is an ugly fish IMHO] OTSUKI MITSUOKI: A SUPERB INLAID IRON TSUBA WITH EBISU AND CARP, DATED 1803 Sold for €4,160 The image taken from a Japanese book I have - unfortunately not in colour and the shape of the guard is different. The design is not uncommon. From Google translate [very poor]. Ebisu is implied by his absence on the guard.

You might like to invest in a book titled Uchigatana Koshirae which is a Tokyo National Museum exhibition catalog. illustrated are relatively undisturbed, documented koshirae that are preserved in shrines, temples, museums, and private collections, many were the property of famous Buke. Timeframe is Muromachi to early Edo. Here is an ad on Grey Doffin's site, he may be able to find you one. https://japaneseswordbooksandtsuba.com/store/book/fittings-books/b734-uchigatana-koshirae-with-translation-by-tokyo-national-museum-2/ Or, maybe post a want ad on NMB. Roundabout to the point. The majority of these uchigata tsuka had horn kashira and a metal fuchi. As you observed, early metal pommels were frequently of the kabuto-gane form that comes from tachi koshirae. The flat, artisticaly carved kashira are more prevelent from the early-mid Edo period onward. There are some exceptions to matchy-matchy fuchi-gashira, deliberately mis-matched sets are sometimes seen in Edo period Higo koshirae and Owari koshirae as a design choice. That said, your suspicion about kashira falling off because the wrap broke, or discarded because of damage is probably correct.

Buying a blade is completely a personal thing. I like the idea that the blade chooses the owner rather than the other way round. As such one blade that tickles the fancy of one person may not tickle the fancy of others. I for example am a Soshu fan (probably the most popular category of sword collector) and others think Soshu is nice but prefer the more obscure smiths like @Jussi Ekholm. Some love blades according to their rating preferring the higher grade blades, whilst other prefer the provenance or the story behind the blade and still others (probably most again) just fall in love with the look of the blade or the smith. I can completely understand that when you start looking your list can contain blades that stretch from 1-35 million Yen. This is where the study and research into each smith starts and as such it is the start of a wonderful journey. If you do have big money available to spend then it is certainly worth being patient - there are a lot of good blades out there and the best are listed for only a short time or through friends of friends. Don't let that money burn a hole in your pocket. Find out what/who you like. Keep your ear to the ground (ask those more connected to do the same.) Follow the great apps like NihontoWatch by @Hoshi. Please do continue to share and ask questions. DM those in the community members who show the most knowledge around what you are looking at... Getting an opinion like @Andrew Ickeringill is also really worth it if you are keen on a blade. His keen eye after years of polishing great blades will give you an honest review. I can promise you most in this community are willing to share their knowledge and will help point you in the right direction. There is a blade waiting for you and I can promise you when you see it you will know. Your journey will lead you there. Excited for you bud.

Hi George, Having koshirae made for a blade in shirasaya is a common desire of beginning collectors and it is almost always a bad idea. Let's say you spend $2,000 for the blade in shirasaya and another $4,000 for the kodogu and labor necessary to make the koshirae. When you are done, if the blade is nice and the koshirae is well done, you should have no trouble selling the set for $3,000 or so. When a collector wants a blade and koshirae, he wants period koshirae, not something put together yesterday by a western collector. If the aim is to have a nice blade in or with koshirae, that is what you should buy to begin with. If you want koshirae to go with your blade in shirasaya, consider buying an existing koshirae mounted on tsunagi (wood blade) to display next to your blade in shirasaya. The blade won't fit in the koshirae but it is best kept in its shirasaya anyway. This will cost much less than having koshirae made. My 2 cents, Grey

some more

Indeed; I would follow Jimmy Hayashi's in-hand advice over all else

The different colours are achieved via a boiling process in a carefully formulated patinating fluid (once they have been meticulously cleaned and prepared) The different alloys assume their respective oxide colours all at the same time due to their differing alloy compositions. Shakudo….bluey black, copper….reddish brown, shibuichi……greyish tones. Gold and silver do not react and retain their original colour. Thats a very brief outline of a very skilled and complex procedure.

Posted previously but tried to get better photos. Emphasis on tried! Obv a Tachi and believe the Mei to be Kuni-something toshi,tomo. It appears to have a straight hamon. I cant tell what kind of hada this is. Also why does it reduce my image size everytime I try to post?

Gents. Thanks for your swift replys. Yes sorry - it was the Tokugawa Clan. I have no papers on it - it was bought at an international auction in Copenhagen some years back. It seems to have a very fine and almost straight hamon. The blade is appr. 71 cm long. Best regards Peter

You probably mean the Tokugawa clan, like royalty in Japan.

Hi! This is signed by 井上真改 Inoue Shinkai, a swordsmith who worked from 1648 to 1682, the date should be on the back if there is one. However, the signature does not look genuine. Does this sword come with an NBTHK Hozon paper or above?

You may be looking too far ahead and counting your chickens before they are hatched. A katana? The immediate decision is whether to have this blade polished and would it be worth the considerable cost. A joint work is however a nice little background bonus.

It was me. Your original topic was an interesting one…..perceived shortage of kashira….possible reasons…..different types of kashira (or Kabuto gane) and their place in history etc but you lost me when you started talking about and imaging non Japanese scabbards, wood vs metal scabbards etc…..which were irrelevant to the topic (imo) , but that’s just me, no offence intended. Also worth remembering that there are very few pre Edo koshirae or even components thereof kicking around on the market compared to the more intricate Edo developments. You are going back over 400 years with massive changes in fashion in the meantime so no surprise that a lot has been lost to time in Japan for a variety of reasons.

Another example pretty close to the original image.

光俦 = Mitsutomo

Mitsutoshi - 光寿 est correct (peut-être que je ne comprends pas la demande...)

Several new Koshirae added to the site. You can see them here: https://yakiba.com/koshirae/

Urushi is best left as it is because it is very hard and inert. It is normally dark brown or black, not clear. Also, on old iron fighting tsuba, urushi may have been the original finish and should not be disturbed. Bob Haynes once told me "they were too busy killng each other to bother with an artistic patina" I suspect many of the the kotosho and kokatchushi tsuba were oil blackened, meaning they were heated up and then brushed with oil and the process repeated until a dark, polymerized oil surface was created, Quick and easy. Sometimes this polymerised layer is mistaken for urushi, but it will come off with solvents. Akiyama goes into the various vegatable oils that were used on iron tsuba as preservative and appearance changers in one of his Token Kai Shi articles, so I think the application of oil was commonly done. What we call patina is a mixture of iron oxides, dirt, oil, and hand grease. Sasano advocated that this top layer be removed by scraping with deer antler and then the remaining fine particle magnetite be polished by rubbing with a cloth, resulting in a glossy surface. After he died, the fashion flipped and high level iron tsuba collectors valued "undisturbed looking" patina rather than cleaned up and polished. One of the downsides of cleaned up and polished is that these tsuba can easily attract rust, so they need to be periodically monitored and maintained, and ideally not handled with bare fingers. Rust never sleeps.

Recently browsing these forums I found the webpage of one of Ford Hallam's students, Marcus Chambers, who won an award for a very impressive Tsuba featuring a red Sea Bream. I'd never seen a Tsuba like it. When one by Ito Masanori came up on Nihonto watch, I imagined I was seeing the inspiration for the work. Except when I returned to the former page, I found he was attributing the inspiration to another artist. He states it is an utsushi of a work by Murakami Jochiku. Now, worried that it might be an error of etiquette to post an image of a work by a living artist who I know posts on these forums, I won't post that picture (and also file size limits) and will instead link to his page.) https://www.marcuschambersmetalarts.com/murakamijochikuutsushi2015 These Tsuba strongly stand out to me as impressive work because of how the natural colors of the metals create strong contrast against each other, and so I'm curious to learn more about them. Were they especially uncommon? https://www.samurai-nippon.net/SHOP/VT-050.html I also recently saw a tsuba on yahoo, (with all the gimei implications thereof) which states it once had old papers, but the old papers were lost.... but the item in the images is quite striking, if a little busy. Does this count as a Ebitsu Tsuba? It shares a large red fish in the lower right quadrant but the rest of the Tsuba is covered in other sea creatures. I'm actually rather tempted to risk a bid, but I think by the time you read this it will have grown to a higher price then I'd be prepared to gamble. Note that I'm at my file size limit, and will try to put the other side in a reply to this topic. The other side has many small sea creatures on it, including an octopus that stretches around the side. This Tsuba is claimed to be a work by several well known (and chatgpt tells me, faked...) artisans. Curious about the opinion of the forum. https://buyee.jp/item/jdirectitems/auction/g1232665903?lang=en&rc=yaucc https://auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/g1232665903

The Musashi Masamune has strong points and weak areas. It is not all exceptional. Having said that, I liked it more when I saw it in April versus a few years ago when I was rather unimpressed with it.

Oh, actually @Jussi Ekholm if it passed Juyo at 71, it was the same Yasumitsu that was on display at the 71st Juyo exhibition when I visited earlier this year. In that case, I have already seen it (I think?), and it already passed TokuJu. That is pretty awesome. That was a great sword indeed.

Two very rare Edo period smiths make for a really attractive signature and its unlikely to be faked. However, quite possibly it is otherwise just average Ishido(?) sword, attractive but not more than that. If its not, that would be an exception rather than a rule.

It is 3 megs per post. So maybe you already uploaded other pics in that post with a total over 3.

Price lowered to 3000 EURO

Hi Jedediah, in this price range you have a lot of choices. You should more narrow down, what you like. I like this article: https://www.toukentakarado.com/collecting-nihonto-how-to-begin-and-develop-your-taste-1 Regards Oli

My face when they tell me not to have a Koshirae made...

Oh nice! I bought Markus Sesko's book on Koshirae, and immediately after found out he sells a more extensive e-book version and wrote to him to buy one, but I never heard back. It's possible the mail was eaten by the internet. Sadly I find it somewhat difficult to focus on the page these days.... (this is I suspect partly the result of a many things, and a great pain for once I never went anywhere without a book... I've had to turn to audiobooks to get my book time in these days.) I'll write to Mr Doffin, but in the meanwhile does anyone have anything like an ISBN number for this volume? I might be able to find it on a used book site. Very true, and very sad. Almost no Greek statues (in bronze) survive for this reason. Some of the ones that do were lost at sea. --- BTW, who was confused about my reply above talking about scabbard reinforcements and the romance of older styles? Only *react* is a confused face.... seems straight forward enough to me... Did I fumble a sentence?

George that’s very true. She needs to first of all find someone to provide an accurate evaluation of each sword. I have some information about one of her ancestors that I plan to show her on Saturday. Right now she doesn’t have enough info to make an informed decision. This will take some time and effort on her part

Bruce, Thank you. I've been doing a lot of digging on it. "IF" all turns out to be correct 1st generation Yamato Masanori dated 1601 combined in a 1830's Masamitsu ensemble I'll be a very happy camper even though it is not verified. Another Vet bring home. Best

Many of the really early iron TSUBA like KO TOSHO or KO KACHUSHI were lacquered black from the beginning. Remains of the lacquer can sometimes be seen on them still today. Calabrese, you asked: ....Just for my personal edification, if it were urushi, how does it get removed, im assuming from your previous comment, acetone may not be enough.... Old URUSHI is something very resistant and cannot be removed easily. You will have to grind it off which is often not possible in case the surface is not completely even. Another possibility is heat. While URUSHI is relatively heat resistant up to more than 100°C, it will disintegrate with temperatures exceeding 200 - 300°C like any other form of plastic or organic substance. Thank you for showing the MYOCHIN TSUBA in full. It does not look cast to me at all.

Below in a quote box I put the text of the seller, edited for length.

Some more photos of Futasuji-hi Sadamune. Special thanks to, 畳@孖っコぐらし.

Thanks Mauro. One I have that I would class as Awa.

Thank you guys for all info.' Here some pictures of the tsuka from the same koshirae as the tsuba.

Ah thank you! That is awesome. And you're quite correct about preservation, but I've seen enough eccentric ones (from what we in the west consider 'default') to see that there's most certainly currents and styles and so on. I don't have tremendous time at this moment, but when I was in Nagoya a bit over a year ago and I saw all the styles of armor they have on display (One of the best displays I've ever seen, not well advertised) they also had a room full of sword styles which demonstrated more differences, even what is close to an Oakeshott typology of Japanese swords. This is mostly a devolopment over time of course, but still fascinating. We might see very small but very important differences between different areas, just as we would expect to see siginficant differences at income levels, with the richer Lords having golden Tsuba and the poor man having plain iron, and red copper in the middle. WE might find that colored saya were extremely trendy in this place, but that place they aren't. That red copper Tsuba (which stay copper) are usually matched to grip color ABC and that color XYZ is rarely used with an iron tsuba, except in dce province. Personally I suspect something like a plain handachi was the most popular of all time, since it gave good protection for least money, but it's still a subject I hope to dive into more deeply now that some of the books have arrived. You also have the weird stuff, like this fish one, or the 'shrimp' koshrae, or the ones that end in a 'BIG" scabbard end cap. Here's two (I really have to run in a sec,) that could be called 'default' in the minddle, but they also have distinct differecnes. Should we class them as seperate styles or branches of a single style? Lastly is one of those end caps I mentioned. Sorry this isn't an ideally formatted post, dentist!